Fundamentalism, Gnosticism, and Quaker "inner light"

1. This would do with unconditional keeping of his covenant (in context).

2. Does this refer to a "call" to preach or to salvation?

3. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

4. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

5. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

6. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

7. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

8. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

9. Salvation again (which always includes sanctification and therefore service toward one another).

I saw a distinct pattern in those verses Bob. We know what they say and mean. This discussion is about a particular "inner light or feeling" that people use to determine obedience to God. It is subjective and has no biblical support. Obviously, when one is saved, he/she is going to serve others.

Have a nice day.

 

Preachers,

Do you believe that the Holy Spirit can impress on your heart what to preach on a given Sunday?

Thanks,

Jason

 

Clearly, preachers need to be sensitive to those around him and know the circumstances that exist within the church. He can address those issues like that.

In counseling sessions, something might come to mind.

If a particular book needs to be taught in one concentrated effore, then do that.

I would say that the Lord might bring something to mind in rememberance or something like that. That isn't the same thing as the whole "God led me to do...". I wonder how many times God brought something to the pastor's attention so that he would really study it and then preach it only to have the preacher shoot from the hip on the issue.

 

Be careful. You sound like you are talking about needs preaching

 

Great conclusion. That is exactly what I was talking about.

There is a big difference between addressing issues from your sermon and using issues to determine your sermon.

Now, back to the original discussion...

 

Is the "Uh" necessary or are you just searching for something to say? Yes, someone did say that it is not supported by Scripture.

I beg to differ. The intitial post says nothing whatsoever regarding the call to preach. I'll copy it here so you will not have to go to the first page to view it.

Siegfried posted:
"Over the past several months I have been studying church history in general and Baptist history in particular. Some of the historical facts I've encountered have interacted with some strains of modern Fundamentalism in a manner I did not expect.

First, Gnosticism was more than just a heresy with bad Christology. Although Gnosticism was remarkably nebulous and diffuse, even for a cult, a primary principle was its unique view of special revelation. Gnostics emphasized a special revelation of Christian knowledge that was only available to the elite few.

Second, some of the early English Baptists, John Smyth and Roger Wiliams among them, spoke out against the Quaker "inner light" theology. Quakers believed that God guided people in life's decisions by some internal revelation of truth.

Here's my conclusion. Much of Fundamentalism's modern day terminology and theology was rejected by both the early church fathers and our Baptist ancestors as heresy.

How many times have we heard someone say these things?
1. "God told me to . . ."
2. "I prayed and God led me to . . ."
3. "God called me to . . ."
4. "I know that [fill in the blank] is true because God showed me . . ."
5. "I believe that the [translation acronym] is the only Word of God because God speaks to me through it.

Please understand, I am not attacking the conclusions these individuals reach. I am simply pointing out that the methods of reaching those conclusions have historically been rejected as un-Scriptural and heretical." emphasis mine.

Please highlight for me the part that limits this discussion to "the call to preach."

 

I always think the open and closed door philosophy is interesting....how can we determine what a closed door means,it could mean many different things to different people...who is correct in interpreting what it means,you or I? I don't think so,so we can not determine God's will from that.

Maybe what you are talking about is God's providence...he does lead and guide us,we don't see or know what God is doing,but we know He is doing what He needs done. I can look back and see God's providence in areas of my life:my marriage,church situations,many things that God brought about in my life...but to KNOW when and how He leads us,that is unverifiable,and like I have said before,we sure can not base it on our feelings...

To say,I feel God is leading me to go talk to a person in sin is not correct,but I choose to go talk to the person because it is taught in scripture,so I know it is the right thing to do. I go back to the same ole argument,God leads through His word,the only thing we are sure of.

[ December 17, 2002, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: Molly ]

 

Gidday Sigfried,

The Holy Spirit speaks to us in an Audible Voice. Acts 8:29 "Then The Spirit said to Phillip, Go near and Overtake this chariot." Here is one example of Phillip having what we would term a Modern day "word" from the Lord.

The Holy Spirit is indeed the Teacher of the bible. 1Cor 2:12-13 "Now we have recieved not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from GOd, that we might know things that have been freely given by God. These things we also speak, not in Words which mans wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Remember, The Holy Spirit is the third member of the Godhead. He is truly and properly God and truly and properly Spirit. God is way more than a "Guiding light" He is your Lord and Saviour, Emmanuel God with Us.

 

The sad thing is that many people teach/preach against extrabiblical authorities when they look past themselves.

When you claim that "God has told you..." and all the other phrases that Siegfried posted, you are relying on extrabiblical authority no different from the charismatics.

 

Gnosticism is neither nebulous or diffuse...It may just not be as openly expressed as mainstreem religions such as Baptists. And it is not based on knowledge only available to an elite few. it's widespread and growing. Elite few? This is specifically against Gnostic belief.

The originator of Novus Spiritus, a gnostic religion, has also made this mistake in her statements about the Bible in her book Souls perfection. She states something as fact when I have read the Bible and can disprove it easily. What she said was that Satan is only mentioned 3 times in the Bible. I proved that Satan has been referred to 10 times by the name Satan and several other times as other names such as Beelzebub, Lucifer, the Serpent. How can anyone take what someone says about a given topic as fact, when it can be so easily disproved?

I understand that you may not have intended to state something that would be later debated as being incorrect.... I'm just saying that I have studied the gnostic religion and found your statement to be flawed.

[ December 17, 2002, 04:45 PM: Message edited by: WisdomSeeker ]

 

Siegfried,(did I spell that name right???)

I think that is where that saying comes from and,like you,I have come to understand that as an open door for sharing or teaching the gospel,not on detrmining God's will or guidance on any issue.

 

That is where I think we disagree...it is available to everyone.

Gnosis means to know God, it's greek isn't it?.

Different interpretations are what every person has when studying every kind of religion...including Christianity. The revealing of what is meant by scripture comes gradually...little by little. Understanding comes with study and prayer. This is true in every religion I have studied...especially Christianity.

Funny how all religions have so many simularities...why is that?

As for me... I'll keep seeking until I find the answers...so much information...so little time.

As to us having divergent opinions about gnosticism... I agree that with my study of ancient gnosticism it did appear to be more cult like than modern gnosticism. The things I read, were alarming disimilar to modern day gnostics. Well... I guess that could be said about Baptist too...no revelation in that statement.

[ December 17, 2002, 06:10 PM: Message edited by: WisdomSeeker ]

 

John 16:7-15
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. 8And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9Of sin, because they believe not on me; 10Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 11Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. 12I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. 13Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come. 14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it unto you. 15All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall show it unto you.

What I mean by details of life is the application of Biblical principles in the individual decisions that each person makes in their life that are not clearly spoken about in the Bible. No Christian is to marry an unsaved person (2 Corinthians 6:14) this is clearly dealt with. However, should little Bobby marry little Peggy Sue (they are both Christians) is not dealt with. This is where the Holy Spirit illuminates the Biblical principle to the individual.

The above verse says that the Holy Spirit guides in all truth not just ones clearly expressed in the Bible, but would include the application of Biblical principles in the daily life. If the Holy Spirit did not guide the Christian in how to apply the Bible the he or she would be left to use human wisdom. All human wisdom is unreliable because of the sin nature, which will not be eradicated until we get our glorified bodies.

 

God is Consistant with His Word Seigfried, If in the New Testament The Holy Ghost speaks to Phillip in an Audible voice, then it is not going against what scripture is saying to suggest that He can.

No where in the New Testament can I find it written that the Holy Spirit cannot speak in an audible voice. So it is not unreasonable to reason, that this is in fact one of the ways in which he does work.

I think the reason that people do not hear more often from the Holy Spirit, is the fact that people are afraid to get to know Him.