Hip-hop is...

[Rufus_1611]

"Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;" - Ephesians 5:19

"Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord." - Colossians 3:16​

 

[CheeseCrackerKidd]

Hip-Hop may be spiritual, but it is definitely not Spiritual.

As I pointed out in a previous thread, there is nothing decent about hip-hop.

Nor is there anything edifying about hip-hop. And the only glorifying hip-hop does is glorifying the world. It certainly does not bring glory to God.

 

[Eric B]

How many churches use hip-hop as their corporate or responsive "songs" in the service? (which is what the "singing" in this verse is applied to). None that I have ever heard. The same goes for much of the other "contemporary" styles people complain of.

Rap is a type of poetry, and if done in Church, is usually a performance (like "special music"). Now, you can argue against performance as being "worldly", but that would implicate whichever style/genre is used for it. (Including "classical/traditional").

 

[tenor]

Hip-Hop may be spiritual, but it is definitely not Spiritual.

As I pointed out in a previous thread, there is nothing decent about hip-hop.

Nor is there anything edifying about hip-hop. And the only glorifying hip-hop does is glorifying the world. It certainly does not bring glory to God.

Scripture please?

What does your church do during worship? How do they do it? Are you saying there is nothing of "the world" used in your worship service and in your home? What musical styles are used in your church? How are prayers doen? What preaching style is used? Does your church use an "altar call"invitation? (that is a direct descendant of the 19th century revivalist movement and not mentioned in scripture in association with a worship service) Does that make it worng? No.

Probably a good deal of these things are culturally influenced in style not content.

 

[tenor]

I answered "all of the above" because the way the survey is phraesed that was the only answer I could find that fit. I love biased surveys.

There needs to be an "It could be all of the above" answer.

I've always loved it when people try to use a very narrow definition for what constitutes music.

Context and usage could fit in each category.

 

[tenor]

How many churches use hip-hop as their corporate or responsive "songs" in the service? (which is what the "singing" in this verse is applied to). None that I have ever heard. The same goes for much of the other "contemporary" styles people complain of.

Rap is a type of poetry, and if done in Church, is usually a performance (like "special music"). Now, you can argue against performance as being "worldly", but that would implicate whichever style/genre is used for it. (Including "classical/traditional").

Good point.

 

[tenor]

Some people may be coming from that "culture" and want to put it all behind. I can undersatand this and support them in their decisions. However, that necessarily make it "evil" or immoral" for others to use.

The passage about meat sacrificed to idols comes to mind. This scripture fits the context.

 

[Rufus_1611]

I answered "all of the above" because the way the survey is phraesed that was the only answer I could find that fit. I love biased surveys.

There needs to be an "It could be all of the above" answer.

I've always loved it when people try to use a very narrow definition for what constitutes music.

Context and usage could fit in each category.

It's just the Biblical definition...sorry if my bias offends you and I thought I worded it quite fairly. Feel free to start your own non-biased survey that includes an "It could be" option and we can work off of yours.

 

[webdog]

Poll is flawed, as Hip Hop can be USED for what's mentioned in the poll...and for sinful reasons.

 

[Rufus_1611]

Poll is flawed, as Hip Hop can be USED for what's mentioned in the poll...and for sinful reasons.

Alrighty...special poll for Webdog...

1. Can a hip hop song be a hymn?
   
2. Can a hip hop song be a psalm?
   
3. Can a hip hop song be a spritiual song?
   
4. All of the above?
   
5. None of the above?

 

[npetreley]

Now, Rufus, why would you leave this obvious link out of this thread?

http://www.holyhiphop.com/streetgospel101.html

 

[CheeseCrackerKidd]

The very first paragraph on the link npetreley provided is flawed. When they say the ark was just an ark until God made it holy is very deceiving.

Since God gave the instructions and told what the ark was for, the ark was holy from the very beginning. It was not just an ark.

I won't read the rest of the page since the writer was using deceit from the very beginning.

 

[Aaron]

Scripture please?

Scripture was provided in the OP.

 

[tinytim]

Scripture was provided in the OP.

And out of that scripture, I chose "spiritual" assuming it is Christian lyrics with the music....

 

[annsni]

Hip hop is a style of music. It is not, in and of itself a psalm because it has no words. It is not in and of itself a spiritual song because it has no words. It is not a hymn because it has no words. Now tell me the hip-hop SONG and I'll answer the poll.

 

[UnchartedSpirit]

You realize that the early Middle-Eastern Civilazitions were the predecessors to rap music as well as their African neighboors. The're influence on melody and rythim even crept into european music and white americans were playing the same-style beats as hip-hop as early as the 1920's!

[email my papa if you want refrences to my statement]

 

[D28guy]

The problem with hip-hop and rap noise isnt the form or the rythmns or anything else like that. In my opinion it most certainly CAN be used for godly puposes if it is used in a godly way and manner.

But when I see rap and hip hop noise being used for godly purposes the ones involved sound like goons and thugs, they look like goons and thugs, they lurch around like goons and thugs and the you cant understand anything they are saying. A good message with the gospel included is utterly worthless if the message can not be understood plainly.

At that point they become instruments of the evil one for sowing confusion and chaos rather then truth and the clear gospel.

And its not just rap and hip hop noise. I've heard the same chaos and confusion with some of the harder rock groups that some young christians enjoy.

The point of any gospel music is to deliver a godly message, not deliver a goonish, thugish, unintelligable chaotic message.

If I ever see a gospel rap group, or hard rock group, behaving and looking like like christians, and delivering their message in a godly and civilized manner, I'll joyfully give them the "thumbs up" and support them enthusiastically.

Mike

 

[annsni]

The problem with hip-hop and rap noise isnt the form or the rythmns or anything else like that. In my opinion it most certainly CAN be used for godly puposes if it is used in a godly way and manner.

But when I see rap and hip hop noise being used for godly purposes the ones involved sound like goons and thugs, they look like goons and thugs, they lurch around like goons and thugs and the you cant understand anything they are saying. A good message with the gospel included is utterly worthless if the message can not be understood plainly.

At that point they become instruments of the evil one for sowing confusion and chaos rather then truth and the clear gospel.

And its not just rap and hip hop noise. I've heard the same chaos and confusion with some of the harder rock groups that some young christians enjoy.

The point of any gospel music is to deliver a godly message, not deliver a goonish, thugish, unintelligable chaotic message.

If I ever see a gospel rap group, or hard rock group, behaving and looking like like christians, and delivering their message in a godly and civilized manner, I'll joyfully give them the "thumbs up" and support them enthusiastically.

Mike

Mike - I KIND of agree with you. I've seen groups who do the rap or heavy rock and I just can't understand them but you know what? The kids do! They're INTO that style of music and they somehow (don't ask me how) know what the words are saying. I guess I'm just getting old.

I have to say - there's a group that our church works with called Universal Royalty. They're music is more hip-hop and rap which is NOT my style of music at all and I've just heard bits of their songs on my daughter's CD player but I've met these boys and they are amazing. 7 brothers working together, traveling with their mom at their sides, getting to know the kids they perform to (they know most of the kids' names in our youth group of over 100 kids). We had "Youth Week" back at the beginning of summer and they came to play music/worship each night, and during the day they hung out with the kids doing the service projects and beach days right alongside them. I saw quality boys (that honestly, as a mom of growing teen girls, I'd take any of them as my son-in-law -- NOT that I'm matchmaking because they're a little older than my girls but they're that kind of quality) who had hearts for the Lord. While I don't like their music, I love them and will allow my girls to listen to them.

So I think also the style of music really depends on a person's upbringing and such. Someone who grew up in an urban area would probably be more comfortable with hip-hop and rap whereas someone in the south would probably hate it and prefer country. What matters to me is the artist's life and how they live it for the Lord, the words they're saying and the message they're giving their audience. Are they pointing their audience to the Lord or are they up there for the glory?? I'd choose a hip-hop artist who is on fire for God and who is reaching hearts over a hymn singer who is in it for the money.

 

[Aaron]

And out of that scripture, I chose "spiritual" assuming it is Christian lyrics with the music....

Hip hop is a style of music. It is not, in and of itself a psalm because it has no words. It is not in and of itself a spiritual song because it has no words. It is not a hymn because it has no words. Now tell me the hip-hop SONG and I'll answer the poll.

Where is it written that words are the sole, or even the primary criterion to judge the spirituality of a song? It isn't. It's simply an arbitrary assumption on your part.

You're basically saying that when Paul said "psalms, hymns and spirital songs," he was saying "songs, songs and spiritual songs." Paul wasn't describing lyrical content so much as he was styles, contrasted, as they were, to the characteristics of excess and riot sought by the world. (Be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess...) An hymn was a distinctive style recognized by the Greeks. Paeans and dithyrambs were also sung to deities, but their characters were quite set apart from those songs described as hymns.

So, again. The Scripture was provided in the OP. You simply haven't worked to understand it.

 

[Eric B]

But that "contrast" is not about one rhythm contrasted with another, or the "Western traditional" styles we associate with "hymns". (People can get drunk and riot and have excess listening to "traditional" styles as well).
You read this passage as if it says "plain psalms, plain hymns, and plain songs".

Again, rap is not used as a "worship song", so the people using it in Church are not even claiming it is a "psalm, hymn or spiritual song". It is a performance. If you think it is wrong for being a performance, then it would nto matter which style it was.