every christian should sign this petition

Ken,

Is it ok if the Iranian President makes good with his threat and wipes Israel off the map, or should we, the United States intervene before he has the capability to do so?

Joseph Botwinick

 

He can't make good on his threats for two reasons:

1) Iran doesn't have even one nuclear weapon.

2) If Iran ever used a nuclear weapon against the United States or one of our allies Iran would cease to exist as a nation or an inhabitable environment shortly thereafter.

 

I would support intervening on two conditions:

1) Proof that Iran is actually trying to build a nuclear weapon.

2) Proof that Iran intends to use a nuclear weapon in a first strike.

Russia(and the old Soviet Union) and China have nuclear weapons but as long as there is no proof that they intend to use them in a first strike against us or one of our allies we leave them alone.

 

There is proof that Iran plans to attack Israel. How much more proof do you want, a crater in Jerusalem?

Joseph Botwinick

 

What plans, Joseph? All I have read is outrageous rhetoric by the Iranian president. That is no plan.

 

I don't believe in your interpretation of the Scriptures in this instance, fc, as I am not a premillennialist.

 

I do take the Bible seriously, fc. That's why I am not a premillennialist.

 

What must be done with Israel?

Which Imam is he talking about?

Have you ever heard about the 12th Imam?

the Twelvth Imam

What preparations, outside of nuclear bombs, are the Iranians making to attack Israel?

Click on the video link that says: Iranian students studying to be bombers.

I don't know how much evidence you need, but it sure doesn't look too good to me.

Joseph Botwinick

 

Merely words. Still no proof. Remember we were told that Iraq had WMDs in March 2003 and we now know that was false - it was merely words.

 

Quotes by the Iranian president:

"A nation which has culture, logic and civilisation does not need nuclear weapons. The countries which seek nuclear weapons are those which want to solve all problems by the use of force. Our nation does not need such weapons."

"We are asked why we have started [nuclear] research. We answer that there is no limitation to research. There are no limits imposed on research in NPT [Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty] or in the Additional Protocol. Nor have we made such a commitment. Research is necessary for the life and dynamism of a nation."

If we are going to accept his outrageous quote about wiping out Israel(even to the point of basing U.S. foreign policy on it) then we must also accept these quotes as well.

 

I still believe Saddam had them. Bush dismissed the issue so it would not overshadow bigger issues...like winning the war. More than likely the WMD's are in Syria.

The Iranians beliefs about the twelfth Imam and Iranian college students training to be suicide bombers is not merely words.

Joseph Botwinick

 

How many Iranians have blown themselves up in Israel?

It's real easy to get people in a group setting to sign up for something.

Look at how many people "signed up" during Billy Graham crusades to follow Christ Jesus and very few of them ever followed through.

[ February 19, 2006, 10:26 PM: Message edited by: KenH ]

 

Even is Iran is trying to build a nuclear weapon(there is no proof that it is) it is years away from being successful - if it ever is.

The Iranian president's eschatological beliefs sound as false in a somewhat similar vein as that of many Christians.

 

Without proof(as I have stated elsewhere on the Baptist Board), fc, I will not support the U.S. attacking Iran. And if President Bush was so foolish as to do so without providing proof - real proof this time unlike the lead-up to invading Iraq - I would certainly support a move to impeach President Bush.

 

Ken,

Just admit it. You could care less what happens to one of our allies. The only proof that seems to be enough for you would be a cloud of smoke over Washington.

Joseph Botwinick

 

Joseph, do you just swallow whole whatever the Bush administration and the Israeli government says?

I care about our allies and I don't want to see any of our allies or ourselves harmed by foolish, unsupported actions by them or us.