Eschatology Agnostics

[robycop3]

While we do not agree with everything, you do present a good case. Since you know your history pretty well, I have a question. When did you learn about the Jewish War and the destruction of Jerusalem? I had never heard of these events until around 10 or 12 years ago. Do you think this history is pretty well-known, or is it something that we just happen to stumble upon?

I began reading encyclopediae at an early age, & have always been interested in history. I an age 70 & have perhaps 60 years of studying history, especially the history of wars. I was a USN corpsman, (1966-70) did a tour on land in Nam, & really studied wars then.

I also studied a lot about the Caesars & great Roman generals.

I believe most Christians, & many non-Christians, especially Muslims, knew J & the temple were destroyed in 70 AD. (You might read up about that entire campaign. It was a series of events.)

 

[robycop3]

Do you believe the other 10 tribes will eventually return to Israel? While I don't believe 1948 was prophecy fulfilled, I do believe God has never taken His hand off Israel. I've heard of amazing things that happened during the 6 Day War of 1967. Also, it's certainly no small thing that Jerusalem has been restored as the capital.

Clearly, the hand of God is evident from the founding of modern Israel thru now. And God said He will make Judah & Israel one nation again, so I believe the other tribes' IDs will become known to them, & they'll join the Jews.

Here's a little aside, another prophecy that's being fulfilled RIGHT NOW ! !
Isaiah 19:17 The land of Judah will become a terror to Egypt; everyone to whom it is mentioned will be in dread of it, because of the purpose of the Lord of hosts which He is purposing against them.

See how LITERAL Biblical prophecy is? I believe you know that whenever one of the 6 million Jews in Israel rattles his Uzi, the 80 million Egyptians shake in their turbans. Israel has kicked their cans hard, twice, & they don't want a third one! Please read all of Isaiah 19 to see how this will turn out!

 

[church mouse guy]

Clearly, the hand of God is evident from the founding of modern Israel thru now. And God said He will make Judah & Israel one nation again, so I believe the other tribes' IDs will become known to them, & they'll join the Jews.

Here's a little aside, another prophecy that's being fulfilled RIGHT NOW ! !
Isaiah 19:17 The land of Judah will become a terror to Egypt; everyone to whom it is mentioned will be in dread of it, because of the purpose of the Lord of hosts which He is purposing against them.

See how LITERAL Biblical prophecy is? I believe you know that whenever one of the 6 million Jews in Israel rattles his Uzi, the 80 million Egyptians shake in their turbans. Israel has kicked their cans hard, twice, & they don't want a third one! Please read all of Isaiah 19 to see how this will turn out!

Even worse, there has not been a prince in Egypt for eons as God said there would not be and they are actually ruled by Muslims with their old world just ruins.

Ezekiel 30:13 (KJV) Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also destroy the idols, and I will cause [their] images to cease out of Noph; and there shall be no more a prince of the land of Egypt: and I will put a fear in the land of Egypt.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Six Hour Warning
This thread will be closed sometime after 6:30 AM Pacific.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Several things wrong here but it will have to wait till tomorrow. I can see that you clearly do not understand preterism.

Oh my lol

 

[asterisktom]

Unfortunately, many prets have placed the words of their gurus such as Preston, Gentry, Alcazar, etc. over the words of GOD. even when Scripture PLAINLY proves those gurus wrong, as in this case!

An ironic and incorrect statement. It is the Bible that convinced me of preterism. Read the OP. That was the whole point. I was trying to hose out years of Hal Lindsey and the rest. Something you should try.

 

[asterisktom]

I am still waiting to see all that historical evidence that AD 70 had the resurrection of all the saints in Christ, and Jesus sat up His Kingdom here!

What are you looking for? The Bible was all written before the event, but it is clearly foretold there. And it was to happen in that generation. There are about 4 or 5 dozen clear statements that limit the time of that event to the 1st century. And you want skip over the Bible and give other sources precedence?

 

[asterisktom]

NEWP!
Jesus ended it at the 'Last Supper' as I showedya from Scripture. However, the Orthodox Jews don't believe He is Messiah & still live under the OC. They plan to resume animal sacrifices when they build their new temple.



Sorry, Sir, but all your points are WRONG. The OC was already "officially" over, as I showedya from Scripture, but the Jews didn't believe it, & still don't. The 3rd temple must be built for the AOD to occur. There were NO images of the emperor set up in the temple; the Romans simply destroyed it, seeking gold said to have been cached between its stones. And the "great trib" HASN'T YET OCCURRED! the proof for that is EASY! Just read Matt. 24:29-30!

**PRETERISM - PHONY AS A FORD CORVETTE!**

There will no longer be another temple that matters to God. For something to be abominated it has to first be valid in the eyes of God. The final A of D happened in AD70.

Also the Old Covenant was still partially in effect in the transition period. This is shown by Paul's taking a vow in Acts. And why Hebrews said it was "fading away". The actual end was marked by the destruction of the Temple.

 

[robycop3]

An ironic and incorrect statement. It is the Bible that convinced me of preterism. Read the OP. That was the whole point. I was trying to hose out years of Hal Lindsey and the rest. Something you should try.

No, not at all. Scripture shapes history, not vice versa, and there's simply NO historical record of the eschatological prophecies being fulfilled yet. You simply CANNOT avoid that fact.

If you still believe they HAVE already occurred, you should be able to tell us:

1.) the name of the "beast/antichrist",
2.) the name of the false prophet,
3.) what the marka the beast looked like,
4.) when all life in the4 sea died,
5) when all green grass was burned up

among other prophesied events. We plainly see that the prophecies of the Olivet Discourse that HAVE come to pass, have done so LITERALLY, TO THE LETTER, so how can anyone deny the rest won't cometa pass just-as literally, matter-of-factly, and exactly?

Again, if they'd already happened, history would NOT have missed them ! !

 

[asterisktom]

Jesus did not slay Nero at His second coming, as that event has not yet happened!

Read the verse more carefully. Neo died at the "brightness " of his coming. At the very beginning of these events he took his own life. There is too much here to thumb tap on my phone. I hope to start a new thread soon.

 

[asterisktom]

No, not at all. Scripture shapes history, not vice versa, and there's simply NO historical record of the eschatological prophecies being fulfilled yet. You simply CANNOT avoid that fact.

If you still believe they HAVE already occurred, you should be able to tell us:

1.) the name of the "beast/antichrist",
2.) the name of the false prophet,
3.) what the marka the beast looked like,
4.) when all life in the4 sea died,
5) when all green grass was burned up

among other prophesied events. We plainly see that the prophecies of the Olivet Discourse that HAVE come to pass, have done so LITERALLY, TO THE LETTER, so how can anyone deny the rest won't cometa pass just-as literally, matter-of-factly, and exactly?

Again, if they'd already happened, history would NOT have missed them ! !

You keep looking for physical fulfillments of apocalyptic prophecies. Look at the Old Testament. How many times have the hills melted, God ride a chariot, etc?

You are responding just like the first century Jews. They kept looking for literal fulfillments and missed out on the spiritual realities.

 

[robycop3]

There will no longer be another temple that matters to God. For something to be abominated it has to first be valid in the eyes of God. The final A of D happened in AD70.

No, it DIDN'T! No evil world ruler set up his statue in it & proclaimed himself God. And the only Roman official who could possibly have entered the temple was Titus, & it's well-known Titus worshipped the Roman pantheon of gods. And there's no record that he did enter the temple. And hecertainly didn't issue any "marka the beast"!

Also the Old Covenant was still partially in effect in the transition period. This is shown by Paul's taking a vow in Acts. And why Hebrews said it was "fading away". The actual end was marked by the destruction of the Temple.

No, it wasn't! NOT ONCE did Jesus tell anyone He saved to go sacrifice an animal! And He plainly introduced the NC at the "Last Supper"! And what was fading away was the CEREMONIAL pare of the OC. Its AUTHORITY was already ended. However, to this day, the Orthodox Jews continue to worship according to it. (Not for one nanosecond am I saying that's CORRECT; I'm just reminding people that the practices are still being observed.)

 

[robycop3]

Read the verse more carefully. Neo died at the "brightness " of his coming. At the very beginning of these events he took his own life. There is too much here to thumb tap on my phone. I hope to start a new thread soon.

No!

When general Galba overthrew Nero, he sent men to arrest Nero. When those men were approaching, Nero had his secretary Epaphroditus stab him with a sword. Galba's men tried to save his life, but failed. Nero's last words were,"What an artist dies with me!" Those words & his death were recorded by both Epaphroditus and Galba's men.

Now, several posts back, I posted a series of Scriptural criteria for the beast/antichrist that Nero did not meet. In fact, Hitler came closer than Nero did in fulfilling them. BUT THE TRUE BEAST MUST FULFILL ALL THOSE CRITERIA EXACTLY, TO THE LETTER! He simply has NOT yet been made manifest!

 

[robycop3]

You keep looking for physical fulfillments of apocalyptic prophecies. Look at the Old Testament. How many times have the hills melted, God ride a chariot, etc?

You are responding just like the first century Jews. They kept looking for literal fulfillments and missed out on the spiritual realities.

The prophesied events of the Olivet Discourse, as well as those Gabriel gave to Daniel have cometa pass LITERALLY, TO THE LETTER. There's simply NO legitimate excuse to believe the rest won't be fulfilled JUST-AS-LITERALLY.

 

[asterisktom]

"And what was fading away was the CEREMONIAL pare of the OC.

There are no two parts to the Law. That is a convenient fiction. Give me a single verse that teaches this. There is no ceremonial part of the Law. There is only Law or no Law.

 

[asterisktom]

There are no two parts to the Law. That is a convenient fiction. Give me a single verse that teaches this. There is no ceremonial part of the Law. There is only Law or no Law.

'Time for breakfast. I probably won't get back to this in time.

 

[church mouse guy]

There will no longer be another temple that matters to God. For something to be abominated it has to first be valid in the eyes of God. The final A of D happened in AD70.

Also the Old Covenant was still partially in effect in the transition period. This is shown by Paul's taking a vow in Acts. And why Hebrews said it was "fading away". The actual end was marked by the destruction of the Temple.

The end of Judaism was Good Friday!

 

[robycop3]

There are no two parts to the Law. That is a convenient fiction. Give me a single verse that teaches this. There is no ceremonial part of the Law. There is only Law or no Law.

Most nations prohibit animal sacrifice, & there's no temple in Israel yet for them to do it in, but they still follow the rest of the law as best they can. The observances called "feasts" in many Bible versions are actually CEREMONIES. You may read the details of them for yourself.

Deut. 16:16“Three times a year all your males shall appear before the Lord your God at the place that he will choose: at the Feast of Unleavened Bread, at the Feast of Weeks, and at the Feast of Booths. They shall not appear before the Lord empty-handed.

These were CEREMONIES.

 

[robycop3]

'Time for breakfast. I probably won't get back to this in time.

May God grant you a good breakfast!

 

[asterisktom]

The end of Judaism was Good Friday!

Then you have disagreement with the writers of the NT who said it was "fading away "