Go out in Jesus Name

[Cathode]

People voluntarily went to him to hear him preach.

You didn’t answer the question.

You need a sign to remind you that you are a sinner and in need a
of repentance? That is common knowledge for born-again Christians.

Sometimes people do need signs.

Why are those with the ashes on their foreheads making a public repentance for?

What is the purpose of doing it publicly?

The unrepentant man is proud he hides his sin and does not acknowledge that he has sinned.

The repentant man does not hide his sin, he humbles himself before God and men brings it to the light, comes clean about.it.

A great way of humbling ourselves is to do it publically. You accuse Catholics of trying to look holy, when in fact they are humbling themselves acknowledging that they are sinners.

When people are beating themselves up, I don’t try to beat them up even more, or put boots to them.

“But the tax collector stood at a distance and dared not even lift his eyes to heaven as he prayed. Instead, he beat his chest in sorrow, saying, ‘O God, be merciful to me, for I am a sinner.’ 14 I tell you, this sinner, not the Pharisee, returned home justified before God. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

 

[Mikoo]

You didn’t answer the question.

Of course I did. You did not like or understand my answer.

Sometimes people do need signs.

Matthew 16:4



The unrepentant man is proud he hides his sin and does not acknowledge that he has sinned.

And???

The repentant man does not hide his sin, he humbles himself before God and men brings it to the light, comes clean about.it.

So you confess your sins to the public like those that went to hear John the Baptist?

A great way of humbling ourselves is to do it publically. You accuse Catholics of trying to look holy, when in fact they are humbling themselves acknowledging that they are sinners.

And you do that by putting ashes on your forehead and walking around in public? Doesn't sound humble to me. Are you confessing your sin to those strangers you want to see your ashes so you can show them how humble you are? Are you publicly listing your sins to those you encounter who see those humbling ashes on your forehead? You referenced John the Baptist. So are you repenting and listing those sins for those who see your ashes so you can humble yourself in public?

When people are beating themselves up, I don’t try to beat them up even more, or put boots to them.

So you are now beating yourself up by putting ashes on your forehead?

“But the tax collector stood at a distance and dared not even lift his eyes to heaven as he prayed. Instead, he beat his chest in sorrow, saying, ‘O God, be merciful to me, for I am a sinner.’ 14 I tell you, this sinner, not the Pharisee, returned home justified before God. For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

But you do dare to lift your eyes and wear your ashes for all to see to show them how humble you are. Seems like you are exalting yourself and showing the public just how humble you are. Are you shouting so the public can hear you cry out to God that you are a sinner? Are you confessing your sins in public like those who went specifically to hear John the Baptist's message?

 

[Cathode]

So even the Lord gives us a parable of man publicly repenting.

It’s humbling to repent publicly.

He who humbles himself will be exalted.

But you do dare to lift your eyes and wear your ashes for all to see to show them how humble you are. Seems like you are exalting yourself and showing the public just how humble you are. Are you shouting so the public can hear you cry out to God that you are a sinner? Are you confessing your sins in public like those who went specifically to hear John the Baptist's message?

Yes we make public confessions that we are sinners.

“I confess to almighty God and to you, my brothers and sisters, that I have greatly sinned in my thoughts and in my words, in what I have done and in what I have failed to do, ( striking chest ) through my fault, through my fault, through my most grievous fault; therefore I ask blessed Mary ever-Virgin, all the Angels and Saints, and you, my brothers and sisters, to pray for me to the Lord our God.”

Next time you are praying, just thank God you are not like us Catholic sinners.

 

[Oseas3]

Revelation 13:4-6
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the Beast(unto the Beast of sea who was established by him in Rome),and they worshipped the Beast (of sea), saying, Who is like unto the Beast? who is able to make war with him? ----> Michael is.

5 And there was given unto him(unto the Beast of sea) a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. (the court will be given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months-Revelation 11:2. JESUS warned: Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled-Luke 21:24)- Get ready

6 And he -the Beast of Rome - opened(will open) his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

Revelation 12:9-12

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth(Israel-the clay, the dry land) and of the sea!(the Gentile nations) for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

Get ready

 

[Mikoo]

So even the Lord gives us a parable of man publicly repenting.

It’s humbling to repent publicly.

He who humbles himself will be exalted.



Yes we make public confessions that we are sinners.

“I confess to almighty God and to you, my brothers and sisters, that I have greatly sinned in my thoughts and in my words, in what I have done and in what I have failed to do, ( striking chest ) through my fault, through my fault, through my most grievous fault; therefore I ask blessed Mary ever-Virgin, all the Angels and Saints, and you, my brothers and sisters, to pray for me to the Lord our God.”

Next time you are praying, just thank God you are not like us Catholic sinners.

You do that in the your church building among others who believe like you do. You wear your ashes 'humbly' in public to 'publicy' let everyone know how repentent you areas to why you wear the ashes in . That's what you said and gave the example of the man confessing to Jesus his sins.
But you don't tell the public (strangers) your sins like those who went on their own to John the Baptist. (which you ignored in my post)
You don't cry out as you walk down the street 'humbly' wearing your ashes to show you are repentant and cry out, 'God have mercy on me a sinner', like the example you gave to explain why you wear your ashes so everyone can se how 'humble' and 'repentant' you are.
So you can continue to pretend or deliberately ignore the point of my posts. I know many members in the rc denomination struggle to explain some of teachings/doctrines. I used to be the same before God saved me and led me out of the rc denomination.
Next time I pray I will pray for the salvation of those who are not saved including those in the rc denomination..

 

[Cathode]

You do that in the your church building among others who believe like you do. You wear your ashes 'humbly' in public to 'publicy' let everyone know how repentent you areas to why you wear the ashes in . That's what you said and gave the example of the man confessing to Jesus his sins.
But you don't tell the public (strangers) your sins like those who went on their own to John the Baptist. (which you ignored in my post)
You don't cry out as you walk down the street 'humbly' wearing your ashes to show you are repentant and cry out, 'God have mercy on me a sinner', like the example you gave to explain why you wear your ashes so everyone can se how 'humble' and 'repentant' you are.
So you can continue to pretend or deliberately ignore the point of my posts. I know many members in the rc denomination struggle to explain some of teachings/doctrines. I used to be the same before God saved me and led me out of the rc denomination.
Next time I pray I will pray for the salvation of those who are not saved including those in the rc denomination..

You accuse Catholics of being insincere in their repentance, that they are doing it all for show.
You sneer, judge and accuse as if you know and judge people’s hearts.
You profess to be Christian yet you use all the weapons of the darkness.

And I’m not seeing any charity in any of your posts, which is most disturbing.

 

[Walter]

You do that in the your church building among others who believe like you do. You wear your ashes 'humbly' in public to 'publicy' let everyone know how repentent you areas to why you wear the ashes in . That's what you said and gave the example of the man confessing to Jesus his sins.
But you don't tell the public (strangers) your sins like those who went on their own to John the Baptist. (which you ignored in my post)
You don't cry out as you walk down the street 'humbly' wearing your ashes to show you are repentant and cry out, 'God have mercy on me a sinner', like the example you gave to explain why you wear your ashes so everyone can se how 'humble' and 'repentant' you are.
So you can continue to pretend or deliberately ignore the point of my posts. I know many members in the rc denomination struggle to explain some of teachings/doctrines. I used to be the same before God saved me and led me out of the rc denomination.
Next time I pray I will pray for the salvation of those who are not saved including those in the rc denomination..

The Lord led me out of the Baptist church and into the Catholic Church. I have found a much deeper relationship with my Lord and Savior as a Catholic Christian but still appreciate my parents bringing me up in a Christian church. I do not 'struggle' to explain Catholic teachings. How many different evangelical denominations are there now? All claiming their teachings are correct and given under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Tell me, is it unlimited atonement or limited atonement?? They both can't be right. You all seem to 'struggle to explain some of the teachings/doctrines' yourselves.

 

[Mikoo]

You accuse Catholics of being insincere in their repentance, that they are doing it all for show.

Can you show me where I made this accusation? If I did, I will apologize. I give my opinions.

You sneer,
Can you show me where I sneered?

judge

Judge? You mean like what you are doing in this post?

and accuse as if you know and judge people’s hearts.
Can you show me where I made this accusation? If I did, I will apologize.


You profess to be Christian yet you use all the weapons of the darkness.

Wow! Now THAT is quite an accusation! If asking you questions about your beliefs stresses you and cause you to make these Unchristian accusations, I will gladly withdraw from dialogue with you.

And I’m not seeing any charity in any of your posts, which is most disturbing
I'm sorry you feel that way. It has been frustrating when you don't answer the actual questions I am asking.

 

[Mikoo]

The Lord led me out of the Baptist church and into the Catholic Church. I have found a much deeper relationship with my Lord and Savior as a Catholic Christian but still appreciate my parents bringing me up in a Christian church. I do not 'struggle' to explain Catholic teachings. How many different evangelical denominations are there now? All claiming their teachings are correct and given under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit? Tell me, is it unlimited atonement or limited atonement?? They both can't be right. You all seem to 'struggle to explain some of the teachings/doctrines' yourselves.

You responded, but did not address my post that was for Cathode. You would need to follow the thread to know how we got to this point.

The Lord led me OUT of the rc denomination.

I have found a much deeper relationship with my Lord and Savior as a Born-Again Believer.

But still appreciate my parents raising me as best they could in the rc denomination. God was able to still get through to me.

I did not accuse you of struggling to explain the rc denomination teachings. I understand rc teaching/doctrines. I was in the rc denomination for 26 yrs. I don't struggle to explain Mormon teachings either, soooo not sure why you wrote that or what that has to do with my conversation with Cathode.

There are a lot of denominations, some Christian, some not. But there is only ONE Body of Christ (all Born-Again believers are members). You were in a Baptist denomination. So you went from one denomination to the rc denomination.

The rc denomination also claims their teachings/doctrines are given under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

You tell me, is it unlimited atonement or limited atonement? Maybe start your own thread.

I think all denominations, including the rc denomination, seem to 'struggle to explain some of their teachings/doctrines'.

So I'll be watching for your response to the actual conversation I was having with Cathode, if you want to take a crack at it.

 

[MrW]

Forehead ashes are not Scriptural nor is crossing oneself. It looks like a pagan custom. I have never done it and never will.

 

[Cathode]

Forehead ashes are not Scriptural nor is crossing oneself. It looks like a pagan custom. I have never done it and never will.

It was a Israelite custom to cross oneself, symbolising God is the Alpha and Omega, “ Truth “ Eternal, First and Last. The Seal of God.

Once Christians used it to symbolise the Cross of Christ, they no longer continued the custom. They disassociated themselves from Christianity.

 

[Cathode]

The rc denomination also claims their teachings/doctrines are given under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.

Do you claim your teachings and doctrines are given under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit?

 

[Walter]

You do that in the your church building among others who believe like you do. You wear your ashes 'humbly' in public to 'publicy' let everyone know how repentent you areas to why you wear the ashes in . That's what you said and gave the example of the man confessing to Jesus his sins.
But you don't tell the public (strangers) your sins like those who went on their own to John the Baptist. (which you ignored in my post)
You don't cry out as you walk down the street 'humbly' wearing your ashes to show you are repentant and cry out, 'God have mercy on me a sinner', like the example you gave to explain why you wear your ashes so everyone can se how 'humble' and 'repentant' you are.
So you can continue to pretend or deliberately ignore the point of my posts. I know many members in the rc denomination struggle to explain some of teachings/doctrines. I used to be the same before God saved me and led me out of the rc denomination.
Next time I pray I will pray for the salvation of those who are not saved including those in the rc denomination..

Certainly there are many Cultural Catholics who are in need of salvation. Thank you for your prayers.

 

[Oseas3]

So you are saying that the sign of the cross is the mark of the beast.
You are off in the weeds there bro.

Yes, the sign of cross is the mark of the Beast that has a name of blasphemy - vicarivs filii dei, filii of Devil , of course.

And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads-Rev.13:16:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Some people need a cane to walk upright

 

[JonC]

It was a Israelite custom to cross oneself, symbolising God is the Alpha and Omega, “ Truth “ Eternal, First and Last. The Seal of God.

Now that is interesting, especially since the religion and traditions of ancient Israel was not Greek (alpha and omega being the first and last letters of the Greek alphabet).

Do you have a reference for this practice (a source)?


Note: I'm not opposed to people making the "sign of the Cross" (don't want to be misunderstood, just interested in the source material as I enjoy such historical tid bits).

 

[Cathode]

Now that is interesting, especially since the religion and traditions of ancient Israel was not Greek (alpha and omega being the first and last letters of the Greek alphabet).

Do you have a reference for this practice (a source)?


Note: I'm not opposed to people making the "sign of the Cross" (don't want to be misunderstood, just interested in the source material as I enjoy such historical tid bits).

I say Alpha and Omega from our perspective in the New Covenant.

Taw “tau” is God’s symbol, meaning the same thing. Eternal Truth, I AM who AM., Uncreated Eternal, Ever Present, Omnipresent.

wayyōmɛr YHWH ʾēlå̄w ʿăḇōr bəṯōḵ hå̄ʿīr bəṯōḵ yərūšå̄lå̄yim wəhiṯwīṯå̄ tå̄w ʿal-miṣḥōṯ hå̄ʾănå̄šīm hannɛʾɛ̆nå̄ḥīm wəhannɛʾɛ̆nå̄qīm ʿal kål-hattōʿēḇōṯ hannaʿăśōṯ bəṯōḵå̄h


Ezekiel 9:4

“And the Lord said to him: Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem: and mark Thau upon the foreheads of the men that sigh, and mourn for all the abominations that are committed in the midst thereof.

5 And to the others he said in my hearing: Go ye after him through the city, and strike: let not your eyes spare, nor be ye moved with pity.

6 Utterly destroy old and young, maidens, children and women: but upon whomsoever you shall see Thau, kill him not, and begin ye at my sanctuary. So they began at the ancient men who were before the house.”

Taw is God’s symbol and Seal on the foreheads of his own.

Satan and the Antichrist mock this Seal of God by marking the foreheads of his own with blasphemy against God.

This is why the Seal of God Tau is publicaly displayed on the forehead as witness before men.

Just as there was no mercy in Ezekiel, there will be no mercy for those marked with the mark of the beast, as opposed to those marked with God’s Seal Taw.


Something cool and beautiful Psalm 139

7 Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.
9 If I rise on the wings of the dawn, ( East )
if I settle on the far side of the sea, ( West )
10 even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.
11 If I say, “Surely the darkness will hide me
and the light become night around me,”
12 even the darkness will not be dark to you;
the night will shine like the day,
for darkness is as light to you.

It was explained to me by a Rabbi who converted to Christianity that in Sacerdotal Judaism the Israelites Crossed themselves at the reading of this part of the Psalm.

If I go up to the heavens, you are there;

if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.

If I rise on the wings of the dawn, ( East )

if I settle on the far side of the sea, ( West )

This is the sign of God but it also shows the Omnipresent and Eternal Nature of God, Eternal Truth. The Israelites inculcated spiritual realities into physical representations in worship, and many other ways, customs etc. Even culinary things and dress.

A whole lot more can be said on it, the Old Testament has many other references denoting the cross or Tau.

 

[JonC]

I say Alpha and Omega from our perspective in the New Covenant.

Taw “tau” is God’s symbol, meaning the same thing. Eternal Truth, I AM who AM., Uncreated Eternal, Ever Present, Omnipresent.

wayyōmɛr YHWH ʾēlå̄w ʿăḇōr bəṯōḵ hå̄ʿīr bəṯōḵ yərūšå̄lå̄yim wəhiṯwīṯå̄ tå̄w ʿal-miṣḥōṯ hå̄ʾănå̄šīm hannɛʾɛ̆nå̄ḥīm wəhannɛʾɛ̆nå̄qīm ʿal kål-hattōʿēḇōṯ hannaʿăśōṯ bəṯōḵå̄h


Ezekiel 9:4

“And the Lord said to him: Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem: and mark Thau upon the foreheads of the men that sigh, and mourn for all the abominations that are committed in the midst thereof.

5 And to the others he said in my hearing: Go ye after him through the city, and strike: let not your eyes spare, nor be ye moved with pity.

6 Utterly destroy old and young, maidens, children and women: but upon whomsoever you shall see Thau, kill him not, and begin ye at my sanctuary. So they began at the ancient men who were before the house.”

Taw is God’s symbol and Seal on the foreheads of his own.

Satan and the Antichrist mock this Seal of God by marking the foreheads of his own with blasphemy against God.

This is why the Seal of God Tau is publicaly displayed on the forehead as witness before men.

Just as there was no mercy in Ezekiel, there will be no mercy for those marked with the mark of the beast, as opposed to those marked with God’s Seal Taw.


Something cool and beautiful Psalm 139

7 Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.
9 If I rise on the wings of the dawn, ( East )
if I settle on the far side of the sea, ( West )
10 even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.
11 If I say, “Surely the darkness will hide me
and the light become night around me,”
12 even the darkness will not be dark to you;
the night will shine like the day,
for darkness is as light to you.

It was explained to me by a Rabbi who converted to Christianity that in Sacerdotal Judaism the Israelites Crossed themselves at the reading of this part of the Psalm.

If I go up to the heavens, you are there;

if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.

If I rise on the wings of the dawn, ( East )

if I settle on the far side of the sea, ( West )

This is the sign of God but it also shows the Omnipresent and Eternal Nature of God, Eternal Truth. The Israelites inculcated spiritual realities into physical representations in worship, and many other ways, customs etc. Even culinary things and dress.

A whole lot more can be said on it, the Old Testament has many other references denoting the cross or Tau.

Thank you for the reference. I disagree that this seal or mark is connected in any way to the "sign of the Cross", or "crossing oneself", in the sense it was initially a Jewish practice. In Ezekiel it was a vision. This was a vision of the slaughter and God commanded an angel to mark the people). But it was not a Jewish practice in terms of the Hebrew faith to make the mark upon themselves.

But this does help me understand how Catholics connect the practice to the Hebrew faith, and perhaps why they begin the practice.


The Catholic faith has a lot of ritualistic practices that are not prescribed in Scripture. Baptists do as well, although they will not admit to it. Baptists have a structure of worship that is ritualistic (one I liked was ritualistically singing the Doxology).

I have seen Baptists pray using archaic language, stick to formal structure of worship (welcome, ding, ding, offering, preach, invocation, go home). That is ritualistic (it is not organic worship).

My point is that Baptists often condemn Catholics for forms of worship rather than the reasons behind those forms while also approaching worship in a ritualistic manner.


I don't mean to falsely imply that I believe Catholic equates to "Christian" (I don't even believe Baptist equates to Christian and I am Baptist). But I am trying to look at your faith and practices objectively and I appreciate your replies.

 

[Cathode]

Thank you for the reference. I disagree that this seal or mark is connected in any way to the "sign of the Cross", or "crossing oneself", in the sense it was initially a Jewish practice. In Ezekiel it was a vision. This was a vision of the slaughter and God commanded an angel to mark the people). But it was not a Jewish practice in terms of the Hebrew faith to make the mark upon themselves.

But this does help me understand how Catholics connect the practice to the Hebrew faith, and perhaps why they begin the practice.


The Catholic faith has a lot of ritualistic practices that are not prescribed in Scripture. Baptists do as well, although they will not admit to it. Baptists have a structure of worship that is ritualistic (one I liked was ritualistically singing the Doxology).

I have seen Baptists pray using archaic language, stick to formal structure of worship (welcome, ding, ding, offering, preach, invocation, go home). That is ritualistic (it is not organic worship).

My point is that Baptists often condemn Catholics for forms of worship rather than the reasons behind those forms while also approaching worship in a ritualistic manner.


I don't mean to falsely imply that I believe Catholic equates to "Christian" (I don't even believe Baptist equates to Christian and I am Baptist). But I am trying to look at your faith and practices objectively and I appreciate your replies.

The idea of making your spiritual Faith a part of your daily life practice in custom is Jewish. Your theology is played out and recalled in everything you do, it adds significance draws you constantly to reenforce your beliefs, and to pray always.

St. Cyril of Jerusalem (Ad 386) in his Catechetical Lectures stated, “Let us then not be ashamed to confess the Crucified. Be the cross our seal, made with boldness by our fingers on our brow and in everything; over the bread we eat and the cups we drink, in our comings and in our goings out; before our sleep, when we lie down and when we awake; when we are traveling, and when we are at rest”

You are constantly calling on and acknowledging the Triune God invoking The Holy Name, you are constantly confessing Christ crucified and by public witness. Your whole life is a witness of your faith in Christ, a meditation and blessing in one.

If you see someone make the sign of the cross, what is the safest bet but that they are Catholic.

Tertullian (d. c. 250) described the commonness of the sign of the cross: “In all our travels and movements, in all our coming in and going out, in putting on our shoes, at the bath, at the table, in lighting our candles, in lying down, in sitting down, whatever employment occupies us, we mark our foreheads with the sign of the cross” (De corona, 30).

You make every thing you do significant, with the significance of The Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 

[Cathode]

“Never leave your house without making the sign of the cross. It will be to you a staff, a weapon, an impregnable fortress. Neither man nor demon will dare to attack you, seeing you covered with such powerful armor. Let this sign teach you that you are a soldier, ready to combat against the demons, and ready to fight for the crown of justice. Are you ignorant of what the cross has done? It has vanquished death, destroyed sin, emptied hell, dethroned Satan, and restored the universe. Would you then doubt its power?”

St. John Chrysostom, 4th-century Preacher and Patriarch of Constantinople