Gambling vs. Candy

[Winman]

Great. We need to call all of the missions agencies, and tell them, "NO MORE CHARITY." We are not supposed to get money for free. Also, we need to tell our members to refuse any inheritance from dead relatives, Earned Income Credit on their taxes, and any "buy one get one free" offers at the store...

:laugh:

No, a missionary wants money so he CAN work, bringing people to Christ in foreign lands. A rich man wants money so he can work with it and earn even more money.

But most lottery players are trying to get out of working ever again. I have heard people joke around about the lottery at work many times over the years, and the first thing they say is "You'll never see me HERE again!". The very FIRST thing they plan on doing is retiring. And I don't blame them, I probably would too.

Now, with tongue out of cheek: The principle is NOT that we are not supposed to get money for free. That is nowhere in the scriptures. The principle is that we are supposed to work hard. There are plenty of missionaries, which live on donations, yet work hard. There are plenty of rich people, who inherited money, yet work hard. There are even lottery winners, who won the money, and yet work hard.

There is no Bible verse which makes gambling wrong in and of itself.

Gambling is a scam. The odds are always stacked in the casino's favor. Sure, there will be a few winners, but most folks are going to lose their money trying to get rich quick. It is a form of legal stealing.

That is not the same as stocks and bonds, you can always cash them in. You may take a penalty, but you are going to get your money back.

An inheritance is not gambling, you do not bet to obtain an inheritance. That is money your family worked hard for and desires to hand down to their children. And parents certainly hope their children will use the money or property for useful purposes, they sure don't want you to go out and buy lottery tickets with it.

 

[preachinjesus]

I wonder why it is one of the arguments against a lottery system is it is wrong for people not to work.

This notion rips the context of the passage apart and imports a terrible hermeneutic onto the text. Are we saying retirees are sinning? Are we saying that it is God's absolute plan for a person to work from their birth until death? What about school children? Or college students?

I'll be honest, if I were be granted a significant sum of money where I could live without having to work (say winning the lottery) I would have zero problems theologically with quitting everything and being happy traveling, enjoying life, and being able to have the freedom to do whatever I desire without any condition of remuneration.

This isn't anti-biblical, but it is (honestly) the hope of many. I'm saving for retirement so that as I get old and decrepit I can rest my weary bones and not be forced to work.

The arguments against gambling I've seen around this place (specifically the "its laziness" or "you get something for nothing") are pretty bad arguments.

 

[John of Japan]

I wonder why it is one of the arguments against a lottery system is it is wrong for people not to work.

This notion rips the context of the passage apart and imports a terrible hermeneutic onto the text. Are we saying retirees are sinning? Are we saying that it is God's absolute plan for a person to work from their birth until death? What about school children? Or college students?

Retirees have already earned their retirement by working and saving for it. It's ridiculous to suggest retirees as a counter argument for gambling. As for school children working, you're kidding, right? No one is saying that.

As for college students, I worked 40 hours a week in a factory to put myself through college. I graduated debt free. I get pretty tired of kids complaining about college expenses myself. Get out there and work, young people!

Lamentations 3--
27 It is good for a man that he bear the yoke in his youth.
28 He sitteth alone and keepeth silence, because he hath borne it upon him.

I'll be honest, if I were be granted a significant sum of money where I could live without having to work (say winning the lottery) I would have zero problems theologically with quitting everything and being happy traveling, enjoying life, and being able to have the freedom to do whatever I desire without any condition of remuneration.

This isn't anti-biblical, but it is (honestly) the hope of many. I'm saving for retirement so that as I get old and decrepit I can rest my weary bones and not be forced to work.

The arguments against gambling I've seen around this place (specifically the "its laziness" or "you get something for nothing") are pretty bad arguments.

It's right there in the Bible, 2 Thess. 3:
10 For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.
11 For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies.
12 Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread.

 

[preachinjesus]

So I've got a friend who inherited a significant sum of money from his grandparents after they had passed away. Its enough for him never to work again (he's 45) and he doesn't.

So we're saying he is in sin?

 

[Havensdad]

No, a missionary wants money so he CAN work, bringing people to Christ in foreign lands. A rich man wants money so he can work with it and earn even more money.

But most lottery players are trying to get out of working ever again. I have heard people joke around about the lottery at work many times over the years, and the first thing they say is "You'll never see me HERE again!". The very FIRST thing they plan on doing is retiring. And I don't blame them, I probably would too.

And there you have it. You are calling something sin, by judging another persons motives. Although none of us play the lottery, I was meeting with several pastor friends yesterday, and this very subject came up. We talked about the missionary endeavors we would implement if God were to bless us in such a way. One of the pastors actually said that one of his members HAD won the (state) lottery about 10 years ago. The man did not use it for idleness; he used it good, and still continued to work.

Gambling is a scam. The odds are always stacked in the casino's favor. Sure, there will be a few winners, but most folks are going to lose their money trying to get rich quick. It is a form of legal stealing.

Its not stealing. Stealing is involuntary. The odds are well known, and published. No question its stupid. However, this still does not make it sinful.

That is not the same as stocks and bonds, you can always cash them in. You may take a penalty, but you are going to get your money back.

Not so. Tell that to people who have bought stocks, only to have a company go bankrupt. My Father in law lost a most of his retirement a few years ago, when the economy tanked. It is, in principle, no different than gambling (though the odds are better).

An inheritance is not gambling, you do not bet to obtain an inheritance. That is money your family worked hard for and desires to hand down to their children. And parents certainly hope their children will use the money or property for useful purposes, they sure don't want you to go out and buy lottery tickets with it.

Why do you keep shifting categories? You said it was sinful because you are getting money for nothing. We have established that getting money you do not work for, is NOT sinful.

Again, there is nothing in the Bible about Gambling. It is stupid, but not sinful.

 

[mont974x4]

Who was it that said a lottery is the perfect tax because it is entirely voluntary?

 

[John of Japan]

So I've got a friend who inherited a significant sum of money from his grandparents after they had passed away. Its enough for him never to work again (he's 45) and he doesn't.

So we're saying he is in sin?

I did quote some Scripture.

But personally I can't imagine not working somehow. If he's not working a job, surely he's working for the Lord somehow, or doing charity, or being useful to society somehow. Otherwise, statistics show that people who retire and are then inactive, die sooner.

 

[gb93433]

And there you have it. You are calling something sin, by judging another persons motives.

There is a reason why Proverbs is in scripture.

Although none of us play the lottery, I was meeting with several pastor friends yesterday, and this very subject came up. We talked about the missionary endeavors we would implement if God were to bless us in such a way. One of the pastors actually said that one of his members HAD won the (state) lottery about 10 years ago. The man did not use it for idleness; he used it good, and still continued to work.

We can rationalize anything we want to support if we like. That you may have said that he used it for good may not be all the truth of it but ask the question was it completely good. He is an example for others to follow. How many have followed him and gotten into trouble because of his example. Isn't that kind of like saying that just because a doctor sees a woman naked that it is okay for everyone else to do the same. After all what is the difference?

Many of the lottery winners are poor people who have used welfare checks to buy tickets. Many of the lottery winners have gotten into serious financial trouble later too.

While scripture does not address a lot of things there is wisdom. Just because I can have a big bottle of wine sitting on the table does not mean someone else can.

So how useful is it for others to follow in the footsteps of the lottery winners? How does that example lead to godliness?

It seems that today we have a lot of people screaming the same nonsense as the world. "Don't judge me." We may not be able to judge their motives but we can judge their actions.

I few days ago I spoke with a lady and she brought up her views on homosexuality. I told her there is the standard and God is the judge. She that is true and we cannot judge, and therefore we should not. She told me that 10% of the people have an affinity toward homosexuality. I told her that is not true and that if it were homosexuality is defined by action not how someone was born. I went onto tell her that if I have troubles with anger that does not mean I am free to get angry at people.