Has God only had One Covenant with the Nation of Israel?

[Heretic Hunter]

Two-Part O.P. Part 1 of 2:

God Himself ONLY has had ONE nation in a Covenant relationship with Him, Israel under the old Covenant!

Or did The Testator give His life on the cross at Calvary, to make a New Covenant/Testament to save sinners from ALL Nations?

This issue was raised on another thread, by someone that identified him or her self as "Yeshua" (another Jesus by another name) and claims be Baptist. I contend that The New Covenant/Testament is the most import topic in Biblical history, not the mention the fulfillment of prophesies concerning the True Messiah, The True and Living Lord Jesus Christ, Who is fully God and fully Man.

There are several chapters in Apostle Paul's Episitle to the 12 Tribes of Israel scattered abroad on the subject of the Old Testament and New Testament. Hebrews 6-13 Please weigh in and share your thoughts, as well as passages from The Holy Bible on this most important subject! Let's also consider 2Cor 11 Matt 24 1John 4:1-5 as the passages pertain to false Christs, those that preach "another jesus", "another gospel", with "another spirit. Also see 2Cor 6:14-18 & 2Tim3-4

Do you fully understand these passages to grasp End Times Deceptions?

Moreover, there are two other people, participating on BB, that preach "another jesus" that deny His bodily ressurection and His Deity.

Apostle John wrote this passage by inspiration of The Holy Spirit to serve as both instruction and warning to the Church;


2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

2Jn 1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.

2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

2Jn 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.


The Lord Jesus Christ also gave this instruction:

Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

What brings unity among brethren?

 

[Heretic Hunter]

Two-Part O.P. Part 2 of 2:

Furthermore, we also have this warning afforded to us by Apostle Peter:

2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2Pe 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
.........

2Pe 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

2Pe 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;

2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

2Pe 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
.........
2Pe 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.

2Pe 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.

2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
.........
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Jude also wrote this, concerning the very same issue as written in the Epistles of Apostle Peter:

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[Yeshua1]

Two-Part O.P. Part 1 of 2:



Or did The Testator give His life on the cross at Calvary, to make a New Covenant/Testament to save sinners from ALL Nations?

This issue was raised on another thread, by someone that identified him or her self as "Yeshua" (another Jesus by another name) and claims be Baptist. I contend that The New Covenant/Testament is the most import topic in Biblical history, not the mention the fulfillment of prophesies concerning the True Messiah, The True and Living Lord Jesus Christ, Who is fully God and fully Man.

There are several chapters in Apostle Paul's Episitle to the 12 Tribes of Israel scattered abroad on the subject of the Old Testament and New Testament. Hebrews 6-13 Please weigh in and share your thoughts, as well as passages from The Holy Bible on this most important subject! Let's also consider 2Cor 11 Matt 24 1John 4:1-5 as the passages pertain to false Christs, those that preach "another jesus", "another gospel", with "another spirit. Also see 2Cor 6:14-18 & 2Tim3-4

Do you fully understand these passages to grasp End Times Deceptions?

Moreover, there are two other people, participating on BB, that preach "another jesus" that deny His bodily ressurection and His Deity.

Apostle John wrote this passage by inspiration of The Holy Spirit to serve as both instruction and warning to the Church;


2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

2Jn 1:8 Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.

2Jn 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

2Jn 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:

2Jn 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.


The Lord Jesus Christ also gave this instruction:

Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

What brings unity among brethren?

God has only been in A Covenant relationship with One Nation in history, National Israel under the Old Covenant!

 

[Yeshua1]

Two-Part O.P. Part 2 of 2:

Furthermore, we also have this warning afforded to us by Apostle Peter:

2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2Pe 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
.........

2Pe 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

2Pe 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;

2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:

2Pe 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
.........
2Pe 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.

2Pe 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.

2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
.........
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Jude also wrote this, concerning the very same issue as written in the Epistles of Apostle Peter:

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Are you listing those such as myself and Logos1560 in among that group than?

 

[Covenanter]

God has only been in A Covenant relationship with One Nation in history, National Israel under the Old Covenant!

Please define a Scriptural Covenant - we need to understand what we are discussing.

 

[Yeshua1]

Please define a Scriptural Covenant - we need to understand what we are discussing.

A God instituted relationship between Himself and a nation, a person, in which the other party receives the benefit of what God started and finished for their behalf... Like when God declared that he was the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, due to Him setting up that relationship with Himself, by the Lord Himself setting it up!

 

[37818]

God has only been in A Covenant relationship with One Nation in history, National Israel under the Old Covenant!

The New Covenant was made for Israel, Jeremiah 31:31-34; Revelation 21:12.

 

[Yeshua1]

The New Covenant was made for Israel, Jeremiah 31:31-34; Revelation 21:12.

Actually, was made for spiritual Israel, and the saved Jews are part of that!
Those Jews still living when Jesus returns shall see Him, and shall mourn and be saved by Him, as they will at that time be saying now "blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord"

 

[Dave G]

God has only been in A Covenant relationship with One Nation in history, National Israel under the Old Covenant!

One physical nation ( Exodus 19:5-6 ), I would agree.

" But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:" ( 1 Peter 2:9 )

God has made a spiritual covenant with individual peoples out of all tongues, tribes and nations ( Revelation 5:9, Revelation 7:9, Revelation 21:24 ) .

 

[Covenanter]

Please define a Scriptural Covenant - we need to understand what we are discussing.

A God instituted relationship between Himself and a nation, a person, in which the other party receives the benefit of what God started and finished for their behalf... Like when God declared that he was the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, due to Him setting up that relationship with Himself, by the Lord Himself setting it up!

That's a good working definition. How does it work out in practice?

While the Covenant of grace with Noah (Gen. 6 was personal in that his household was saved by obedience & faith, the Covenant is developed into a general Covenant with all the earth In Gen. 9. An unconditional promise that God would maintain a fruitful earth that required no obedience of man. There were however specific occasions when the providential care was suspended for particular purposes or because of gross sin. e.g. The 7 years of plenty followed by 7 years of famine that took Israel into Egypt, and the plague of locusts in Joel. There are in Scripture many judgmental famines in God's dealings with Israel.

We need to note the terms of the Old Covenant.

Exo. 19:3 Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, ‘This is what you are to say to the descendants of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: 4 “You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.” These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.’​

THe Covenant requirements are given more fully in the Commandments that follow. THen in Exo. 24 the Israelites declare their commitment to obedience, and the Covenant is ratified by a blood sacrifice.

3 When Moses went and told the people all the Lord’s words and laws, they responded with one voice, ‘Everything the Lord has said we will do.’ 4 Moses then wrote down everything the Lord had said.

He got up early the next morning and built an altar at the foot of the mountain and set up twelve stone pillars representing the twelve tribes of Israel. 5 Then he sent young Israelite men, and they offered burnt offerings and sacrificed young bulls as fellowship offerings to the Lord. 6 Moses took half of the blood and put it in bowls, and the other half he splashed against the altar. 7 Then he took the Book of the Covenant and read it to the people. They responded, ‘We will do everything the Lord has said; we will obey.’

8 Moses then took the blood, sprinkled it on the people and said, ‘This is the blood of the covenant that the Lord has made with you in accordance with all these words.’​

God is gracious & realistic; he didn't demand perfect, sinless obedience for the Israelites to be in Covenant relationship. He required willing obedience, & provided sacrifices for disobedience.

Repeatedly Israel violated the Old Covenant Law, & suffered in consequence. A better Covenant was needed, the New Covenant of Jeremiah 31.

33 ‘This is the covenant that I will make with the people of Israel
after that time,’ declares the Lord.
‘I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.​

The New Covenant in Jesus' blood ratified at Calvary, and declared to the people of Israel at Pentecost, when the indwelling Holy Spirit was promised to all repentant sinners who trust in Jesus.

The Old Covenant relied on man's obedience, & failed. The New Covenant relies on Jesus' obedience & blood, & cannot fail.

Peter takes up the wording of the Old Covenant & applies it to all believers in 1 Peter 2.

9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light. 10 Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.​

There is no continuing Old Covenant; the rejection of their Messiah by the unbelieving Israelites placed them outside the Covenant they relied on. As Peter explained in Acts 3:

22 For Moses said, “The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among your own people; you must listen to everything he tells you. 23 Anyone who does not listen to him will be completely cut off from their people.”
24 ‘Indeed, beginning with Samuel, all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days. 25 And you are heirs of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers. He said to Abraham, “Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.” 26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.’​

 

[Squire Robertsson]

As the OP Heretic Hunter is now temporarily banned this thread is closed.