God is not going to punish sin?????

[Iconoclast]

Recently some have suggested that God is no longer going to punish sins.
Some have suggested that only unbelief will be punished???

Why did Jesus say in lk12:47 that some will be beaten with....MANY STRIPES....if only unbelief will be punished?

I never heard such an idea until I looked on BB.

Why does Isa 53 speak of transgressions?
Why does Paul list sins plural?

 

[grits4jesusfl]

Revelation 19:13,15 "....and they werr judged every man according to their works." V.15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

People will be judged for their works, but each person will also face the ultimate question, did you believe what God said? If you believe, your name is in the book of life and if not you have rejected everything God had done for us, your name is not found.
The ultimate sin, it seems to me, is unbelief.
Romans 1:19-21, tell us that God has made known to every man, the world over, who He is and man has the choice to believe or reject that knowledge God has placed within them.




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[JonC]

Recently some have suggested that God is no longer going to punish sins.
Some have suggested that only unbelief will be punished???

Why did Jesus say in lk12:47 that some will be beaten with....MANY STRIPES....if only unbelief will be punished?

I never heard such an idea until I looked on BB.

Why does Isa 53 speak of transgressions?
Why does Paul list sins plural?

There are a lot of ideas that I have not heard until the BB .

Another question would be why the believer is in need of a mediator. John tells us not to sin, but when we do that we have an Advocate in Christ Jesus. If sins do not merit punishment, then they should also not necessitate mediation. (And Peter tells us that since we call on him as Father who judges impartially according to our deeds that we should conduct ourselves with fear during the time of our exile).

 

[th1bill]

Iconoclast,
I have heard this lie taught but it is just that, a lie. They have taken one or more teachers lessons on understanding the Bible's (we call it the Old Testament) lessons as explained by the God Breathed Life Application Commentary (we call it the New Testament) and have twisted it inside out by leaving all reference to scripture out of the ¿sermon? When Jesus explained that all sin could be forgiven, save the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, as sweet as that truth is and is meant to be, it opened a can of worms for the minions of Satan to spill and they do so with great regularity. (Subject text is Mark 3:29)

 

[HAMel]

Many are of the opinion that if enough people gather together with the same common belief then God has no choice but to change and honor said belief's. I mean, God has finally come to realize there was no need for Jesus to die on the cross since the concept of a (pope) came into practice and he has assumed the role of mediator. Boy, did our Heavenly Father get that one wrong. All that blood; humiliation; abuse, for nothing.

(END OF SARCASM)

 

[Iconoclast]

Revelation 19:13,15 "....and they werr judged every man according to their works." V.15 "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."

People will be judged for their works, but each person will also face the ultimate question, did you believe what God said? If you believe, your name is in the book of life and if not you have rejected everything God had done for us, your name is not found.
The ultimate sin, it seems to me, is unbelief.
Romans 1:19-21, tell us that God has made known to every man, the world over, who He is and man has the choice to believe or reject that knowledge God has placed within them.




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Hello Grit
Romans 1 says all men are without excuse.
Romans 10 asks how can they hear without a preacher?

So many have lived and died in their sins who never knew Jesus existed.
What will they be in the second death for?

 

[Iconoclast]

Iconoclast,
I have heard this lie taught but it is just that, a lie. They have taken one or more teachers lessons on understanding the Bible's (we call it the Old Testament) lessons as explained by the God Breathed Life Application Commentary (we call it the New Testament) and have twisted it inside out by leaving all reference to scripture out of the ¿sermon? When Jesus explained that all sin could be forgiven, save the Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, as sweet as that truth is and is meant to be, it opened a can of worms for the minions of Satan to spill and they do so with great regularity. (Subject text is Mark 3:29)

Yes brother.....it could also be as simple as new converts not hearing sound doctrine where they go as the sound doctrine gets drowned out by the rock band on stage, or the smoke machine obscures their vision.

 

[Iconoclast]

Many are of the opinion that if enough people gather together with the same common belief then God has no choice but to change and honor said belief's. I mean, God has finally come to realize there was no need for Jesus to die on the cross since the concept of a (pope) came into practice and he has assumed the role of mediator. Boy, did our Heavenly Father get that one wrong. All that blood; humiliation; abuse, for nothing.

(END OF SARCASM)

Yes....I do not see where God's hatred of any and all sin has changed one bit......remember Lots wife.

 

[grits4jesusfl]

Hello Grit
Romans 1 says all men are without excuse.
Romans 10 asks how can they hear without a preacher?

So many have lived and died in their sins who never knew Jesus existed.
What will they be in the second death for?

Iconoclast,
The people will be accountable for what they did with the knowledge God has placed inside each of us. Romans 1:19-23, deals with God and what man chooses to do with Him.
If you have never heard the Gospel, but have heard there is a Creator God, you are accountable for what knowledge you have of God. Just like everyone who is listed in Hebrews 11. They did not hear about Jesus, but they acted by faith on the truth they learned about God.

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[Iconoclast]

Hello

Iconoclast,
The people will be accountable for what they did with the knowledge God has placed inside each of us. Romans 1:19-23, deals with God and what man chooses to do with Him.
If you have never heard the Gospel, but have heard there is a Creator God, you are accountable for what knowledge you have of God. Just like everyone who is listed in Hebrews 11. They did not hear about Jesus, but they acted by faith on the truth they learned about God.

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Grit.....
Those in Hebrews 11 were exposed to special revelation, the scriptures of promise.....multitudes never hear of the scriptures, the promise ,or any such thing......why are they justly sent into second death?
I believe Romans 1 has primary fulfillment looking back to fallen men since before the flood, and perhaps to the tower of Babel.
Man had a direct knowledge of God.....but they turned away and exchanged the truth for a lie.No one is given special saving knowledge by the lights of creation or conscience. ....it only makes them accountable.

 

[grits4jesusfl]

I did not say they would be part of the second death. I apologize if I was not clear. Everyone has the knowledge of God within them. Those who act on it will be justified in the sight of God, as was Abraham, Rahab, etc. Those who reject the knowledge will take part in the second death.



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[Iconoclast]

I did not say they would be part of the second death. I apologize if I was not clear. Everyone has the knowledge of God within them. Those who act on it will be justified in the sight of God, as was Abraham, Rahab, etc. Those who reject the knowledge will take part in the second death.



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Apart from God's grace.....no one seeks God,no....not one Paul quoting psalm 14.in Romans 3.....The Lord looked down from heaven to see if there were any......no not one....that is the problem, but God has already elected a multitude of sinners to be the objects of His saving mercy.
He is not willing that any of them perish...He saves each and every one.

 

[grits4jesusfl]

Apart from God's grace.....no one seeks God,no....not one Paul quoting psalm 14.in Romans 3.....The Lord looked down from heaven to see if there were any......no not one....that is the problem, but God has already elected a multitude of sinners to be the objects of His saving mercy.
He is not willing that any of them perish...He saves each and every one.

So God has already chosen who will be saved?

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[Iconoclast]

So God has already chosen who will be saved?

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Yes. ...every single one for His own purpose and glory
2 Tim 1:9 ......He has ordained the persons who will be saved,and all the means necessary to accomplish that purpose.

 

[Internet Theologian]

Recently some have suggested that God is no longer going to punish sins.
Some have suggested that only unbelief will be punished???

Why did Jesus say in lk12:47 that some will be beaten with....MANY STRIPES....if only unbelief will be punished?

I never heard such an idea until I looked on BB.

Why does Isa 53 speak of transgressions?
Why does Paul list sins plural?

And people say heresy is an over-used term...lolzzzzzz

 

[Internet Theologian]

Yes. ...every single one for His own purpose and glory

It is interesting that people place more faith in that they chose God (which is a fallacy) than that God chose them, which is biblical and is truth.

With the deluge of heresies coming in, are any surprised that baptists seem to pick them up readily?

It's the pulpits brethren, they aren't feeding the sheep and equipping the saints. Instead they try to come up with a sermon that sounds good and gets people excited because excitement is important when one is on his or her way to hell.

 

[Iconoclast]

It is interesting that people place more faith in that they chose God (which is a fallacy) than that God chose them, which is biblical and is truth.

With the deluge of heresies coming in, are any surprised that baptists seem to pick them up readily?

It's the pulpits brethren, they aren't feeding the sheep and equipping the saints. Instead they try to come up with a sermon that sounds good and gets people excited because excitement is important when one is on his or her way to hell.

I don't pick on dispensationalism just to pick on it I really think it does damage to the study habits and understanding of many of the Saints in the Baptist churches. In the Baptist churches is also a failure and from what I could see because of that teaching to really study the kingdom of God here and now regardless of what you think is in the future and also the Covenant because that was you into a deeper understanding of the salvation we have and our place in the kingdom right now

 

[agedman]

I don't pick on dispensationalism just to pick on it I really think it does damage to the study habits and understanding of many of the Saints in the Baptist churches. In the Baptist churches is also a failure and from what I could see because of that teaching to really study the kingdom of God here and now regardless of what you think is in the future and also the Covenant because that was you into a deeper understanding of the salvation we have and our place in the kingdom right now

First, I would desire the reader to know that what follows is NOT a support of any scheme on how one outlines or groups the timeline of God. Rather, I pick up in the context of what Icon mentions.

I am not certain that criticism is warranted and limited to only dispensationalism. There are any number of non-dispensation churches that have the same issues that you mention. To me the problem is system wide and growing. The typical church of all types are falling into apostasy, just as the Scriptures teach would take place.

It has become noticeable in the area of replacing the work of the Holy Spirit with the work of emotionalism. (Imo) this started back even in early 1800's. The song writer Philip Bliss in the third quarter of the 1800s was concerned about the trends of music in the church and evangelistic meetings in his day. He was most concerned about that which was unsound in doctrine and the music lines appealing to the baser sensuality of humankind. One can imagine his take on the typical shallowness found among many churches in this time. I recall having a similar conversation with Al Smith (founder of singspiration). When I visited with Rudy Atwood, he also was concerned that the modern trends of showmanship and public display was distracting from the gospel.

There is this concern. Perhaps it may be worth considering that at times the enemy of believers can use an issue (for example: arguments against dispensation at every opportunity) as a distraction from communication and discernment of the real meat of the Scriptures, and more desperate seeking of God.

 

[grits4jesusfl]

Yes. ...every single one for His own purpose and glory
2 Tim 1:9 ......He has ordained the persons who will be saved,and all the means necessary to accomplish that purpose.

If God does, as you say, choose who is allowed to be saved, then why be concerned with those who have never heard? By what you say has God not already chosen which of them will be saved? And if God chooses who is saved how does a person know whether or not they have been saved?
I'll be honest I find that very confusing with what the Bible teaches.

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[TCassidy]

If God does, as you say, choose who is allowed to be saved, then why be concerned with those who have never heard?

Because God commands us to.

By what you say has God not already chosen which of them will be saved?

Yes.

And if God chooses who is saved how does a person know whether or not they have been saved?

If they believe.