Giving it your all (tithing)

[blackbird]

A lot of people get hung up on the idea that the tithe belonged in the Old Testament--"Its what the Jew did living under the law! We're not under the law anymore but we're under grace! We give under grace!"

Well, anytime you let a Jew living under the law do more than you can do living under grace, you, dear friend, are a disgrace to grace! We New Testament believers are free to give way beyond what the law says give!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

[blackbird]

Those Jews were bound under the law to do what it was they were to do----grace puts us above the law were "The Sky is the Limit!" Can't no law hold me back from giving what it is I need to give because I love the Lord Jesus Christ!

Your buddy,
Blackbird

 

[Sherrie]

Listen! I know without a shadow of doubt God takes care of me! And he trust me to do certain things. There was no income coming in my house, while my husband was dying with heart failure, God took care of everyone our needs and then some! We never once went behind in anything! I prayed and so did my husband, and God took care of things! Then there were responsibilities, that God trusted from us...and then when my husband died...there were things God expected from me!

And without saying look at me...There are other things that God trusted me to do, and still does.

Who pays those electric bills at Church..if no one tithes. Who pays for the Pastors family to eat every night if you do not tithe? Who buys those Sunday School Books if you do not tithe? Who paid the water bill that went into that baptismal?

Who do you even begin to give Glory, Honor, and Praise to?

I am not going to take any test and see! I know what God expects from me! I am not going to tempt Him!

I tithe my income. I also give offerings. I also give my time. I have given away many things. And I thank God, He lets me do so! And i n everything I do, I do it in the name of Jesus. I also do thing anonymously.

Sherrie

 

[stubbornkelly]

Who pays those electric bills at Church..if no one tithes. Who pays for the Pastors family to eat every night if you do not tithe? Who buys those Sunday School Books if you do not tithe? Who paid the water bill that went into that baptismal?

I think we're putting a lot of stock in language, not that that's bad, but we can easily make an illogical conclusion that those that don't tithe, don't give. I don't tithe, but I do give, and the money I give goes into the bill paying pot, just like everyone else's. But it's not a tithe.

Now, my question is, would some call my giving a tithe, even though that's not what it is?

 

[Istherenotacause]

Originally posted by Sherrie:
Well.........

I tithe
I give offerings
I give my time

But the question was with Tithe in parenthesis. I also do not go around bragging about what I do, or how much I do! AND...I am so sure no matter what I do, or would do, it would never be enough!

Sherrie

It's never what we do , but what we allow the Lord to do through us, one of those things is giving to the church our tithe so God can in turn bless that tither. It's all a matter of faith, and we know that without faith, it is impossible to please God.

If we "pay" our tithes as a form of duty, surely God blesses that obedience, but when we GIVE our tithe cheerfully, God blesses a cheerful giver. That could be looked at as double-obedience and therefore receiving double blessings or two-fold blessings.

So cheer up everyone and give cheerfully!

Is There Not A Cause?

 

[Alcott]

Originally posted by blackbird:
"The Sky is the Limit!"

Alright, go ahead and give the sky.

 

[Dan Todd]

Istherenotacause said:

If we "pay" our tithes as a form of duty, surely God blesses that obedience, but when we GIVE our tithe cheerfully, God blesses a cheerful giver. That could be looked at as double-obedience and therefore receiving double blessings or two-fold blessings.

Many years ago - the Lord convicted me about cheerful giving. We quit passing the offering plate so no one felt pressured to give. Now we use a box - and folks can put in it they chose to.

I believe in tithing - storehouse tithing - all other giving that we do - Sunday School - missions, etc. is over and above the tithe. This is our conviction.

blackbird old buddy - Amen on both of your last two posts on this thread!!

 

[blackbird]

Well, you see! Here's the big "Tee-do!" We take SOME things in the Old Testament and bring them forward to were we're livin' in the New!! Things like "Thou shalt not kill!", "Thou shalt not commit adultery!"--so forth and so on!! We bring these easy things from the Old Testament into our lives today---we say, "Well, that command is easy! I ain't plannin' on killin' anybody! Why, I ain't even got a gun!"--so we obey that law simply by NOT killin'--easy law to obey!! We don't have to GIVE anything in obeying that law! All we have to do is NOT take life away from somebody! Its one of the easiest laws to obey! So is the adultery law!! Its an easy law to obey--all I have to do is remain committed to my wife!!

So we have a tendency to bring those laws along with us as we live in victory in the New Testament day of grace!!

Funny, but we also at the same time have another tendency to LEAVE the tithing law back where we believe it belongs--in the Old Testament! We don't want to obey it in the New Testament! OH, but we have no problem obeyin' the other laws we bring forward!

Friend, tithing is a law that those Jews believed by grace through faith in their coming Messiah!!!! Everytime they tithed by faith they were saying to those around them--"Messiah is coming! Messiah is coming!"

Everytime I obey the tithing law by grace through faith today---I'm telling everybody around me, "Jesus is coming again! Jesus is coming again!" When I stop tithing---I stop sending that message!

Your buddy,
Blackbird

 

[Dan Todd]

Blackbird you're confusing me - it's is not your post that confuses me - I think that the last one is great - and I agree with you.

But you capitalized the "B" when you signed your post - but you use the lower case "b" with your name in the upper left-hand corner. Which is correct?

Tithing preceded the law - Abraham - who was justified by faith - before the law was given - before he was circumcised - paid tithes.

 

[Lorelei]

We left the Tithe behind in the OT because that is where the Levitical priesthood stayed.

Before you jump to conclusions, let us not forget that people who don't tithe DO give, and often times more than 10%. We just choose not to live according to a miguided interpretation of an OT law. Before you say you tithe, go do some reading on what tithing actually entailed. Tithing never dealt with placing money into an offering plate. Storehouses were not temples, they were a place to "Store" the tithes that were brought. Grains and livestock needed a place to be stored.

Show me NT proof it is for the NT church. We can find NT verses that tell us not to kill but not one that tells us to tithe. They do tell us to give, but not tithe. Some may not be aware of this, but there IS a difference!

~Lorelei

 

[Sherrie]

Sherrie

 

[Daniel David]

Oh, they are aware. They just keep people under the hopeless shackles of the law.

People who preach that the tithe is a requirement for believers today are legalists in the purest sense of the word.

 

[Jim1999]

Whilst I do not believe the tithe is a New Testament commandment, I believe we have not started to give until we have tithed. If under the laws, the people gave ten percent, how much more ought we to give under grace?

Having said that, I would never ask a family suffering poverty or hard times, or even under bad management of finances and find themselves hard pressed, to concern themselves with the tithe per se. Give what you can and when you have no money, give time. The Lord will honour either.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[MissAbbyIFBaptist]

**Ok, just to let yun's know, I only read the first post to see what the topic was generaly about. In cases like this I'd rather post my veiw without knowing what anyone else says. I want to do this unbiased.
Is it a NT command? Well maybe not a command but definatly somwthing we should do. In Philipians 4 it says:
¶ But I rejoiced in the Lord greatly, that
now at the last your care of me hath
flourished again; wherein ye were also
careful, but ye lacked opportunity.
Php 4:11
Not that I speak in respect of want: for I
have learned, in whatsoever state I am,
therewith to be content.
Php 4:12
I know both how to be abased, and I know
how to abound: every where and in all
things I am instructed both to be full and to
be hungry, both to abound and to suffer
need.
Php 4:13
I can do all things through Christ which
strengtheneth me.
Php 4:14
Notwithstanding ye have well done, that ye
did communicate with my affliction.
Php 4:15
Now ye Philippians know also, that in the
beginning of the gospel, when I departed
from Macedonia, no church communicated
with me as concerning giving and
receiving, but ye only.
Php 4:16
For even in Thessalonica ye sent once and
again unto my necessity.
Not because I desire a gift: but I desire
fruit that may abound to your account.
*****
God blessed these that gave. Now we ought not do it to be blessed; to receive, but it's a promise. You give and you will receive. Maybe not in money, but you always get payed back. You reap what you sow, afterall.
And who said we can't use the OT for this? II Timothy 3:16 says: All scripture is given by inspiration of God , and is profitable for doctrine , for
reproof, for correction, for instruction in
righteousness:...
Now we know the OT is part of the Bible. It is scripture. It's there for a reason. And if God said it once, that settles it. We still practice the 10 commandments, save keeping the sabbath. That's from the OT. We still teach and preach from the OT. You can even lead someone to Christ from the OT. So why in the world when it clearly says to do something do we not do it?! Yeah, we are to govern our churches under NT guidelines, but we also have taken principles from the OT. It's still God's word. Granted a lot of it is writtend to Israel, but scripture has one iterpritation, many applications. It can still be applied to our life.
And what did the NT preachers and churchs do then when all of the NT had not been yet written? They had the OT. Many times you will see the apostles preaching and quote an old testement verse. And it brought conviction then.
The main point, is if God said it, just do it. Don't argue. Don't doubt. We all know what doubting God's word did to the human race back in Eden.
~Miss Abby

 

[Larry in Tennessee]

Originally posted by Istherenotacause:
If we "pay" our tithes as a form of duty, surely God blesses that obedience, but when we GIVE our tithe cheerfully, God blesses a cheerful giver. That could be looked at as double-obedience and therefore receiving double blessings or two-fold blessings.

Is is possible to agree and disagree with this at the same time? It is very true that God blesses a cheerful giver. It is also true that God promised to bless those who tithe (Malachi 3:10). However, He could choose to remove His blessing, and I would still believe in tithing. We tithe to honor Him. If He blesses it, then Praise God, but if He dosen't, then Praise God, because it is still due to Him.

 

[Lorelei]

This is the verse so many people quote, but few look at it's context.

Mal 3:9-12
10 Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. Test me in this," says the LORD Almighty, "and see if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that you will not have room enough for it.

We must ask ourselves, 1.) To whom is he speaking and 2.) What is the blessing?

We find the answer in the following verses...context, it is always about context.

11 I will prevent pests from devouring your crops, and the vines in your fields will not cast their fruit," says the LORD Almighty. 12 "Then all the nations will call you blessed, for yours will be a delightful land," says the LORD Almighty.
(from New International Version)

Now, notice that the blessings are for their crops and the blessing is on thier "land" not in thier wallets.

This is talking to the Israelite nation. The church does not have a land that is to be blessed, that was his promise to Isreal.

A tithe was never cash or gold, though they had cash and gold to give. Tithes were ALWAYS crops or livestock or something that their land produced. This was used to feed the Levitical priesthood. Remember these priests were not allowed to own land of their own, rather they were supported by the tithes of the people.

The laws that dealt with tithing were always specific and they never mentioned money or gold, always something the land produced or livestock.

Tithing was a law. A law requires that you do something.

The NT says we are free from the law, it tells us NOT to give out of necessity.

2 Cor 9:7

7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
KJV

As soon as it becomes a requirement, a law, it is then necessary that you give it. Whether given cheerfully or not, you are still giving out of necessity. If it's a law, there is no choice.

If I buy a mansion, I can gladly and cheerfully fork over my millions of dollars (for if I wanted it bad enough, I wouldn't care) but I still HAD to give up the money or the mansion wouldn't be mine. God says, you can have it all, you don't have to pay a dime, but if you want to give some go ahead. Give whatever your heart desires!

Should we give, you bet ya! For as most of us have agreed ALL that we have belongs to God. But some of us get caught up in tradition and fear and end up speaking double talk that makes no sense. You try to say it isn't necessary but it is required. Those are contradictory statements and not a biblical teaching.

Yes, those who preach the gospel should live of the gospel. Those who preach it should trust God enough to let his congregation give out of their hearts, not burden them with the yolk of the law that Christ died to set us free from!

~Lorelei

 

[following-Him]

christiantoday.com has an article called:

"The Ancient Rise and Recent Fall of Tithing" at:

http://lists.christianitytoday.com/t/830697/1146720/883/0/

which you may find interesting.

Blessings

 

[Sherrie]

John Bunyan's couplet:

"There was a man, some called him mad; The more he gave, the more he had."

Thanks followinghim for that article.

Sherrie

 

[Dan Todd]

I wonder if all this discussion about tithing; the OT law; no NT command - is:

1. An excuse to give God less than 10% of your income -

2. Or an argument that many want to give more than 10% of their income!!!


Nobody is going to make you OT/Law/NT arguers give anything to the Lord (unless you are in some weird cult). If you don't give your tithe or offering or whatever you call it to the Lord willingly and cheerfully - then He doesn't want it - and He'll not bless you for it!!

That's my opinion!!!

Dan Todd

 

[Sherrie]

Amen Dan Todd!

Sherrie