Freewill here? Not a chance.

Judges... enggggggk.

Your spirit in eternal regardless of the rebirth. The question is where it will spend eternity.

No, you have God being in absolute control of all things except a decision made by people who hate him. Classic. </font>[/QUOTE]Amen!!! The spirit of man is eternal regardless of rebirth. The result of the 'born again' is eternal life.

Amen! Amen! Amen!

All men will be resurrected by the power of God, salvation brings adoption into the family of God;

Amen, Amen.

It is time we hear these things preached to the people.

Bro. Dallas

 

I agree all men will be resurrected, but to what? Believers to eternal life with the Christ, but non-believers, those whose names are not found in the book of life, to the lake of fire, the second and final death!

 

If the spirit of man understands only the things of man....., and cannot comprehend the things of God....., and the Spirit of God is required to comprehend the things of God....., at what point does this Spirit of God enter us to allow us to understand? If we are born with this Spirit of God and able to comprehend the things of God, and have the ability to choose the things of God, then why would we need the new birth? If we had the abillity within ourselves to choose good over evil, why would we need a savior? Wouldn't we be justly judged by our choices....? This sounds to me like being under the law.

Do you think it wrong, that this new birth is when the Spirit of God displaces the spirit of man and enables us to understand the things of God and believe?

 

Better to be a puppet in heaven than to have free will(which really doesn't exist) in hell.

Arminians might want to consider a quote from Satan in John Milton's Paradise Lost that has stuck with me since I read it in high school about 30 years ago - "Better to rule in hell than serve in heaven".

Arminians might want to consider what is more important to them - the alleged power they crave in their "free will" or the true power of God to save all of His people by His free, sovereign grace.

 

Continue your study of this, the second death has no finality to be found in it. It involves eternal dying, but never death.

Bro. Dallas

 

Hey Preach the Word, you went to bed beside yourself and when you got up you were sad. Are these emotional states the result of
"Your parents
Your genes (DNA)
Your brothers and sisters
Your birth order
Your time of birth
Your place of birth?"
or are they the result of sinful choices?

 

TomMann,

At the point where the individual man believes that Jesus is the Son of God, the Christ, and submits his own will to the Spirit of God.

What you do not seem to understand is that man coming to belief in God and submitting to God is not an instantaneous change from spiritual infancy to spiritual maturity. We do not have to have a complete understanding of the things of God in order to believe in His Son, the Christ. We do not have to have a complete understanding of God to be saved. Very little of the things of God are available to us when we first "convert" from sinner to saint because before we believed we did not have the Holy Spirit revealing those things to us.

We are not born with THE Spirit of God. However,We are spirit as God is spirit. God's Spirit is Holy and Pure, man's spirit has no holiness. God's Spirit is eternal, omniscient, omnipotent, and all the other omni-attributes we know to be true of God. God's spirit is Gracious toward man, Loving toward Man, Merciful toward Man, and is patiently waiting to fulfill his Justice toward man.

Though man's spirit is limited to the non-omni-attributes of God, his spirit has some abilities. Man's spirit is able to hear the word of God, to "think on these things", to reason over the knowledge it has, and it is capable of choosing for itself what it will believe and act upon, and what it will reject. That is free will! Each man has the ability to determine, within the constraints of creation, what it will do. Thus we have believers and non-believers.

We do not need, and indeed cannot have physical rebirth, but we do need and can have spiritual rebirth. That is, the persuasion of our spirit can be changed, sometimes with small subtleties, often with dramatic results. It is spiritual change that being Born Again is all about.

What scripture are you reading that says God's Spirit displaces man's spirit? If that could happen, instantly upon conversion man would be God! Man retains his own spirit, but submits his spirit to God, thus submitting himself to God.

 

Continue your study of this, the second death has no finality to be found in it. It involves eternal dying, but never death.

Bro. Dallas </font>[/QUOTE]God's word speaks of the second death as being final. That is there is no redemption for those who experience it!

 

What Milton did not consider is that everyone in heaven serves, while there can be only one ruler in Hell! Therefore all but one in hell serves.

Kind of a bogus argument against free will!

 

I have a question to ask. I believe the doctrine of Eternal Security, but I don't necessarily believe that I was predestined for salvation. Does that make me Calvinist, or Arminian?

 

An Arminian ... The lines of calvinism and armianism really deal with election and sovereignty of God in salvation. A personal who does not believe they were predestined for salvation but does believe in eternal security is somewhat inconsistent but they do exist, as you demonstrate for us.

 

Continue your study of this, the second death has no finality to be found in it. It involves eternal dying, but never death.

Bro. Dallas </font>[/QUOTE]God's word speaks of the second death as being final. That is there is no redemption for those who experience it! </font>[/QUOTE]But has no finality. It is an eternal dying.

Bro. Dallas

 

Continue your study of this, the second death has no finality to be found in it. It involves eternal dying, but never death.

Bro. Dallas </font>[/QUOTE]God's word speaks of the second death as being final. That is there is no redemption for those who experience it! </font>[/QUOTE]But has no finality. It is an eternal dying.

Bro. Dallas </font>[/QUOTE]Nevertheless, it is the final event in the unbelievers life! There is nothing recorded for the unbeliever after being cast into the lake of fire. Therefore since scripture calls the lake of fire "the second death" and there is no other inspired writing relating to man, it is final!

 

And by this is how you "win" souls to Christ. What do you call it?

Bro.dallas

 

And by this is how you "win" souls to Christ. What do you call it?

Bro.dallas </font>[/QUOTE]

 

Preach the Word . . . in Central Florida,

Calling people who are more Arminian in theology, non-sovereignists, may do something for Calvinists, but I think it merely drives a wedge between Christians. We merely believe that His perfect sovereignty has ordained and included in His plan the free will of all sinner and saints. Did it take any more might for God to use a plan including a free will than one which He might have used without free agency of human beings, created in His image?

A brother,

Ray

 

Yelsew,

Again your answer is right on target.

In Adam all sinners experience a 'first spiritual death from birth;' [Romans 5:12] those who are in Christ will not experience the 'second death.' [Romans 5:18b] All sinners who experience the 'second death' will remain in the Lake of Fire forever. [Rev. 20:14] Why? Because they did not use their free will by receiving Christ as their only payment for their sins. [John 3:16; John 5:24; John 1:12]

 

The Traveling Minstrel,

All Arminian theologians would agree with you list of things that we have no control over. You are right. For example, I had to be born in Schenectady, New York because this was His plan.

We as theologians who believe in sovereignty also believe that it was His plan to infuse us with a free will either to believe in Jesus or to neglect His saving benefits. He was and is sovereign in this as well as when He sovereignly chose to allow Adam and Eve to preside over the Garden of Eden.

If Unconditional Election were Biblical then there would be no reason for a sinner to be responsible toward Almighty God relative to the Adamic nature and sins of commission and omission. But since He calls for repentance and faith and trust in Him we know this has to be factored into His overall plan for human beings. No faith/trust; no everlasting salvation through His plan and Being.

Of all the contours in theology Arminianism is closest to the Divine truth coming from our blessed Lord. Calvinism has too many blind alleys and way too many theological holes for me to embrace.

Arminianism does not place human authority over that of God. We see and know of His sovereignty but we acknowledge man's response to the call of the Gospel. This is to our credit!

Salvation come from Jesus alone and by His inestimable and measureless grace.