Especially?

[William C]

First the term "elect" simply means "chosen."

How often does the scripture refer individually to a lost person?

Of those few times why would you expect it to mention God's electing to allow them entrance into the kingdom. Though the word "elect" may not be used in the manner you speak of the concept is spoken of in regard to the lost:

"How long I have held out my hands to an obstinate people" (Romans 10)

Sounds like God chose them to me.

Matt 23:37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!

Sounds like they were chosen to be gathered under the wings of Christ.

1 Tim 2:4 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Again, sounds like they were chosen.

To be chosen means that God desires to reveal the truth you so that you may enter covenant with him through faith. He loved the world and chose to reconcile the entire world to himself, some are unwilling despite God's desires for all to be saved.

 

[William C]

Col. 1:26 [even] the mystery which hath been hid for ages and generations: but now hath it been manifested to his saints, 27 to whom God was pleased to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
Col. 1:26 [even] the mystery which hath been hid for ages and generations: but now hath it been manifested to his saints, 27 to whom God was pleased to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

That's a silly argument. It doesn't say that all Gentiles are elect. You are reading your false notions into the verse.

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
Again, sounds like they were chosen.

Somehow I am not surprised that you would place your false reasoning above the plain words of Scripture. Using your wierd extensions of Scripture one can use

Revelation 20:15(NASB)
15 And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Sounds like they were chosen.

 

[William C]

Originally posted by Ken H:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Brother Bill:
Col. 1:26 [even] the mystery which hath been hid for ages and generations: but now hath it been manifested to his saints, 27 to whom God was pleased to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

That's a silly argument. It doesn't say that all Gentiles are elect. You are reading your false notions into the verse. </font>[/QUOTE]This is just one translation. Some say it more simply for simple minded readers, "God chose to make know the riches.."

There are many verses that refer to God choosing to allow Gentiles entrance into covenant. Do you deny this?

 

[William C]

Originally posted by Ken H:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Brother Bill:
Again, sounds like they were chosen.

Somehow I am not surprised that you would place your false reasoning above the plain words of Scripture. Using your wierd extensions of Scripture one can use

Revelation 20:15(NASB)
15 And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Sounds like they were chosen. </font>[/QUOTE]There is also a passage that says names can be erased from the book of life and another verse that says people are entered into the book of life based upon their deeds, are you sure you want to use that argument?

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
There are many verses that refer to God choosing to allow Gentiles entrance into covenant. Do you deny this?

It still doesn't say that all Gentiles are elect. You are unable to make your case.

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
are you sure you want to use that argument?

Like I pointed out, it makes as much sense as your argument.

Are you sure you want to keep on using it?

 

[William C]

Originally posted by Ken H:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Brother Bill:
are you sure you want to use that argument?

Like I pointed out, it makes as much sense as your argument.

Are you sure you want to keep on using it? </font>[/QUOTE]Mumbo jumbo : "the post that doesn't deal with the argument but seeks to divert the issue or degrade others."

 

[Frogman]

Bro. Bill,

Have you never thought there is a book of Life and there is the Lamb's Book of Life?

Bro. Dallas

 

[npetreley]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
There is also a passage that says names can be erased from the book of life and another verse that says people are entered into the book of life based upon their deeds, are you sure you want to use that argument?

Where does it say that names are entered into the book of life based on their deeds?

 

[William C]

Originally posted by Frogman:
Bro. Bill,

Have you never thought there is a book of Life and there is the Lamb's Book of Life?

Interesting.
Dallas, honestly I haven't considered that. I've always seen them as one and the same, is there a reason not to? Do you have some reason to see them differently? Why?

 

[Frogman]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Frogman:
Bro. Bill,

Have you never thought there is a book of Life and there is the Lamb's Book of Life?

Interesting.
Dallas, honestly I haven't considered that. I've always seen them as one and the same, is there a reason not to? Do you have some reason to see them differently? Why? </font>[/QUOTE]Here goes, git out yer gigs boys, but remember, anything over two prongs is illegal.



"The book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;" Gen. 5.1

"The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham." Matt. 1.1

Now, I have spoken...don't none of you like frog-legs?...do ya?

Bro. Dallas

 

[tyndale1946]

Brother Dallas is that how you all gig for frogs... I thought you were suppose to use a tennis racket get more of them that way

Saw an interesting comment on the two life books you were talking about on the PB Discussion Forum that might help some... Will post it later!... Whatever you do lay off Kermit

... Brother Glen The Primitive Baptist

 

[Frogman]

Thanks brother Glenn, if I can dodge the gigging I may just hop on over their and read it, you can still post it however.

We always tried to sneak up on em' you know, from behind, catch em' off guard and unawares, if ya ain't careful though and you are carrying a light, once this light shines abroad upon them, the deal is up and they are aware you are there and you ain't got no chance of gigging that ol' frog, he hops on into the depths of that water from whence his life has sprung. Yep, I've spent a few Friday and Saturday nights trying for em'. The tennis racket will work too, but usually the approach works better individually, and the way is made around the whole congregation in this way, one frog at a time. O, if one does see it coming and dive into the waters of safety he will usually proclaim a croak of warning, but not all listen to this and not a few end up in the ol' fryin' pan.

I am sure I will come over and read it.

God Bless.
Bro. Dallas

[ March 17, 2003, 01:10 PM: Message edited by: Frogman ]

 

[tyndale1946]

The following is from a discussion in the PB Forum from awhile back that I thought might bring different thoughts upon the two different books of life... I shall divide it into different sections and posters... This is not from one viewpoint but from both sides of the fence... Brother Glen

Brother Jerrnigan a PB started out the discussion with this post

I've been reading scripture and have a long standing question, and would appreciate any and all comments to help me understand the text.

Revelations 22:19 says"And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

Also in Exodus 32:33 it says; And the Lord said unto Moses, whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

I know that the verse in Revelations is talking about the book of prophecy being the book of Revelations, but the scripture in Exodus seems to support this text. But Jesus says in Rev.3:5 He that cometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name from the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

This text supports what Jesus says that he came to save his people and he will lose no not one. I beleive this text to be true bute the text at REV. 22:19 wants to dispell this. If anyone can offer an explaination to this I am all ears.

I am but a novice in the scriptures and feel the need to study the bible more and this particular scripture has caught my leg and will not let go. Please someone help. I know the Devil is playing a part in my questioning this part of the scripture, help me loose him.

Brother Gregg of the IFB answered the question this way... Dear Brother Rick, You ask a very good question. I too asked this same question of a Pastor several years ago. The answer he gave me was as follows. The book of life you refer to in Exodus and Revelation is not "THE" book of life that refers to the redeemed. Early Jewish towns kept a book similar to a census record that recorded every person born. If someone commited a grevious offense their name would be removed from the book, just as though they had never been born. The book of life mentioned in Exodus and Revelation is a "book" that list every person born, just like a census record. This is the book that someone's name can be removed from. The name of someone who has been saved can never be removed from the rolls of the redeemed. I hope this is of some help. This is the only reasonable explanation I have ever heard.

Elder Rogers answered this way... Your name cannot be removed or blotted out of the book of life. If that were true that would make God a liar, and changeable. And we know that God cannot change. To believe that God would elect you and then turn around and remove you because of some work, that would set aside the doctrine of grace, and that would mean that "works", is how were getting to heaven. When Jesus speaks about having no part with him, he saying that you're still an elect child, but whatever extra you could have recieved on this earth won't be given to you. We live by grace, and we know that if grace didn't do it , that it wasn't done. Once in, always in. Never in, always out. Look at Romans 11:5-7. This should make it all clear.

 

[tyndale1946]

Part II

Brother Johnson added his view... The Books of Life that have been refferred to in the previuos replies are defenitley 2 different books. The LAMBS book of Life, which holds the name of all of God's children that He chose before the foundation of the world, is symbolic to eternal salvation. The Book of life you ask of is also referencing a salvation but not eternal, it's a timely salvation. It's speeking of blessings that will be removed from one's life in this world. It's (this scripture) giving a lesson on obedience. Most of the scriptures that speak of salvation in the Bible are about a timely salvation or a way of being saved here on earth from earthly harm...not eternal. We have nothing to do with our eternal condition. God finished that work!

Brother Tom added his thoughts... I have an old unabridged dictionary or two and if you look hard you will find one of the root meanings behind the word book is beech from the Beech tree which was used much in producing early paper I imagine. I have heard it was from the bark that was used mostly. Well it happens that the word beech for the tree means "The tree with edible fruit". From here I would like to defer to "The Tree of Life". Would it help if we could see "The Tree of Life" as being one in the same as "The Book of Life"? There is some book eating that goes on in scripture and those you are free to look up on your own. In 1.Co.1.24 we see that God's wisdom is in fact a person. It is The Lord Jesus Christ that is God's wisdom. If you have residing within Christ, you then have Wisdom. This Wisdom within (Christ) will produce outwardly (his righteousness) by the removing of the body of sin. When we allow, by surrender, The Lord Jesus Christ to live (see Gal.2.20) we then have manifested Wisdom, That is Understanding. If you do some proximity searches using wisdom and understanding you may find that Wisdom is inward and the speaking thereof outward, that is understanding. Only thing is, all of this IS a person not loose objective facts or brainpower. You see, Christ is the Life within (Jn.14.6) and that life lived outwardly (salvation worked out) is the Fathers desire. For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ 2.Co.2.15 This is the incense from the alter in Rev. Wisdom IS Christ, there I said it again. Now look at Prov.3.13-18 What is Wisdom here? Aha!, So we see a tree within that will produce fruit called Life, I'm in for that. The Book is much the same. Whenever we find God's people in rebellion, he speaks of streets within the city. Funny thing though because in "The City" there is but One street of gold. Do not go by our songs, look in the book. Likewise when it comes to The Book. There is One when speaking of "The Book of Life" and pluralism when speaking of "the books were opened". Are we not reading from "The Revelation (singular) of Jesus Christ" when we read about the Book of Life? What would a revelation of Jesus Christ be attempting to reveal? Why do we look for so much other than him in this book.

Brother Nalley was the last to add his comments... I have just finished reading your responses on your name being removed from the Book of Life. The answer is it can. If it could not the word would not say it could. Look at all of the scriptures that tell us to persevere and endure. It is all through out the new testament. God means what he says and says what he means. If tells you if you take away from these things he will take your name from the Book of Life that is exactly what he means. Read Ezekiel 18 sometime. You will find that over and over God states that the soul that sins shall die? What did God mean when he said that? The soul that sins shall die!!! Read Galatians 5. Paul listed the deeds of the flesh and then warned us that those who practice such things will not inherit the kindom of God. What did he mean? Those who practice such things WILL NOT inherit the kingdom of God. It is just that simple. I just agree with God that the soul that sins shall die. I agree with God that those who practice sin will not inherit his kingdom. There is no way to take these verses any other way. We just ought to agree with what they say.

I hope this helped the topic some and maybe clarified some unclear points... No matter what side of the fence you are on... Brother Glen The Primitive Baptist

 

[npetreley]

Mr Bill, where does it say that names are entered into the book of life based on their deeds?

 

[npetreley]

Originally posted by Brother Bill:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Frogman:
Bro. Bill,

Have you never thought there is a book of Life and there is the Lamb's Book of Life?

Interesting.
Dallas, honestly I haven't considered that. I've always seen them as one and the same, is there a reason not to? Do you have some reason to see them differently? Why? </font>[/QUOTE]I'm surprised at you Mr. Bill. According to Billism, the very fact that the Bible DOESN'T explicitly SAY they're NOT different means they MUST be different.

By the way, where does the Bible say that people are entered into the book of life according to their deeds?

 

[romanbear]

Npetreley;
Where does the Bible say that only the elect will go to heaven?
Romanbear