God the author and finisher of all salvation?

Ge 49:26 -
The blessings of thy father have prevailed above the blessings of my progenitors unto the utmost bound of the everlasting hills: they shall be on the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him that was separate from his brethren.

Hab 3:6 -
He stood, and measured the earth: he beheld, and drove asunder the nations; and the everlasting mountains were scattered, the perpetual hills did bow: his ways are everlasting.

Ex 40:15 -
And thou shalt anoint them, as thou didst anoint their father, that they may minister unto me in the priest's office: for their anointing shall surely be an everlasting priesthood throughout their generations.

Le 16:34 -
And this shall be an everlasting statute unto you, to make an atonement for the children of Israel for all their sins once a year. And he did as the LORD commanded Moses.

Ex 21:6 -
Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever.

 

Faith is not just saying 'I love Jesus, Jesus loves me, and I just believe that whatever I do will be enough to get me there.' Faith is believing what God says. If God says the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom, thats a good place to start. God says be not decieved, whatsoever a man sows, that shall he also reap. Believest thou this? God didn't give us the answer to the question 'how much sin can I get away with.' He doesn't want us to live that way. He tells us He wants us hot or cold, and if we're lukewarm, He is going to spew us out of His mouth. If your concerned with where the line is, the answer is to move closer to the light.

 

The Gospel of John is full of them. Read James, I John . . . the entire New Testament for that matter It's all talking about it.

You obviously have misunderstood what I was saying. These generic commands are not something that is willy nilly and can not be pinpointed. They are generic in that every believer must follow them. Love thy neighbor as yourself. There's nothing willy nilly about that. We must forgive as we have been forgiven. That's generic. Everyone must forgive.

But then we also have some person duties that called has called us to do. God has given each of us at least one spiritual gift if not more. Those are not generic, but specific to each individual.

Hope that clarifies.

No it's not even remotely close. It's not about a number of sins and you are out, but the heart/attitude. If you are about to get slammed by a semi and you blurt out a curse word, yet you have been walking blameless throughout your lifetime and you don't have time to confess before you die I don't believe that person is going to be toast.

The Bible is talking about peole that persist in sin. Sin is their lifestyle and they have no desire to turn from it. As long as you are trying to find a certain sin or certain number of sins or certain number of times you can sin you are going to miss the point.

Again I'm not sure why you equate the term generic with unclear, but that is not true at all. There are generic commands that are crystal clear and everyone is bound by them. Then there are other specific commands that should be clear to the individual to follow.

For example there were some servants that cried Lord, Lord look at what we did. However their work was work of iniquity. They missed their specific commands and were doing something they shouldn't have been doing.

God gifts us and we are going to be held accountable for what we have allowed the Spirit to do with that gift, but you are not going to be held accountable if I have misused my gifting(s), just as I will not be held accountable if you have misused yours.

Again hope that clarifies.

 

Amen! I like that one James. Can I store that one away and use it :thumbsup:

 

jim,

It seems obvious to me that christians will be chastened for disobedience. However, I have to ask, do you and your church believe christians who are not good enough in this life will burn in hell for a thousand years during the millenial reign of Christ?

 

There are two parts to your question.
1. No. My church does not believe what you have presented. But we do believe that the Christian will be severely chastised at the JSOC who was a wicked and slothful servant. In fact we heard just such a message this past Sunday morning. What that chastisement looks like varies amongst us. Our Pastor leans towards loss and impoverishment. Others lean toward exclusion from the Kingdom. Still others have not even considered the subject. We are an IFB KJV church. So, to answer the first part which you listed second, we as a body are as varied on this subject as Baptists can be since we hold to the doctrine of liberty of conscience.

2. As for myself, I have already stated in other threads of this nature, I am still undecided. There are very good arguments for the doctrine to which you refer. OTOH, there are also good arguments against it. I lean toward the picture which Jesus gave us here;
Mt 25:26
His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
Mt 25:27
Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
Mt 25:28
Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
Mt 25:29
For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
Mt 25:30
And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Some have argued that 'outer darkness' is indeed hell. I don't know where this place is but I do believe it will not be in heaven, nor will it be on the earth. I also believe it won't be pleasent.

I don't think Jesus gives us as clear a picture of the place of punishment for the unfaithful christian as He did for the lost because we are not to focus our attention on where we go if disobedient. Our focus ought to be on the reward for faithfulness, this is why there is so much more detail given about the reward versus the punishment. OTOH, the place of punishment for the lost is clearly pictured so as to motivate US more than THEM to be obedient and preach the Gospel to them. Hell and the Lake of Fire is a motivator for the CHRISTIAN to go and reach the lost. Similarly, exclusion from the Kingdom serves as such a motivator for us as well.

Yes, God's love for us should be motivation enough, but one need only look around him at the Western Church and see that this is not necessarily enough. Would you agree? For IF it was enough we would not need to continually preach our hearts out trying to get people to evangelize their lost neighbors now would we?

 

Quite right. Jesus knew that His disciples would have a temptation to say 'well I don't care about rewards, I just love Jesus.' If God has offered them to us, we ought to desire them. But just in case, there is a reward for not serving as well. We are bought with a price, and serving our Master is not an option, its a duty. But we have to choose to serve.

 

Can you show me a scriptural example?

 

Yes, losing is an opposite of recieving.

 

lol..... usually he can't

 

I don't understand what you mean. Where does the bible show that receiving is losing?

I see losing contrasted with receiving:
2 John 1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.

I see receiving 'negative' rewards:
2 Peter 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;

Hebrews 2:2 For if the word spoken by angels was steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompense of reward;

 

Therefore... receiving is not losing.

So to say that 'receiving' for bad works means losing reward, doesn't quite add up. If there were another example in the bible of God using similar language (ie receiving to imply losing) then you could possibly make that argument. But God often speaks of reward according to works in a negative context.

2 Timothy 4:14 Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:

Revelation 18:5-6
5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.

Job 21:19-20
19 God layeth up his iniquity for his children: he rewardeth him, and he shall know it.
20 His eyes shall see his destruction, and he shall drink of the wrath of the Almighty.

2 Peter 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;

Luke 23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

Hosea 4:9 And there shall be, like people, like priest: and I will punish them for their ways, and reward them their doings.

and so on... So when Jesus says that He will reward every man according to his work, why would I assume He means anything other than what He says?