Faith received part deux

I gave you the record, which you cannot argue against. Well, you can argue, but its arguing against the record.

"You shall be as gods" (when dead) i.e. capable. Uh, no. Wrong.

I don't believe him. We are incapable. I'll lean towards God when He said we would die (be incapable) than towards Satan who said we wouldn't die, but we would be gods, or (be capable.)

So, my theology is opposite of yours here, and instead of leaning towards the latter, leans toward the former.

Thats the record. And I've already given you the definition and proper implication.

I can't assist you beyond that.

One more time: When is the last time you've looked at soteriology, and which author?

 

That is not what the Bible says. Why are you adding to the Scriptures?

That is not what it says. And it is not what happened either. They sinned. They hid themselves. God called them. They answered. A conversation ensued between God and Adam. They were not incapable of carrying on talking with God. Thus your definition does not fit.

Latter; former; it is still wrong. It goes contrary to that which is written.

Adam was dead. He wasn't simply a corpse. He wasn't simply incapable, for he was talking with God. Thus you still have a problem with the word "dead."

 

I waited this long for this!!? All you have is "they were not incapable of talking!" Uh. LOL!!!!!!! :laugh: :wavey:

Ya think?

Oh boy.

And nothing on your last soteriological study. Go figure.

How about a double double at Timmies, I'll buy, eh?

 

They were not incapable of talking with the Lord, and yet they had sinned.
They were "dead" and yet they were not incapable of talking with the Lord.
Therefore your definition/meaning/implication of dead cannot mean "incapable" can it?

 

I see others have been trying to teach you what the word "dead" means as well:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1698030&postcount=17

 

Line 1 and 2 of your above post, well are, wrong, and off base. Physical talk means spiritual ability? Uh....LOL!!!! Come on DHK.

"You shall be as "capable"' (gods) i.e. Don't believe God! You're really OK!

To answer line 3? Yes, it can, and does, as I've shown you.

Your last study on soteriology? Author?

 

If one is talking to God Almighty, the Creator of the Universe, The Triune Godhead, The Lord God Jehovah, and all the while knowing that he is the creature and He the Creator, how can it be anything but spiritual, even if he uses a physical voice. He is speaking to God. That means spiritual. Anything with God is spiritual. This is very basic.
Samuel talked audibly with the Lord.
Many of the prophets talked audibly with the Lord.
The fact that it is audible or silent is totally irrelevant. Do people pray aloud and use their voice in your church. If their prayer is aloud and they use their voice does that make it carnal and not spiritual? What is your point then?

If you don't know Scripture, open up the Bible and then quote it. You are not quoting any Scripture here. I don't see it.

1. Adam sinned.
2. In the day that Adam sinned he would die. Adam was dead.
3. After Adam died he continued to talk with God.
4. Thus "dead" does not mean incapable for Adam was capable and did carry on a conversation with God. Why do you refuse to look at the evidence set before you?

Did you look at the link where others are trying to show you the same thing?

 

You have some good points here, Willis.

The idea, though, that everyone's salvation is ultimately up to them rather than God is off still.

If we love him BECAUSE he first loved us then our salvation is ultimately up to God and not us.

If God loves everybody then that verse means that EVERYBODY (in a salvific way) will love God. Why? Because we love him for this reason- he first loved us.

His loving us is what CAUSED us to love him.

If it CAUSED us to love him and if it is for everybody then why did it not CAUSE the non-elect to love him?

Saving faith is a gift from God to those who alone are the elect of God.

 

man is a tri/dual part being though...

One part of himcan indeed be dead, while rest still alive...

Again, is the Devil still physically alive, were Adam and Eve after they had died spiritually?

 

Dead in his spirit, alive in his flesh body....

You do know that until/unlesss the Lord grants us spiritual life thru Christ again, that we are cut off from Him, that we are at war against Him, as our natural natures cannot/or want to come to God?

 

Far more than all of that happened here...

You have it that humanity got "marred/scarred" by the fall, Bible says that all of us were ruined by it, and due to that, are both depraived and unable to come back to God in ourselves and restore fellowship, as literally God has to come to us and restablish it!

 

Is faith something that God supernaturally injected into you? Is that the gift? Or is the gift something He provided for those who will hear His word and believe on it?

 

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

While it is indeed true that "faith comes by hearing, and that by the Word of God"

before That aspect can even occur, God has to 'prepare" and enable us to be in the position where we than can hear exercise faith in jesus!

 

JF,

It might possibly the that the reason many "non-cals" will not grant "faith" as THE gift is had nothing to do with "who" in authority man or God, but rather that God grants this same measure of "potential" faith to all men.

 

Good points.

What do youu mean by "supernaturally injected?" Not picking, but that almost comes across sarcastically, and perhaps, that is your intent, if I am wrong, I apologize.

But, doesn't God place the Holy Spirit within us? Are you, when saying "inject" alluding to this gift of the Spirit as an example, and to Him being placed inside us, as the methodology? I ask sincerely.

Another way I see your wording is that you may be perhaps implying God forcing Himself on a believer, in opposition to we arguing that He gave us the gift of faith to believe. If I am wrong about that, then my apologies. This is though what it looks like to me. Also, if this is the case, that you are arguing for, I don't believe any of us felt forced, but most certainly overwhelmed and compelled, and enabled to believe.

Now, what have we received, that we were not given? If faith were inherent, then was this also not a gift? (I don't believe it was inherent, I believe it was given during the process of instantaneous salvation, following prevenient Grace.)

2 Peter 1:1 and other passages show faith as a gift, and the context, as in other epistles, that begin with praise for salvation, follows this same context here, that it was a gift resulting in salvation.

 

Could be understand Gershom wrong in this, THINK that he is saying God grants unto us the 'gift of faith" whe nwe meet the requirment for it by placing faith in jesus Christ...

 

No I wasn't being sarcastic, but well-meaning. I understand your point concerning the Holy Spirit which is most certainly a gift. What I meant by the question of injecting faith (as a gift) in a similar way, is that, does God somehow take this faith and place in a person without the means of the Word?

edited to add: "(as a gift) in a similar way"

 

Oh, well my apologies if I've offended.

But we both know the passage for this:

"So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the Word of Christ." Romans 10:17

So the faith came externally, not from within, for it came by the Word of Christ, in the same way, that by the Word of Christ, all life comes, as seen through the Creation, and by Him raising Lazarus, and throughout the Scriptures this is explicitly taught. This is in one way I see it coming as an external gift.

 

The scriptures say Jesus loved the young rich ruler, but he failed to trust Christ and went away unsaved, so the scriptures do not teach that God loving us CAUSES us to love him back. You err.