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Faith is a Good Work we do after being created in Christ !
- Thread starter savedbymercy
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savedbymercy
New Member
No one wants to debate the points I made! They evade them!
And again you previously said:
You don't debate. You avoid people's questions. No one will answer the points you have made because you won't answer theirs and therefore yours become irrelevant.
Your mantra, as I have pointed out many times to you, is: "Have you read all the points I have made in my post. Go back and read them first."
That answer is both rude and irrelevant. Answer the post that was made to you.
Answer Don's post instead of being selfishly fixated on yourself.
savedbymercy
New Member
To quote a wise poster:
"You people shouldn't play with that thing."
"You people shouldn't play with that thing."
If I avoided something, please tell me what it was, and I'll address it. In the meantime, I've addressed the very first point in your opening post. Either answer that, or admit that you're wrong.
I am interpreting this as an instruction, a directive rather than a complaint. I urge every one to obey SBM's admonishment.
Best post on this thread. I'll add one caveat, there should be a comma inserted so that it reads
Also, you must insert that exclamation point after hitting the 'spacebar' of the last word !
People address your points directly. The problem is you just want someone to agree with your points and repeat them back to you verbatim. This is a debate board, you post your points and then others challenge them if they do not agree. We all understand your points quite perfectly, there is no need for anyone to reiterate them line for line back to you. We tell you we get what you are saying, so move on with the DEBATE! Answer the rebuttals! Tell us why our rebuttals to your points are not adequate. Otherwise you are making yourself irrelevant, only speaking to hear yourself speak because no one else is going to take you seriously and give you a listen. Surely you have noticed how much of your postings go on without anyone commenting? When someone steps in and attempts to have a conversation with you, you fail. All you can say is "repeat what I said". I really have to wonder if you have any wisdom to offer the body of Christ at all. What you are doing is not working for you. Maybe it's time to do some self examining and try having a conversation to get your points across. What you have been doing sure isn't working for you.
savedbymercy
New Member
Anyone can address the points, as they evade them! But they don't show that they understand them! You can not debate that which you don't understand me to be saying and how I stated it!
Now once you prove to me you understand the points made, but you still disagree, that is different and I accept that!
How do we prove to you that we understand the points you made?
savedbymercy
New Member
I have posted Three post here explaining my points diligently with scripture and none has shown that they understand any of the points I made! Everyone has evaded them!
Not true. As I pointed out, I addressed your very first point in your first post -- that faith is work. Because the rest of your points depend upon this understanding, this is the point that matters most.
To that end, I posted the first problem with your post: that you are re-defining faith to mean "work," when you should concentrate on the actual meaning of "faith." Then I showed how you misused scripture (Acts 16) to justify your point that faith is a work.
That is not "evading." It is, by your own definition, disagreeing with you. And let's face it: if we disagree on the very first premise, then we will not agree on the rest of your post.
YOU, however, by not further discussing the premise, are evading. You won't defend the basic premise of your own post; that is evasion.
I think you're misusing the word "evade" like you used to misuse the word "rehearse."
savedbymercy
New Member
Reasons why Faith/Believing are acts of the New Creation !
Why no Gospel obedience by nature !
One of the Truths of the Gospel of Grace, Total Depravity or Inability of the lost sinner, to do anything of a Spiritually good nature before God, this Truth is rejected by all proud religionist, hence they must reject Salvation by Grace, believing by Grace, for Paul wrote that we believe by or through, because of Grace Acts 18:27
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
The word through here is the greek prep dia and means:
(a) gen: through, throughout, by the instrumentality of, (b) acc: through, on account of, by reason of, for the sake of, because of.
They believed by the instrumentality, force, energy, exerting power of Grace !
Because Grace must reign through the Lord Jesus Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Thats why there is no occasion to boast about ones believing, since we can only believe by the effectual operation of Grace, Grace causes us to differ from those who dont believe, not freewill !
Now to understand why believing must be a matter of Grace ! To believe is a matter of evangelical obedience to the Faith, for instance, when Paul writes of them that dont believe the Gospel, he writes that they dont obey it Rom 10:15-16
15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
Theres a reason why all have not obeyed/ believed the report of the Gospel ! That reason is all have not been given a new nature to obey it.
You see all men by nature operate from a spirit of disobedience, it worketh in all of by nature Eph 2:2-3
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
By nature, we cannot help but be disobedient, for we are under the complete domination of a spirit of disobedience, which even continues to work in the actual children of disobedience !
As long as we are in nature, are walk or manner of Life shall be a continuum of disobedience,
Those who are in the flesh or nature cannot please God Rom 8:8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
The word flesh here is the greek word sarx and means:
flesh, body, human nature, materiality; kindred.
And by nature we are like the children of disobedience, under the control of the Spirit of disobedience Eph 2:2-3 !
So therefore there cannot be any Gospel Obedience by anyone in the flesh, by nature ! To say that men and women by nature can obey the Gospel, is a flat out lie against the Truth !
Why no Gospel obedience by nature !
One of the Truths of the Gospel of Grace, Total Depravity or Inability of the lost sinner, to do anything of a Spiritually good nature before God, this Truth is rejected by all proud religionist, hence they must reject Salvation by Grace, believing by Grace, for Paul wrote that we believe by or through, because of Grace Acts 18:27
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
The word through here is the greek prep dia and means:
(a) gen: through, throughout, by the instrumentality of, (b) acc: through, on account of, by reason of, for the sake of, because of.
They believed by the instrumentality, force, energy, exerting power of Grace !
Because Grace must reign through the Lord Jesus Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Thats why there is no occasion to boast about ones believing, since we can only believe by the effectual operation of Grace, Grace causes us to differ from those who dont believe, not freewill !
Now to understand why believing must be a matter of Grace ! To believe is a matter of evangelical obedience to the Faith, for instance, when Paul writes of them that dont believe the Gospel, he writes that they dont obey it Rom 10:15-16
15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
Theres a reason why all have not obeyed/ believed the report of the Gospel ! That reason is all have not been given a new nature to obey it.
You see all men by nature operate from a spirit of disobedience, it worketh in all of by nature Eph 2:2-3
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
By nature, we cannot help but be disobedient, for we are under the complete domination of a spirit of disobedience, which even continues to work in the actual children of disobedience !
As long as we are in nature, are walk or manner of Life shall be a continuum of disobedience,
Those who are in the flesh or nature cannot please God Rom 8:8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
The word flesh here is the greek word sarx and means:
flesh, body, human nature, materiality; kindred.
And by nature we are like the children of disobedience, under the control of the Spirit of disobedience Eph 2:2-3 !
So therefore there cannot be any Gospel Obedience by anyone in the flesh, by nature ! To say that men and women by nature can obey the Gospel, is a flat out lie against the Truth !
savedbymercy
New Member
Why the natural man cannot believe the Light of the Gospel !
Jn 1:5
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
This scripture testimony informs us that man by nature, who darkness in themselves [by nature] Eph 5:8
8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
And in such a state, man does not comprehend the Light of the Gospel in the face of Jesus Christ, for the Gospel is a shining light 2 Cor 4:4-6
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.
6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
That word comprehended in Jn 1:5 is the greek word katalambanó and means:
I seize tight hold of, arrest, catch, capture, appropriate, (b) I overtake, (c) mid. aor: I perceived, comprehended.
The natural man cannot and does not appropriate to himself, lay hold of, nor perceive the Light and Truths of the Gospel of God !
The natural man does not:
apprehend (comprehend), "making it one's own." The Gospel of God !
Comprehend also means :
To take into the mind; to grasp with the understanding; to apprehend the meaning of; to understand.
By nature we are wayside hearers Matt 13:19
19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
at best we may become stony heart hearers Matt 13:20-21
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
But what we are not by nature and cannot be is good ground hearers Matt 13:23
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
That word understandeth is the grk word suniémi:
I consider, understand, perceive.,4920 syníēmi (from 4862 /sýn, "together with" and hiēmi, "put, send") – properly, put together, i.e. join facts (ideas) into a comprehensive (inter-locking) whole; synthesize.
4920 /syníēmi ("put facts together") means to arrive at a summary or final understanding (complete with life-applications). Accordingly, 4920 (syníēmi) is closely connected with discerning and doing "the preferred-will of God" (2307 /thélēma).
As Long as we remain in the darkness of human nature, we cannot comprehend the Gospel in a Truly spiritual conversion manner !
Jn 1:5
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
This scripture testimony informs us that man by nature, who darkness in themselves [by nature] Eph 5:8
8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
And in such a state, man does not comprehend the Light of the Gospel in the face of Jesus Christ, for the Gospel is a shining light 2 Cor 4:4-6
4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake.
6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
That word comprehended in Jn 1:5 is the greek word katalambanó and means:
I seize tight hold of, arrest, catch, capture, appropriate, (b) I overtake, (c) mid. aor: I perceived, comprehended.
The natural man cannot and does not appropriate to himself, lay hold of, nor perceive the Light and Truths of the Gospel of God !
The natural man does not:
apprehend (comprehend), "making it one's own." The Gospel of God !
Comprehend also means :
To take into the mind; to grasp with the understanding; to apprehend the meaning of; to understand.
By nature we are wayside hearers Matt 13:19
19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
at best we may become stony heart hearers Matt 13:20-21
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
But what we are not by nature and cannot be is good ground hearers Matt 13:23
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
That word understandeth is the grk word suniémi:
I consider, understand, perceive.,4920 syníēmi (from 4862 /sýn, "together with" and hiēmi, "put, send") – properly, put together, i.e. join facts (ideas) into a comprehensive (inter-locking) whole; synthesize.
4920 /syníēmi ("put facts together") means to arrive at a summary or final understanding (complete with life-applications). Accordingly, 4920 (syníēmi) is closely connected with discerning and doing "the preferred-will of God" (2307 /thélēma).
As Long as we remain in the darkness of human nature, we cannot comprehend the Gospel in a Truly spiritual conversion manner !
Was this an observation or a command?
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