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Eve's sorrow increased: from what?

ituttut

New Member
Part 2
ituttut said:
Originally Posted by Allan

Appently all angels come before the presence of God as in Job. Angels are Gods emissaries and therefore able to approach Him especially if it was their particular function.

Do any of the others dare accuse, or speak so plainly to God? We have the book of Job as God granted Satan what he asked, not once but twice; and Satan was granted access to Peter. God let's us view these incidents to let us know the "power" this created being has, and also to let us know He (God) is more powerful, and the only chance we have is repenting (turn to Him) so He can seal us in, never to let us go. But we can still sin, however even those sin's have already been forgiven.

Things are much different today, but we can't forget about Satan because he is not going away. Even we in Christ cannot let our guard down for a moment. Not that we can become "unsaved", but because we can tarnish the image of Christ, when not in His will. These bodies are still sinful, and until we die we are to "fight - continue to the finish line", and spread the "grace commission".
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We will be GREATER than the angels and even judge them. Angels do not judge other angels or bring a railing accusation against them either. But we will!
Cannot really prove or disprove that,...Snip...I see you also enjoy speculating; as said, God allows we to speculate, for God is still a God of "mystery". Ephesians 3:8, "Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ". So much is unknown, and not searchable. Perhaps what we wish, may come true.


Actually, it is not an unknown or unknowable fact. Take this scripture:

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Hbr 1:5 ¶ For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

This is speaking of Jesus being begotten [Gr. gennao] of God (Metaphore - in the Jewish sense - one ordained [begotten/unique] to bring others to His way of life)
Man is also begotten [Gr. gennao] of God and place adoption wise as His ligitimate children and therefore heirship is conveyable to us and is done so.
Yes, and this is written to the Hebrew, Israel. Jesus walked this earth, saying He came for only His people. We can trace many of His footprints while on the earth. But He is now in heaven, and we are of the heavenlies. We know what is promised the "covenant people", those of the "Kingdom Church". Can we say "of course we can search out the riches you have for us Lord in your "Body Church". We know what you have in store for us. I don't think so.
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1Jo 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
We know John is speaking to the "firstborn" of God, that being Israel, those of the covenant, with promises made of the inheritance of the earth. John was one who also shook hands with Paul to not preach the "circumcised" gospel to the "uncircumcised", however we see in John 5 he now knows they also are in Christ, but still of the "Kingdom Church". But even at that we know John cannot be saying a person born of God become perfect, for in verse 21 he is telling them to keep from "idols", which is the first commandment of the Ten Commandments. Also the "Kingdom Church" is justified by faith, and the "Body Church" is justified through faith.

I believe what John is saying is what Paul says in that "our sins (all of them) are no more, so we cannot do a sin that is counted as sin to us.

Since Christ is seated at the right hand of the Father, so we to are seated WITH Christ (authority) in the Heavenlies. We know we have thrones as well which speak to that authority given us in heirship and thus our title Kings and Priest of God and why Christ is called King of kings and Lord (ruler) of lords. Angels were never and will never be offered such authority and power.
I believe you are mixing the Churches here. The earthly Apostles will sit on thrones in their kingdom, we are told no such thing. The "firstborn" of God, Israel are told they will be Kings, and Priest of God, but they are not us. We are told in Galatians 4:7, "Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ". We in the "Body Church" are never told we will be "kings and Priests". Only those justified by faith will inherit the earth and become "kings and Priest".
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Hbr 1:13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?


And WE will come back to rule and riegn with Him!
Amen! Romans 5:17, "For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)", and II Timothy 2:12, "If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:"
Lastly, they are ministering spirits to God and to us. The scripture below shows that though it is in the future were we will fully attain that heirship but it is in this NOW that they minister to us based upon our future status and authority. Just as we are ministers unto God as they are, yet they are also ministers unto us, but this ministering is not vise versa.
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Hbr 1:14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?
It is interesting to note the Apostle Paul makes a number of references to the angelic host. Today if we see any manifestation of angels, they are very few, if any. This is in agreement with the administration of this grace period, in which the heavens are quite. There is warfare, and we "wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, powers, and rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." We see no Michael, the arch angel to Israel, appointed for we today. We are not to get carried away with angels, as do the Catholics and some churches, but we cannot loose sight of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Remember: Power rests in authority not ability.
Yes in Him is the Power and the glory.


 

ituttut

New Member
Pastor Larry said:
The "angel of the Lord" is called YHWH and is worshipped in Scripture (Judges 6, I believe is one, though i am going from memory). YHWH takes human form only in Jesus. That means that "the angel of the Lord" is YHWH.

Nicely put
 

El_Guero

New Member
Gina L said:
In Genesis 3:16 Eve is told that her sorrow and her conception will be multiplied.

An increase seems to imply an amount already present.

The presence of sorrow in a perfect world seems a bit odd. Logically, if there is pain, there is the possibility of death.

Would the physical bodies of humans experience death before the fall?

Has death and life always been only a spiritual state and not a physical one?

:)

I will most likely have no more participation in this thread, but simply review the replies.

Now, I admit that that is not quite the same as child birth without the pain . . . but, it is probably more fun . . . but, I wouldn't know.

;)

:tonofbricks:
 
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