Halloween

[menageriekeeper]

Ask any non-Christian, Bro. James. They can most certainly point to the true Christians around them and also point out those who are just playing a game.

The fruit of the Spirit is inward, but shows on the outward, regardless of Halloween.

 

[Humblesmith]

Originally posted by HankD:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Christmas trees had origins in paganism too, yet many Christians have those because they have made it something else.

Don't forget those enigmatic bunnies who lay and hide those chocolate chicken eggs!

HankD </font>[/QUOTE]January was named after Janus, a Roman god.
March was named after Mars, another god.
Saturday was "Saturn's day": still another god.
Sunday was "Sun Day"
Monday was "Moon Day"

I submit that in our day and culture, July 4 is as pagan in a modern sense as most of the ancient holidays are.

I also submit that none of us are consistent about our abstaining from pagan things. If we were, we would avoid a much larger host of days.

In our house, when my kids were little, we followed a very clear, very strict rule: "No dead stuff." Nothing that used to be dead and is now walking around, and nothing that is supposed to be inside your body that is now on the outside.

The kids understood it and followed it, it didn't spoil the day, and we can still reach out to others with the gospel without the non-believers shunning our message because we're wierd about a non-essential issue. Which is excactly what they do to the people who do not follow Romans 14.

Now I personally hate Halloween. If it were up to me, we'd make the calendar have 29 days that month. But the non-believers won't listen to me if I let that get in the way. Last year we had 130 unchurched families come to our fall festival, and expect more this year. Each will get a follow up from an evangelistic team.

 

[TexasSky]

Remember the parable of the good steward. One steward hid the treasure, another invested it.

If we become so separate that we become like Quakers, we lose an effective ministry.

If we are the friend, the neighbor, the coworker that people can relate to, and we are a good Christian, we have an effective ministry.

Paul said to be careful that we do not offend. By accusing everyone who lets their child dress up on Halloween as worshipping Satan, we are offending.

Better to use the opportunity to reach the lost, and to say, "Hey, I know something that is real, and far better than a ghost or a pumpkin. Let me introduce you to Christ."

Christians are quickly getting the reputation of judgmental, stand-offish, "better than you" hypocrites. We are seen as unable to enjoy the beauty of this world that God gave us.

We can use holidays as a way of saying, "Yes, Christianity IS joyous, but its real joy."

Let the churches have their festivals. Let them reach the lost. Let the kids become a princess or superman for a day, and in the process, let them know, "God loves you."

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by TexasSky:
If we are the friend, the neighbor, the coworker that people can relate to, and we are a good Christian, we have an effective ministry.... Paul said to be careful that we do not offend. By accusing everyone who lets their child dress up on Halloween as worshipping Satan, we are offending.

TS speaks with wisdom.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Helen wrote,

There are many who see it as a harmless diversion. I am not one of those. I used to be, and then, when my children were small, I started finding out more about it and what the history of it is, and what it actually is a celebration of. At that point we opted out entirely.

The history of Halloween is irrelevant. What other people celebrate on Halloween is irrelevant. What we and our children celebrate on Halloween, and how we celebrate it, however, is very important.

Rom. 14:4. Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
5. One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.
6. He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
7. For not one of us lives for himself, and not one dies for himself;
8. for if we live, we live for the Lord, or if we die, we die for the Lord; therefore whether we live or die, we are the Lord's.
9. For to this end Christ died and lived again, that He might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.
10. But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God.
11. For it is written, "AS I LIVE, SAYS THE LORD, EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW TO ME, AND EVERY TONGUE SHALL GIVE PRAISE TO GOD."
12. So then each one of us will give an account of himself to God.
13. Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather determine this--not to put an obstacle or a stumbling block in a brother's way. (NASB, 1995)

 

[Elnora]

Originally posted by menageriekeeper:
Ask any non-Christian, Bro. James. They can most certainly point to the true Christians around them and also point out those who are just playing a game.

The fruit of the Spirit is inward, but shows on the outward, regardless of Halloween.

In my opinion this is right on. Before I was a Christian, the only thing that made me take notice of what Christians did, is when they did or did not love one another. I had a grandma that didn't celebrate Haloween but she was very involved with her neighbors. If they needed anything, she was there. She loved her brothers and sisters in Christ whether they celebrated or not.

Another person I knew to be a Christian, celebrated Haloween but hated her brothers and judged those she thought were beneath her. My thought as an unbeliever: "this is a Christian?"

The word of God says those without, will see you are a Christian by your love one for another, not do you or do you not celebrate a holiday.

 

[Rachel]

Amen Elnora and MK!

Also, alot of time is wasted trying to undo damage and things said to unbelievers from what previous Christian's (or people that said they were) have done. I'm trying to meet people where they are, without any compromise of my beliefs.
Regardless if we do anything on that day , we need to try to walk in Love always. I can't imagine what this world would be like if we all showed real love for ALL our brothers and sisters in Christ, on a regular basis. What a difference that would make.

 

[Bro. James]

Let your light so shine before men...--and put it in a jack-o-lantern.

It is the consistent, 24-7, 365 1/4, talk and walk which convicts the world of sin, righteousness and judgement to come.

We all fall short.

Selah,

Bro. James

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by TennisNE1:
Robbing children of their "Childhood" is a sin IMO.


Cindy

"Robbing children of their childhood???"
Really? That really is a heartless statement to make; maybe more like naive, perhaps selfish, and indicates a whole lot of other things as well.

Daily I see children seven and eight years old working at gas stations, service centers, tea stalls, washing dishes, working as maids, scrubbing floors, etc. Call it child labor if you want. It happens. It is common. I see it all the time. Mothers and fathers urging their children to work at an age as early as six in order to add some extra income for the family, because they are too short-sighted to see that in the long run an educated child will be in a much better position to support them later on. The childhood is lost to the what ought to be the adult labor force.
Don't talk about something as ridiculous as robbing a child of their childhood, (RE: Halloween). Open your eyes to the world; look around beyond the comfortable borders of the town you live in, and realize the conditions that most of the world lives in are not the same as the USA.
DHK

 

[TennisNE1]

There are a lot of different ways to rob a child of their childhood. I am interested in your reason for calling my statement selfish, naive and "indicates a whole lot of other things".

Cindy

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Bro. James:
Let your light so shine before men...--and put it in a jack-o-lantern.

Hey, why not? Why not carve a cross in a pumpkin and put it on the doorstep. When the kids come to the door, and you pass out candy, they'll know it's a safe door to come to, and they'll likely remember the cross, your door, and your gratitude for years to come.

I think I'm going to do that this year

 

[Rachel]

Johnv, now that's an idea! lol

Earlier today I just remembered that this Oct.31 will be six years since I got baptized. I didn't realize at that time, that Sunday would be the 31st. It still tickles me.

 

[TennisNE1]

DHK,
It if VERY interesting that you tell me to open my eyes beyond the borders of my town. Let me tell you why.
My father is a pastor( I moved around a lot when I was a child.)
My husband is a pastor ( I have lived in five different states while following my husband)
My brother is a missionary to the Cape Verde Islands off the coast of West Africa. I have visited there on two occasions.
My brother in law is a missionary to Honduras. I have visited there twice also.
My best friend is a missionary's wife to Mexico. I have visited her several times, once during the days of the dead.
I just returned from a trip to Canada, and I saw none of the children you referenced in your above post.
I have also traveled to Paris, France to our mission point there.
I have traveled to Costa Rica while my brother in law was in language school there.
Please let me know how misfortunate children from other countries diminishes what I said about robbing a child of his/her childhood is a sin???

 

[Rachel]

Originally posted by TennisNE1:
There are a lot of different ways to rob a child of their childhood. I am interested in your reason for calling my statement selfish, naive and "indicates a whole lot of other things".

Cindy

Cindy, I'm curious too. I understood what you meant and I'm sure that most people here did.

 

[menageriekeeper]

Rachel dear, not to spoil your celebration but the 31st is on Monday......

Bro. James, what better time to spread the love of Christ to others than a day when they literally come to your door?

 

[Rachel]

Originally posted by menageriekeeper:
Rachel dear, not to spoil your celebration but the 31st is on Monday......

LOL Yes I know. What I meant was, that is when I got baptized 6 yrs ago, it was a Sunday morning.

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by TennisNE1:
DHK,
It if VERY interesting that you tell me to open my eyes beyond the borders of my town. Let me tell you why.
My father is a pastor( I moved around a lot when I was a child.)
My husband is a pastor ( I have lived in five different states while following my husband)
My brother is a missionary to the Cape Verde Islands off the coast of West Africa. I have visited there on two occasions.
My brother in law is a missionary to Honduras. I have visited there twice also.
My best friend is a missionary's wife to Mexico. I have visited her several times, once during the days of the dead.
I just returned from a trip to Canada, and I saw none of the children you referenced in your above post.
I have also traveled to Paris, France to our mission point there.
I have traveled to Costa Rica while my brother in law was in language school there.
Please let me know how misfortunate children from other countries diminishes what I said about robbing a child of his/her childhood is a sin???

You have many friends and relatives that are in full time service for the Lord, for which you can be thankful. If you look at my profile you will see that I am a missionary. You wouldn't see any of the things that I posted in Canada, I agree. I am not posting from Canada. That is one of the reasons that I am replying to your post quite late. Internet here is sporadic, unreliable (as is electricity) and quite undependable. Just to be able to post once in awhile is a privilege.

My best friend is a missionary's wife to Mexico. I have visited her several times, once during the days of the dead.

Where did you stay? In first class hotels? In tourist resorts? On well protected mission compounds where you really don't see the outside world? Was that the case? Didn't you open your eyes to those around you? Mexico is full of child-labor camps. Labor is cheap because of children that are forced to work; even parents that sell their children for income. The children work as slaves for x amount of years until the debt is paid off, and then returned--sometimes. Many times they are never returned at all. I find it so pitiful in your attitude.

"My little Johnny is missing out on his childhood because he can't celebrate Halowe'en." Most children (especially in 3rd world countries don't have a childhood, as we define it. They are forced to work to help out with the family income as early as six and seven years old. What childhood are you talking about? Halowe'en? Get a grip!! There are more serious things in life. How often do you see people in Mexico celebrating Hallowe'en.

Spend time in Mexico right among the people and see what they do celebrate. See how the Catholic religion (the Mexican's largest relgion) mixes paganism and the occult, to accomadate Mexican culture and beliefs to their religion. The Catholic religion is like a Chameleon. It changes colors wherever it is. It incorporates paganism from Hindus, Islam, and many other religions, depending on the area in which it is located. A Mexican Roman Catholic will use incantations, (like a witch doctor would), sprinkle water and/or oil to ward off evil spirits (an occultic practice), light candles under their idols, like statues of Mary (a Hindu practice), etc. etc. Please, don't tell me you have been to Mexico and haven't observed any of these things!! Was it just a sight-seeing tour that you went on?

Almost every third world mation has such things in common--deep poverty, much superstition, and an incomplete knowledge of the gospel primarily due to the poisonous teaching of the Roman Catholic Church.

Have you ever seen:
a goat or chicken offered to a statue of Mary?
a pilgrimmage made to a statue of Mary (like the Muslims)?
people voluntarily crucifying themselves to crosses in the name of Catholicism?
the Hindu practice of lighting candles, as many as possible encircling the statue of Mary?
the warding off of demons by sprinkling "holy Water" on the door posts of your house?

I could go on. This follows the paganization of Christianity and the beginning of the Catholic Church in 313 when Constantine made a false profession of faith, introduced idolatry into the Church, and made it a state religion by legalizing it. The paganization of the Catholic Church has not stopped. It continues today. And Christians unwittingly support it making a mockery of this false religion, its pagan practices, and even the worship of demons, by the imitation thereof.
And you say it deprives your child of his/her childhood. God help us all!
DHK

 

[jw]

I think this is a prime example of a modern day "meat offered to idols" thing.

Some people feel it is wrong because of the history behind the holiday, though it is not celebrated like that any longer. Others do it just to have fun and get some candy.

Just like some felt buying the meat offered to idols was wrong because of where it came from. Others wanted a cheap meal and some good meat. Paul said meat is meat.

Obey our conscience and do not judge one another.

 

[TennisNE1]

I will not respond to you anymore. I don't know how you became a moderator on this board. You rush to make accusations without ANY knowledge.
Maybe more reliable internet service would help.

BTW, my best friend does not live in a tourist area, far from it.

Cindy

 

[Rachel]

Cindy, sometimes here you can say something like the sky is blue and you will get jumped on big time.
Ignore the bad and take the good.

God Bless,
Rachel