Going the other way

[Salty]

Suppose it were the "Indians" who traveled eastward over the Atlantic and colonized "The New World" of Europe.

How would history have been changed?

Salty

 

[Dr. Bob]

They'd have been killed off more quickly.

Remember, though we talk about "tribes" and "clans" of Indians, these were semi-nomadic and very small in number. Encyclopedia Britannica estimates 900,000 in 1500 "north of the Rio Grande". Highest estimate (with no scholarship) is 18 million in all of North/South America.

Contrast that to 2.7 million in England alone, and 70 million in Europe in 1500.

Can you imagine an eastward invastion of the technologically-ignorant Indians outnumbered 70-1?

Bury my heart at Wounded Knee.

 

[Salty]

So everyone just accepts Dr Bobs answer:BangHead:

Well:type:

 

[Matt Black]

Um...yes, because he's right(?)

 

[jvargas]

Suppose woman were the head of the household...suppose the Russians won the space race...suppose our feet were made of Jell-O.

 

[NiteShift]

So everyone just accepts Dr Bobs answer:BangHead:

Well:type:

The Indians were excellent at what they did, which was woodland warfare. When they fought in their own way in their own environment they tied European and American armies up in knots. The battle of Monongahela is fairly typical of Indian battles in a wooded area. But when forced to line up and fight in the European style of battle Indians tended to fade away if they took casualties.
So, if they had been magically transported to Europe and had enough forest area to move around undetected they could have created some havoc, but could not have threatened any major European cities.
IMHO :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Ed B]

Suppose it were the "Indians" who traveled eastward over the Atlantic and colonized "The New World" of Europe.

How would history have been changed?

Salty

Interesting question but it would not have fared well for the Native Americans

But the first question is which Native Americans? Not all of them would have interacted with Europeans the same way. For example the Inuit and Scandinavians eventually interacted in Greenland. I wouldn’t be surprised if some small number made their way to Northern Norway (I should look that up). But we’ll dismiss them. I have read most about Southern Plains tribes so here is my input:

If the Southern Plains tribes migrated from North America to Europe they would have tried to interact with native Europeans the same way they interacted with Mexico and neighboring agrarian tribes above the Rio Grande. They would have raided, kidnapped, killed, and stole from whoever was seen as “others”. If this occurred prior to about 1100 AD, they would have been seen as just one more pagan raiding army tormenting the static settlements and monasteries much like everyone else was doing in Northwest Europe and the British Isles leading up to that time.

Regardless which Native American peoples made the theoretic journey, chicken pox, measles, small pox, etc, would have stopped them before they could crossed over to the Jutland Peninsula… assuming they bought save passage through Norway and Sweden.

My $.02

Ed

 

[NiteShift]

Interesting question but it would not have fared well for the Native Americans

But the first question is which Native Americans? Not all of them would have interacted with Europeans the same way. For example the Inuit and Scandinavians eventually interacted in Greenland. I wouldn’t be surprised if some small number made their way to Northern Norway (I should look that up). But we’ll dismiss them. I have read most about Southern Plains tribes so here is my input:

If the Southern Plains tribes migrated from North America to Europe they would have tried to interact with native Europeans the same way they interacted with Mexico and neighboring agrarian tribes above the Rio Grande. They would have raided, kidnapped, killed, and stole from whoever was seen as “others”. If this occurred prior to about 1100 AD, they would have been seen as just one more pagan raiding army tormenting the static settlements and monasteries much like everyone else was doing in Northwest Europe and the British Isles leading up to that time.

Regardless which Native American peoples made the theoretic journey, chicken pox, measles, small pox, etc, would have stopped them before they could crossed over to the Jutland Peninsula… assuming they bought save passage through Norway and Sweden.

My $.02

Ed

Hello Ed and welcome.

Well a couple of points that i would make in our theoretical 'other way invasion'. You say the outcome partly would depend on which tribes made the trip and I think that is valid. The plains tribes were much fewer in number and didn't have alot in common with the Eastern tribes. Also the terrain is very different, so that would influence their way of operating.

Eastern Indians had been exposed to the diseases of Europe much earlier than the Plains Indians, and so many of them would have had some immunity. As far as that goes, whites were devastated by smallpox nearly as badly as natives were.

The largest Indian/White battles occured east of the Mississippi and so the Iroquois, Cherokee, Creek, Ottowa etc were used to White armies and how they fought.

Anyway, they still were too few in number and would have been swallowed up eventually in Europe.