For those that drink alcohol

[saturneptune]

I was not referring to the Church in Europe. My observation was about society at large.

Thanks for posting that. This person constantly takes posts out of context and runs a different direction with the thread which eventually ends up in a selected poster of the day being called an unsaved person. This has been going on six months.

 

[annsni]

Yeah, I believe in all states, it's legal for a child to have a drink in their own home when supervised by their parents. Unless it was for a cultural thing, I'd not do it personally but I do know of families who have wine with dinner including the children (watered down and just a small amount).

When I drank, I drank for the taste. I never would drink to get a buzz so it would be one small glass of wine or a mixed drink, sometimes a beer. I found them all quite yummy and appropriate for the occasion like a beer with wings, wine with pasta or steak and a nice margharita on a hot summer day. I do miss the taste but find that there's really nothing out there that is non-alcoholic that tastes the same. Oh well.

 

[saturneptune]

Yeah, I believe in all states, it's legal for a child to have a drink in their own home when supervised by their parents. Unless it was for a cultural thing, I'd not do it personally but I do know of families who have wine with dinner including the children (watered down and just a small amount).

When I drank, I drank for the taste. I never would drink to get a buzz so it would be one small glass of wine or a mixed drink, sometimes a beer. I found them all quite yummy and appropriate for the occasion like a beer with wings, wine with pasta or steak and a nice margharita on a hot summer day. I do miss the taste but find that there's really nothing out there that is non-alcoholic that tastes the same. Oh well.

I agree 100%. As long as a child is being brought up in the nurture and adminition of the Lord, it is none of the concern of the old bats at church that like to extend their nose into everyones life. Christian parents have the Holy Spirit leading them, and there is no better person on earth to look after and protect the welfare of a child. Government and local church gossips can butt out.

 

[Revmitchell]

I started drinking when I was 5 years old. My parents would give me sips of their beer. Of course when they had friends over and they drank quite heavily that would turn into 20 or 30 sips which is quite a lot.

I was a full blown alcoholic by the time I was 17 years old. It is best that we not go down that road with our children. The stakes are just to real and very high. There is nothing harmless about it.

 

[saturneptune]

I started drinking when I was 5 years old. My parents would give me sips of their beer. Of course when they had friends over and they drank quite heavily that would turn into 20 or 30 sips which is quite a lot.

I was a full blown alcoholic by the time I was 17 years old. It is best that we not go down that road with our children. The stakes are just o real and very high. There is nothing harmless about it.

I cannot disagree except to say, that is something your parents, under the leadership of the Holy Spirit should have not done. It is the parents who bring up the child, not the local church gossip.

 

[Baptist4life]

IMHO, all one needs do is to just look at the havoc alcohol has reeked on our society (broken homes, cheating spouses, alcohol addiction, car crashes claiming lives, etc.), and ask yourself WHY any Christian would want anything to do with it. Parents giving alcohol to their children, especially Christian parents, shocks me, frankly. Is that REALLY a Godly example we want to be showing them? Maybe I'm "old fashioned", maybe some would call me something else, but I had an alcoholic father, and an alcoholic cousin, and I've seen what alcohol can do to a family. All from a "harmless little sip" when young. People, and especially Christian people, would be wise to leave alcohol alone.

That's all I'll say. Should be enough. The old phrase "playing with fire" comes to mind.

 

[Gina B]

Yes, I understand the fear of alcoholism. It's a horrible thing. I wish alcohol would not be legal except for medicinal purposes, but it is. Not only is it available, it's readily accessible, even by minors.

Thus my question. Like it or not, they're exposed to alcohol on a regular basis. It is seen as acceptable.

I might call it sin to drink it, but that doesn't mean I'm right. It just means I have a healthy fear of it based on life experiences.

I deal with teens on a regular basis. Parents would be shocked by what they don't know about their children, especially the more straight laced ones who "know" everything about their kids, in their opinion.

They WILL try alcohol. They will look their parent or guardian in the eye and lie about where they are and what they're doing, but they will try it. I rarely meet an older teen who hasn't, doesn't have a plan to do so, or isn't already entrenched in the thrill of getting out of the house under false pretenses and drinking with friends.

So, that's my question. I have to wonder if these kids would be less enthralled if they were introduced to alcohol at home, with it normalized as something you either don't want to do or want to be very limited on, vs having their first experience be out of control and with who knows who/what ready to take advantage of the situation.

 

[Tom Butler]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Butler
I can tell by the tone of the discussion that we have reached a new freedom.
Catholics can now eat meat on Friday.
Jews can eat pork.

Baptists can drink in front of each other.

I do not drink so have no real feeling one way or the other about the issue. It serves no purpose not to talk about it. If one cannot make a Biblical case for abstinence, then I cannot see how it is a new freedom to either drink or not drink. Abusing alcohol is without a doubt a sin. So is abusing ones body by stuffing 4000 calories down it a day, and so is gossip. One of the reasons I was not a big fan of scraping the old bylaws and Constitution in favor of the Southern Baptist Faith and Message was that this document does not have a reference to drinking that the old document did. I do not think the congregation realized that. In other words, if one wanted to get technical, we removed the requirement about abstinence.

I want to make it clear that my comments about Baptists' drinking in front of each other was a JOKE. Although, there is some basis in reality.

 

[saturneptune]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Butler
I can tell by the tone of the discussion that we have reached a new freedom.
Catholics can now eat meat on Friday.
Jews can eat pork.

Baptists can drink in front of each other.




I want to make it clear that my comments about Baptists' drinking in front of each other was a JOKE. Although, there is some basis in reality.

We need to discuss this over our usual watering hole. If I get there before you do, I will get your usual, Jack and Coke.

 

[Arbo]

We need to discuss this over our usual watering hole. If I get there before you do, I will get your usual, Jack and Coke.

Breakfast before church tomorrow?:laugh:

 

[Revmitchell]

Yes, I understand the fear of alcoholism. It's a horrible thing. I wish alcohol would not be legal except for medicinal purposes, but it is. Not only is it available, it's readily accessible, even by minors.

Thus my question. Like it or not, they're exposed to alcohol on a regular basis. It is seen as acceptable.

I might call it sin to drink it, but that doesn't mean I'm right. It just means I have a healthy fear of it based on life experiences.

I deal with teens on a regular basis. Parents would be shocked by what they don't know about their children, especially the more straight laced ones who "know" everything about their kids, in their opinion.

They WILL try alcohol. They will look their parent or guardian in the eye and lie about where they are and what they're doing, but they will try it. I rarely meet an older teen who hasn't, doesn't have a plan to do so, or isn't already entrenched in the thrill of getting out of the house under false pretenses and drinking with friends.

So, that's my question. I have to wonder if these kids would be less enthralled if they were introduced to alcohol at home, with it normalized as something you either don't want to do or want to be very limited on, vs having their first experience be out of control and with who knows who/what ready to take advantage of the situation.

I have never understood the logic that says introduce things to children what you do not want them to do later. As far as children doing things their parents do not know about, apparently the parents did not do well to teach their children about honesty and integrity.

 

[annsni]

See, I grew up in an Irish family. They drank. Some relatives drank to excess but not my immediate family (parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles). From as little as I can remember, I used to dip my finger in my parent's scotch and soda. I also used to take sips here and there and always loved the taste. I went on to drink socially as I grew up but never got drunk. Ever. So it's not a given that one who partakes in sips as a child will become an alcoholic.

 

[Revmitchell]

It is a given that it is too high a risk.

 

[mont974x4]

Other nations have less of a taboo attached to alcohol than we do here in the US and they have fewer alcohol related issues.

There is something in the fallen nature of man that drives us to desire what we are told to not mess with. We see it in the touch of objects with a wet paint sign on them. We saw it with Prohibition and we see it in the current failure known as the war on drugs.


I agree we have a problem with hypocrisy, and its cousin called inconsistency. I would suggest we do not need a blanket policy to abstain. We need to teach everything God says on the issue in His Word. We also need to remove the mystery and taboo of alcohol. We'll have fewer issues with alcohol abuse, misuse, and hypocrisy.

 

[saturneptune]

IMHO, all one needs do is to just look at the havoc alcohol has reeked on our society (broken homes, cheating spouses, alcohol addiction, car crashes claiming lives, etc.), and ask yourself WHY any Christian would want anything to do with it. Parents giving alcohol to their children, especially Christian parents, shocks me, frankly. Is that REALLY a Godly example we want to be showing them? Maybe I'm "old fashioned", maybe some would call me something else, but I had an alcoholic father, and an alcoholic cousin, and I've seen what alcohol can do to a family. All from a "harmless little sip" when young. People, and especially Christian people, would be wise to leave alcohol alone.

That's all I'll say. Should be enough. The old phrase "playing with fire" comes to mind.

We never allowed alcohol in our house. While the kids were growing up, they knew the negative effects as taught by us, and knew not to drink. However, we did not harp on the subject or cram it down their throat. So many times, I believe, parents make it an 18 year sermon, then when the kids can drink, they go hog wild. Our kids today are married, with good jobs, families, and to my knowledge do not drink. The bottom line is that the guidance a child receives is the responsibility of the parents, not the government, and not others.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

See, I grew up in an Irish family. They drank. Some relatives drank to excess but not my immediate family (parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles). From as little as I can remember, I used to dip my finger in my parent's scotch and soda. I also used to take sips here and there and always loved the taste. I went on to drink socially as I grew up but never got drunk. Ever. So it's not a given that one who partakes in sips as a child will become an alcoholic.

Your making a great point Ann....that its really a personal choice.

If you make anything a taboo, than human nature steps in & wants to eventually taste that forbidden fruit. I was also raised around drinkers but I can leave it alone when I wish or pick it up (drink to excess) then put it down when I want. Thats my choice. Like a firearm, I can choose to use it, correctly, non-correctly or just leave it alone. Even a professed alcoholic can have the discipline of choice. In the end, its your character thats the demon if you choose unwisely, not the alcohol, not the gun, not the extra marital affair, etc. (And God helps to strengthen your resolve against bad behavior).

 

[Monster]

We never allowed alcohol in our house. While the kids were growing up, they knew the negative effects as taught by us, and knew not to drink. However, we did not harp on the subject or cram it down their throat. So many times, I believe, parents make it an 18 year sermon, then when the kids can drink, they go hog wild. Our kids today are married, with good jobs, families, and to my knowledge do not drink. The bottom line is that the guidance a child receives is the responsibility of the parents, not the government, and not others.

Just the opposite for me. Dad was a fall down drunk and believe it or not, still a decent provider...go figure. Strangely enough, I was allowed sips. Not so strangely, I grew into a fall down drunk.

I respect and appreciate your decisions posted above, saturnneptune. This next is generally addressed.

Allowing kids to drink booze? It's a roll of the dice, a game of Russian roulette...choose your analogy. One thing is certain though, if you teach and enforce abstinence in your home, at the very least your child/children will gain an understanding of the parental, authoritative view (the same could be argued in reverse fashion). That's not to say they won't go astray but if they do, it wasn't an enforced behavior begun in the home.

 

[annsni]

Your making a great point Ann....that its really a personal choice.

If you make anything a taboo, than human nature steps in & wants to eventually taste that forbidden fruit. I was also raised around drinkers but I can leave it alone when I wish or pick it up (drink to excess) then put it down when I want. Thats my choice. Like a firearm, I can choose to use it, correctly, non-correctly or just leave it alone. Even a professed alcoholic can have the discipline of choice. In the end, its your character thats the demon if you choose unwisely, not the alcohol, not the gun, not the extra marital affair, etc. (And God helps to strengthen your resolve against bad behavior).

Yep. We've not forbidden our daughters from drinking alcohol but when my oldest turned 21, she asked if she should have a drink now because she was legal. I told her she absolutely could if she felt it was the right thing to do. She thought about it and at this point will be 23 in March and still hasn't had anything.

 

[InTheLight]

Would you have a problem with giving your kid a drink in the privacy of your own home?

Would you allow your child to "try" a few sips of alcohol in the hopes that they'd think it was nasty and not want to try it again, or so that they'd get that curiosity out of their system while under your supervision rather than trying it with someone who may be untrustworthy or may encourage them to keep going even if they didn't like it?

I would never offer alcohol to my children for this purpose. A couple of things you will never hear me say are, "Son, have a beer" and "Why don't you pursue an acting career."

Sometimes at family dinners wine will be served (I don't have any, I don't like wine) but if my kids were 21 years old and in attendance when wine was offered I would bite my tongue and observe what they do.

 

[Greektim]

Funny that we keep talking about alcohol and parenting. One of the most intimate times I've had with my father was having a beer after golfing together. We've never opened up like that before. Great moment.