Eternal Security : Once Saved Always Saved ?

[bro. coley]

Bretheren, here is somthing to consider; if it is possible for a man to be saved and then to lose it,how would you explain Matthew 7:23?? "And then will I profess unto them I never Knew you"....... EMPHASIS ON NEVER; if He ever knew you, He is a liar by saying"I never knew you." I belive the problem lies in the fact that many Bible students do not separate the standing of the believer from the state of the believer. In God's eyes I am perfect and sinless by the blood of Jesus Christ(this is my standing) In the eyes of others only my state is known, remember Paul said "in me,that is in my flesh, dwelleth no good thing." He said this many years after he was saved.

 

[C.S. Murphy]

Originally posted by bro. coley:
Bretheren, here is somthing to consider; if it is possible for a man to be saved and then to lose it,how would you explain Matthew 7:23?? "And then will I profess unto them I never Knew you"....... EMPHASIS ON NEVER; if He ever knew you, He is a liar by saying"I never knew you." I belive the problem lies in the fact that many Bible students do not separate the standing of the believer from the state of the believer. In God's eyes I am perfect and sinless by the blood of Jesus Christ(this is my standing) In the eyes of others only my state is known, remember Paul said "in me,that is in my flesh, dwelleth no good thing." He said this many years after he was saved.

Good post I agree totally
Murph

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by bro. coley:
Bretheren, here is somthing to consider; if it is possible for a man to be saved and then to lose it,how would you explain Matthew 7:23?? "And then will I profess unto them I never Knew you"....... EMPHASIS ON NEVER; if He ever knew you, He is a liar by saying"I never knew you."

What???? If he "never" knew them, these people were "never" saved in the first place, and thus this has nothing to do with the subject of OSAS. Maybe I don't understand your point.

 

[post-it]

1 John 1:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Here is the only way we know that a saved Christian (thought to have been saved) really isn't saved. If they deny Christ and leave the faith, they were never part of us.
This also makes it possible for such a person to come (return) to the faith and belief, since they were never part of it.

[ September 07, 2002, 01:59 PM: Message edited by: post-it ]

 

[C.S. Murphy]

Originally posted by post-it:
1 John 1:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Here is the only way we know that a saved Christian (thought to have been saved) really isn't saved. If they deny Christ and leave the faith, they were never part of us.
This also makes it possible for such a person to come (return) to the faith and belief, since they were never part of it.

Well said Post it thanks
Murph

 

[GIG]

I guess the question that I have never heard answered with scripture is ..If you can lose your salvation, then which sin is it that is more important than Jesus dying on Calvary??? I believe that the biggest problem with not believing in eternal security is , how can you truly enjoy your salvation if you're afraid you will mess it up??? Thank God Jesus only had to die one time and he's sitting by the right hand of the Father making intercession for me each and every time I mess up!

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by GIG:
I guess the question that I have never heard answered with scripture is ..If you can lose your salvation, then which sin is it that is more important than Jesus dying on Calvary??? I believe that the biggest problem with not believing in eternal security is , how can you truly enjoy your salvation if you're afraid you will mess it up??? Thank God Jesus only had to die one time and he's sitting by the right hand of the Father making intercession for me each and every time I mess up!

Hi GIG,

I don't believe sinning messes up your salvation, or that one has to worry about loosing your salvation. However, I also don't believe God has taken away our free will - and that we still have the choice to return to a sinful lifestyle, consciously turning our backs on God and his gift. Temptation abounds, and scripture repeatedly tells us that if we choose to, we can turn away. I'm not saying that any single sin negates your salvation, but that repeated and willful decisions to give into temptation can sear your conscious to the point where eventually one can say "Ya know, I don't want my salvation any more."

1 Tim 3:6 says a new believer taking the office of a bishop is in danger of becoming full of pride and falling under the same condemnation as the devil.

Luke 8:13 tells of those who receive the word with joy, believe for a while, but then later fall away in a time of temptation.

These verses, and the numerous others that warn or standing firm, enduring, remaining faithful, etc, etc, are verses I cannot dismiss - and in my thinking, OSAS does not adequately deal with such verses. Just my opinion.

 

[hrhema]

Again it is not one sin which condemns a person or two or three. The scriptures declare we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ which is daily interceding for us.

When we sin and come short we can cry out Abba Father and he will hear us and forgive our sins.
Yet, I believe a believer who falls away can make the choice to reject Christ and never come back to serving him. This person is an Apostate.

Jesus said a smoking flax he would never quench and I feel this was directed towards those who backslides and never rejects the Lord during this time of being backslid.

People use the shepherd and the sheep scenario
but fail to realize that the sheep that strays the shepherd breaks one of its legs then if that does not stop the wandering then the sheep is destroyed. If we want to use this scenario as defending OSAS then there is a problem because the shepherd will bring a wanderer to judgement
then to destruction. This does not sound like OSAS.

The dividing line between those who believe in OSAS and those who believe differently is those who believe OSAS believe no matter what a person does or says they can never lose their salvation and the other side is that we believe a person can become Apostate and lost their soul. I personally believe apostasy is what Jesus was calling Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

 

[onevoice]

Originally posted by post-it:
1 John 1:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Here is the only way we know that a saved Christian (thought to have been saved) really isn't saved. If they deny Christ and leave the faith, they were never part of us.
This also makes it possible for such a person to come (return) to the faith and belief, since they were never part of it.

Woohoo. We agree Post it!!! Mark it in the books!!!

If salvation can be lost, is it not works?