• Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

EVERYTHING that ever happens God brings to pass.

R

Robert Snow

New Member
One poster made this comment in a thread.

Do you agree?

I would say that this is one of the most evil things that can be said of a loving God. It truly does attempt to make Him into a monster. How sad that any theological system can bring about such doctrine as this and call it theology.

Isa_5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
 
P

preacher4truth

Active Member
Robert Snow said:
One poster made this comment in a thread.

Do you agree?

I would say that this is one of the most evil things that can be said of a loving God. It truly does attempt to make Him into a monster. How sad that any theological system can bring about such doctrine as this and call it theology.

Isa_5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Click to expand...

Let's see the link.
 
D

Don

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Disagree. And I'm not a calvinist.

Doesn't scripture tell us that God works all things for good?

EDITED TO ADD/CLARIFY:
Disagree with YOU, Robert.
 
F

freeatlast

New Member
Robert Snow said:
One poster made this comment in a thread.

Do you agree?

I would say that this is one of the most evil things that can be said of a loving God. It truly does attempt to make Him into a monster. How sad that any theological system can bring about such doctrine as this and call it theology.

Isa_5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Click to expand...
Not knowing the context of the post you are referring to makes is difficult to say one way or the other. if the poster was speaking in a broad scope then yes it is true. I cannot even take a breath unless God purposes it. However if the poster means that God orchestrates evil or even every detail of history then no.
 
Earth Wind and Fire

Earth Wind and Fire

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
And we recycle these kinda topics over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &
over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over & over &......:type:
 
L

Luke2427

Active Member
freeatlast said:
Not knowing the context of the post you are referring to makes is difficult to say one way or the other. if the poster was speaking in a broad scope then yes it is true. I cannot even take a breath unless God purposes it. However if the poster means that God orchestrates evil or even every detail of history then no.
Click to expand...

Jonathan Edwards:

If it were not right that God should decree and permit and punish sin, there could be no manifestation of God's holiness in hatred of sin, or in showing any preference, in his providence, of godliness before it. There would be no manifestation of God's grace or true goodness, if there was no sin to be pardoned, no misery to be saved from. How much happiness soever he bestowed, his goodness would not be so much prized and admired. . . .

So evil is necessary, in order to the highest happiness of the creature, and the completeness of that communication of God, for which he made the world; because the creature's happiness consists in the knowledge of God, and the sense of his love. And if the knowledge of him be imperfect, the happiness of the creature must be proportionably imperfect.
 
Thousand Hills

Thousand Hills

Active Member
Job 42:1-6

1 Then Job answered the LORD and said: 2 “I know that You can do everything,And that no purpose of Yours can be withheld from You. 3 You asked, ‘Who is this who hides counsel without knowledge?’ Therefore I have uttered what I did not understand, Things too wonderful for me, which I did not know. 4 Listen, please, and let me speak;You said, ‘I will question you, and you shall answer Me.’ 5 “I have heard of You by the hearing of the ear, But now my eye sees You. 6 Therefore I abhor myself, And repent in dust and ashes.”
 
L

Luke2427

Active Member
Robert Snow said:
So when a child is murdered or raped, it is God's will?
Click to expand...

Jonathan Edwards:

God may hate a thing as it is in itself, and considered simply as evil, and yet . . . it may be his will it should come to pass, considering all consequences. . . . God doesn't will sin as sin or for the sake of anything evil; though it be his pleasure so to order things, that he permitting, sin will come to pass; for the sake of the great good that by his disposal shall be the consequence. His willing to order things so that evil should come to pass, for the sake of the contrary good, is no argument that he doesn't hate evil, as evil: and if so, then it is no reason why he may not reasonably forbid evil as evil, and punish it as such.

[God's] will of decree [or sovereign will] is not his will in the same sense as his will of command [or moral will] is. Therefore it is not difficult at all to suppose that the one may be otherwise than the other: his will in both senses is his inclination. But when we say he wills virtue, or loves virtue or the happiness of his creature; thereby is intended that virtue or the creature's happiness, absolutely and simply considered, is agreeable to the inclination of his nature. His will of decree is his inclination to a thing not as to that thing absolutely and simply, but with reference to the universality of things. So God, though he hates a things as it is simply, may incline to it with reference to the universality of things.
 
Crabtownboy

Crabtownboy

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Luke2427 said:
Jonathan Edwards:

God may hate a thing as it is in itself, and considered simply as evil, and yet . . . it may be his will it should come to pass, considering all consequences. . . . God doesn't will sin as sin or for the sake of anything evil; though it be his pleasure so to order things, that he permitting, sin will come to pass; for the sake of the great good that by his disposal shall be the consequence. His willing to order things so that evil should come to pass, for the sake of the contrary good, is no argument that he doesn't hate evil, as evil: and if so, then it is no reason why he may not reasonably forbid evil as evil, and punish it as such.

[God's] will of decree [or sovereign will] is not his will in the same sense as his will of command [or moral will] is. Therefore it is not difficult at all to suppose that the one may be otherwise than the other: his will in both senses is his inclination. But when we say he wills virtue, or loves virtue or the happiness of his creature; thereby is intended that virtue or the creature's happiness, absolutely and simply considered, is agreeable to the inclination of his nature. His will of decree is his inclination to a thing not as to that thing absolutely and simply, but with reference to the universality of things. So God, though he hates a things as it is simply, may incline to it with reference to the universality of things.
Click to expand...

It is sad that anyone believes the false beliefs you have. It is tragic that someone actually preaches them. You continually make God into a monster.
 
F

freeatlast

New Member
Luke2427 said:
Jonathan Edwards:

If it were not right that God should decree and permit and punish sin, there could be no manifestation of God's holiness in hatred of sin, or in showing any preference, in his providence, of godliness before it. There would be no manifestation of God's grace or true goodness, if there was no sin to be pardoned, no misery to be saved from. How much happiness soever he bestowed, his goodness would not be so much prized and admired. . . .

So evil is necessary, in order to the highest happiness of the creature, and the completeness of that communication of God, for which he made the world; because the creature's happiness consists in the knowledge of God, and the sense of his love. And if the knowledge of him be imperfect, the happiness of the creature must be proportionably imperfect.
Click to expand...

You are talking about the Jonathan Edwards who was a slave owner, correct?
 
R

Robert Snow

New Member
Crabtownboy said:
It is sad that anyone believes the false beliefs you have. It is tragic that someone actually preaches them. You continually make God into a monster.
Click to expand...

The really sad thing is that these people seem to put more credence in what some author says than what the Word of God teaches.

I remember the bible saying that God is love; I have not found the verse that says God is hate!
 
L

Luke2427

Active Member
Crabtownboy said:
It is sad that anyone believes the false beliefs you have. It is tragic that someone actually preaches them. You continually make God into a monster.
Click to expand...

By "you" I am assuming you are speaking of Jonathan Edwards since you are responding to his quote.

No intelligent Christian on earth says Jonathan Edwards makes God into a monster.

Skandelon wouldn't say that.

Don wouldn't say it.

john of Japan wouldn't say it.

A host of "non-cals" who have any theological intellect at all would not say it.


You don't have to agree with it, but your hyperbole is ridiculous.

When you start saying stupid things like "you make God into a monster" you need to be held to account.
 
M

MB

Well-Known Member
Don said:
Disagree. And I'm not a calvinist.

Doesn't scripture tell us that God works all things for good?

EDITED TO ADD/CLARIFY:
Disagree with YOU, Robert.
Click to expand...
Wrong the Word says;
Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

It never says God works all things.
MB
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top