HOLY GHOST/SPIRIT, ie the third member of the Trinity

[Herb Evans]

Tom Butler]Of course, the HS fell on believers in Acts 2, and they were not saved a second time.

More correct, the HS FILLED THE HOUSE, hence the immersion much like the tabernacle and the temple. They were collectivly immersed in the Holy Spirt and were ALL filled. -- Herb Evans

I see this as a one-time event, which empowered the believers in the upper room. The Scripture is silent whether it happened to the 3000 who were saved that day.

I have no problem with this except to say "never to be repeated" It was an exact fulfillement of the prophesy (Mark 1:8; Acts 1:5). -- Herb Evans

I also see the Acts 10 outpouring as more for Peter's benefit and the Jewish believers who were with him--a sign to them that the hated Gentiles were also beneficiaries of God's grace. It was also evidence to Peter that they had been saved.

As I said in my article it was an authenication of the Gentiles. Elsewhere, there is an authenication by the HS in regard to the Samaritans. The baptism in Acts 2 was more than an authenication since Jews were already acceptable. It was an inauguration of the already existing church founded in Matthew 16 and 18. Moreover, Acts 2 was the innauguration of the already present and received HS (ANOTHER Comforter) that was promised. Only one inauguration of the church was necessary. Only one inauguration of the VICE Christ was necessary. Similarly only one inauguration water baptism is necessary for the believer. -- Herb Evans

As to your question about any other individual who received the HS outside of a group setting, the answer is no, I can't think of one. Nor do I think it is necessary that there be one, since the HS had already fallen on individuals in the groups.

Thank you for that admission with disclaimer. Why would not something be necessary to what one is propagating? Must we take your word for it? Did you physically feel, hear, or see the baptism of the Holy Spirit when you were saved? -- Herb Evans

 

[Baptist_Pastor/Theologian]

Tom Butler]Of course, the HS fell on believers in Acts 2, and they were not saved a second time.

More correct, the HS FILLED THE HOUSE, hence the immersion much like the tabernacle and the temple. They were collectivly immersed in the Holy Spirt and were ALL filled. -- Herb Evans

I see this as a one-time event, which empowered the believers in the upper room. The Scripture is silent whether it happened to the 3000 who were saved that day.

I have no problem with this except to say "never to be repeated" It was an exact fulfillement of the prophesy (Mark 1:8; Acts 1:5). -- Herb Evans

I also see the Acts 10 outpouring as more for Peter's benefit and the Jewish believers who were with him--a sign to them that the hated Gentiles were also beneficiaries of God's grace. It was also evidence to Peter that they had been saved.

As I said in my article it was an authenication of the Gentiles. Elsewhere, there is an authenication by the HS in regard to the Samaritans. The baptism in Acts 2 was more than an authenication since Jews were already acceptable. It was an inauguration of the already existing church founded in Matthew 16 and 18. Moreover, Acts 2 was the innauguration of the already present and received HS (ANOTHER Comforter) that was promised. Only one inauguration of the church was necessary. Only one inauguration of the VICE Christ was necessary. Similarly only one inauguration water baptism is necessary for the believer. -- Herb Evans

As to your question about any other individual who received the HS outside of a group setting, the answer is no, I can't think of one. Nor do I think it is necessary that there be one, since the HS had already fallen on individuals in the groups.

Thank you for that admission with disclaimer. Why would not something be necessary to what one is propagating? Must we take your word for it? Did you physically feel, hear, or see the baptism of the Holy Spirit when you were saved? -- Herb Evans

Dr. Herb,

With all due respect this makes you sound as though you did not have a born again experience with the Holy Spirit once you believed. I did feel the Holy Spirit come into my heart when I asked Christ to forgive me for my sins. You are using circular logic which states that for the baptism of the Holy Spirit to occur it has to match the exact events of Acts 2 or else is not the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Moreover, you do not seem to be able to differentiate between the OT and NT activity of the Spirit of the Lord. The NT experience is under a new covenant which allows God's Spirit to be a life giving force. Prior to the NT the Spirit or glory of the Lord always was revealed in judgment and condemnation of the people of Israel. You really need to study 2 Corinthians 2 and 3 in order to get a better understanding of the Law verses the Spirit and how the law brings death under the old covenant but now the Spirit brings life under the new.

 

[Herb Evans]

Baptist_Pastor/Theologian]Dr. Herb, With all due respect this makes you sound as though you did not have a born again experience with the Holy Spirit once you believed. I did feel the Holy Spirit come into my heart when I asked Christ to forgive me for my sins.

Couldn't stay away . . . eh?

Well, you will note that I was referring to "physical" feelings. Still, who is responsible to have your experience or to trust in your experience. That is what the Charismatics do. Joy, feeling of well being, fear, awe, Pilgrim's Progress type sin burdens lifted; that is all fine. Emotions vary from person to person, but I was talking about audible sounds, visible sights, and feeling the room being shaken. You are posting a straw man, and your are insinuating that someone is not born again, because they may not have had your particular experience. How about using the scriptures next time. -- Herb Evans

You are using circular logic which states that for the baptism of the Holy Spirit to occur it has to match the exact events of Acts 2 or else is not the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

That is not circular logic. That is connecting the dots of Mark 1:8 and Acts 1:5 and Acts 2 and observing that my opponents have no dots to connect. -- Herb Evans

Moreover, you do not seem to be able to differentiate between the OT and NT activity of the Spirit of the Lord.

Per what scriptures? Be specific, I don't like general charges or accusations. -- Herb Evans

The NT experience is under a new covenant which allows God's Spirit to be a life giving force. Prior to the NT the Spirit or glory of the Lord always was revealed in judgment and condemnation of the people of Israel.

You keep wanting to inject covenants into this discussion, and do NOT even post any scriptures to your platitudes. We are not talking about covenants. -- Herb Evans

You really need to study 2 Corinthians 2 and 3 in order to get a better understanding of the Law verses the Spirit and how the law brings death under the old covenant but now the Spirit brings life under the new.

Okay, give me a better understanding and exegete the passages in 1 Cor. 2 and 3. I don' t have the slightest idea as to your non-specific advice. -- Herb Evans