English Standard Version ?

Wow! And folks say that the "KJVO's" are hateful and spreaders of poison,go figure...

 

CONCLUSION: Anti-KJVOs demand KJVOs prove their doctrine from scripture, whilst they merrily refuse to do the same. One rule for them; another for us. What did the pot say to the kettle?

 

Publisher. Crossway is the only publisher of it and many have said the quality of the Bible is not good. Mine is fine, I have a genuine leather one. However, Crossway can't advertise it such as someone like Zondervan did with the NIV (and still does). So it will take a while probably for it to catch on, but I think the translation itself is superior to the NIV, and is much better than most other translations out there.

Neal

 

I have offered much proof that the prophets, Jesus, and the apostles quote from versions of Scripture that are not the KJV, thus providing unequivocal proof that the KJV is not the only word of God. Your problem with proof is not mine. I have offered biblical proof of my position. It is the other side that has not offered the proof.

 

Would you please re-post these "proofs?"

 

In Luke 4, Christ quoted from what was most likely the Septuagint. It may have been an Aramaic translation or it may have been Hebrew. Whatever it was, it was not the KJV. In Paul's writings, he often quotes from an OT text that was not the KJV. The author of Hebrews cites a notable passage that Jacob leaned on his staff (Heb 11:37) when the OT says that he leaned on the head of his bed (Gen 47:31). Paul calls the Scriptures that Timothy had the "Holy Scriptures" when he knew good and well that Timothy did not have the KJV.

All of this evidence points to the fact that the KJV is not the only word of God. It shows unequivocally that things that are different that the KJV can rightly be called the word of God and can be used authoritatively.

This seems obvious to most people but the implications of it are unfortunately missed by a few. The teaching of Scripture is clear: Things different than the KJV can be called the word of God and can be preached and taught with authority.

 

I had never even heard of the ESV untill I read about it on this board. I will consider it. I am very picky about things and it doesn't take much for me to reject a version. In the last 30 years I have only accepted the KJV and the NASB as trustworthy and use other versions only as I would a reference book for getting other opinions. Sometimes I take another versions "take" on a verse because it seems to fit better than another one. But, it takes a pretty good translation for me to accept it as a whole as trustworthy. This was a mean thread wasn't it?

 

Start tying to have a simple conversation re Bible
versions, and invariably, someone will come on
and make it a "mean thread." Same thing with
Calvinism and with Arminianism. One cannot even
get simple information, or voice an idea, without
it turning into an all-out brawl.

It is tiresome. Many of the questions I came to
BB about remain unasked because of this.

 

Crossway is a lousy Bible publisher. The leather they use is awful. Hopefully, they'll catch on.

Abyiah, don't let people hijack your questions. Ask them, then let the moderators sift out the chaff.

 

Tom Vols, you are absolutely right. This is why it's personally been difficult to switch to the ESV, as Crossway's publishing to date just doesn't hold a candle to the NASB publisher, Foundation (my personal 2nd favorite translation).

Hopefully, the upcoming editions, esp. the larger print wider margin ref. Bible due out in a few weeks will show improvement. Otherwise, it's time for more publishers to take over, IMHO.

 

Interesting that you bring up Foundation. I think they have a bit to be desired as well, although they are not as stingy as Crossway is and their bindings are better. Still, I have one of the first Foundation Press NASB95 updates. It is far better than the subsequent editions.

 

Bartholomew said:

CONCLUSION: Anti-KJVOs demand KJVOs prove their doctrine from scripture, whilst they merrily refuse to do the same.

Not so. I am not proving any doctrine. I am merely disputing the truth of yours.

As the saying goes, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Since it is the KJV-onlyists who are making "extraordinary claims" about the KJV, it is up to them to prove them.

 

It is not ALL KJVOs, let's remember! There are a
great many KJVOs who have carefully stated their
positions without rancor. While the others are
merely irritating to me, and at times somewhat
humorous, these embarrass the thoughtful and
godly KJVOs, I am sure.

 

I'm hoping the ESV Deluxe will be a much
better Bible. We are going to have to be
patient with Crossway; they are new to
Bible publishing. I know that the print
in the ESV One Year Bible is
much better than in other editions.
I am using it this year in my devotions.

Clay

 

I am sorry that this kind of 'attitude' is seen on this Board. (I must admit that I too have 'blown up' a couple of times on this board, and will try not to in the future) Generally, people have been kind to this 'outsider' (Anglican/Episcopalian). However, I suppose, even if we are right about a particular matter, we can be 'wrong' in the way, the tone in which we present it. Religion is a very-passionate thing to most people, in fact, for most people in this world. Families divide and countries war over it. Blood has been spilled. It would be nice if people could disagree 'graciously'. We are all 'brothers and sisters in Christ' are we not??? Then if we are to disagree, let's try and do so in a gracious way.

[ January 30, 2003, 04:41 PM: Message edited by: Jude ]

 

Initial popularity doesn’t always indicate the worth of a translation, the KJV had a rather rough start too.

I must say I feel very liberal today! I just received my copy of the ESV from CBD today. (Black letter version, genuine leather, Burgundy, with imprinted name).
My old Inductive NAS Bible hardback was wearing out and I began looking around to purchase another Bible. I can’t say I enjoyed all of what I read in this thread, but the thread influenced my decision.

I’ve never owned a genuine leather Bible before (rather extravagant).
I’ve never imprinted my name on a Bible before, (on a whim I did).

It looks great! I’m totally impressed with the quality of the binding and the leather. I’ve always liked my Bible in black, but I like the particular burgundy color (like I said, I’m going liberal).

The print is a little small for my eyes but comparing it to some other Bibles in my house it is average sized. (Next time I’ll have to graduate to LARGE a print version).
I like the black-text version too. It was great that I could choose one or the other. I never would have bought the ESV if I had to pick a red-text version. Too hard to read… and am I supposed to believe that the red-text parts are more important than the black-text just because the words are from Jesus? It’s all God’s Word! It’s all important! Anyway black-text just my preference.

My new ESV Bible is a good size for caring around and reading but I must note that there is no room for notes. A wide margin version will be needed in the future. Yet the Bible also came with software so I can use the ESV for study. The software installs directly into the hard drive so I don’t need to use a CD with each use. Since much of my Bible study is now done on my computer perhaps I won’t be marking and taking notes as much as I have done in the past. I can do it on my computer version. Maybe this will compensate for the lack of note taking space.

Lastly, from what I have read so far I like it. Gotta go and give it a further test run.

Rob

 

There will be a wider margin ESV
in March.

Clay

 

Actually that depends where you live.

If you live in England then copying the KJV without prior permission of the publishers is actually High Treason which is a capital offence ... (I know, I distributed the KJV and they contacted me ...)

DAB

I can use the entire KJB text as I see fit and not get sued.

You can not use the entire text of your Bible-like books and not get sued because the companies who made them said..."Those are our words, if you use them, you gotta pay us". Why would God restrict how much of His words you can use? </font>[/QUOTE]

 

[/QB][/QUOTE]

Gee, I don't see the KJV only crowd pointing out your error. Maybe it is because they do not have an answer.

It doesn't matter, no amount of facts will ever persuade them of their false doctrine.

 

The Deluxe ESV will be available on
March 7th.

Clay