Hooters church

[Scarlett O.]

Originally posted by HappyG:
My church meets in a movie theater. And when we sing "Surely the Presence of the Lord is in this Place" I get real tickled. People are being saved and lives are being changed at a "well." I just think Jesus would be pleased.

To echo Blackbird's sentiments, let me say you are talking about apples and oranges.

Christians can meet anywhere. Your church is an example of that.

But I know that your pastor is not shouting above a movie being played. You are talking about an empty theater where no movie is playing. I think that the owners of the movie house should be commended for letting you all meet there.

But what would you think of this?

Let's say a group of Christians pay for tickets and sit in the back few rows of a movie theater while "American Pie" is playing. Would Jesus be pleased with that?

Would those Christians be able truly engage in worship and Bible study while that vulgar movie was playing in front of them.

And would the lost people there be even remotely interested in the worship and Bible study being offered?

Same thing with the Hooter's fiasco.

For those young people, especially the boys, how much worship and focus on Bible study is actually accomplished while the "skin is showin' and the beer is flowin'?"

Apples and oranges.

No one is saying that you have to be in the "church house" to have church. And no one is saying that Christians should disassociate themselves with nonbelievers.

Peace-

YSIC
Scarlett O.
<><

 

[HappyG]

Actually, Blackbird, I am the pastor. Regal Theaters has a national initiative to get churches into their theaters on Sunday Mornings. They are very church friendly.

As far as distractions, if I were doing "church" and wanted to do things as you are describing then I would consider the atmosphere of Hooters detrimental to that type of traditional church. But that isn't what this group is doing. They are intentionally taking the message to a place that unchurched people don't expect it to be taken for the very purpose of spreading their faith to people that would never come to the environment that you and I may be comfortable with but they would never enter. That is they wouldn' enter until someone puts a "living demonstration" in front of them of what a person can be like who takes their faith seriously.

As far as yours and Scarlet's comments about the shocking outfits of the Hooters waitresses. Have you been outside recently? And that isn't a personal attack. But I will tell you that those Hooters waitresses aren't wearing anything that you and I don't see at every public venue. You can withdraw and be a monk or you can by the power of God be a shining light in darkness.

Once again, if you asked me would I choose Hooters. I wouldn't and not because I think what this guy is doing is sin. I just would do it a little different.

But my point stands that many "christians" would criticise Jesus in the same way that you criticise what this man is doing or what other ministries do.

I guess we will get to heaven and we can ask him specifically these questions. But what I see in his life and ministry leads me to my conclusion on this.

 

[BornBaptist]

Originally posted by delly:
I once knew a Pastor from Arkansas who came to our church for a revival. He was a great guy and on fire for God. His downfall was that he got to going in bars to "win souls". As an old preacher friend of mine used to say; "you can't wallow in the pig pen without getting mud on you". The Pastor from Arkansas started drinking, had an affair and stole some money from his church. He lost his church, his wife and family and became an alcoholic because he lost his focus on God.

These youths need to be careful that the world doesn't win them over instead of the other way around.

We are the only Bible that some people ever read. We need to make sure that all our actions and the places we frequent reflect that we are Christians.

I not saying we should ignore these people, but we need to find other ways to reach them.

Then he wasn't really saved or wasn't very serious about it.

-BornBaptist

 

[BornBaptist]

Originally posted by dianetavegia:
We left our only daughter's wedding reception when the bar was opened. She knew ahead of time that we would. They held off until after the dinner. Her in-laws insisted there could be no wedding without all the drinking and band. They paid for it too.

AND YOU LET HER MARRY HIM???

 

[msinave]

I was also born Baptist and learned a long time ago to NEVER presume about someone's salvation. And I guess I'm hiding under a rock but I wasn't aware that a parent could prevent the marriage of a child of legal age.

 

[dianetavegia]

Originally posted by BornBaptist:
AND YOU LET HER MARRY HIM???

She was almost 26 and 5 months pregnant. She hadn't lived in our home since she was 19. We were only invited to the wedding 4 days before because we had taken a stand against her living with this guy.

If you think a parent can tell a grown child who they can marry, you must not have grown children.

Diane

 

[aefting]

You have to contextualize what was going on. I know that going to the well in our culture sounds like going to the well and getting a drink of water. But going to the well in the middle of the afternoon was like going to the street corner in the middle of the night in our culture. Or for the sake of this argument we could say going to the well in the middle of the afternoon was like going to the "Hooters" of the day. It was not the place for an "upstanding Christian" to be. But Jesus wasn't there to "have drinks and google" the women. He was there for a different reason. He was there to have "church." He was there to "call someone out...to catch a human soul and make it fully alive."

I thumbed through a few of my materials on John and could find no reference to what you are saying here. On what basis do you suggest that Christ put Himself into the same sort of lewd situation as going to Hooters or a harlet's street corner in the middle of the night?

Andy

 

[HappyG]

Aefting,

Here is the basis.

The "Samaritan" woman...from a Jewish perspective was a "half-breed" someone to be avoided at all costs. The Jews viewed Samaritans as worse than Gentiles and if a Gentile woman was on the side of the road giving birth to a child...the Jew was not to help deliver a "sinner" into the world.

Not only that, no upstanding woman was at the well in the middle of the day and a woman who had it together didn't have to draw water at all. It was a time when the lower class and the "down and outers" would go to the well.

Not only that, it was a known fact that this woman had 5 husband and the man she was living with was not her husband. That was the reputation...to be seen with her was not what a man of reputation would want. Someone could smeer His name.

Not only that, she was a woman and in that culture Jewish men didn't speak to women especially one who had all the other characteristics previously stated.

And you don't think that Jesus would go to the street corner and seek to "make a soul fully alive" in our culture or enter a restaurant where a woman worked and reach out and tell her of a real life?

I can't imagine him doing anthing but that.

Remember, I didn't say, he would go and hang out, he went with a purpose and would risk offending the "religious" people at the cost of reaching a sinners soul.

That is what I am saying.

 

[aefting]

Nothing that you've said here, though, indicates that the women who went to the well during the heat of the day did so in immodest clothing or purposely attempting to tempt men into sin -- like at a Hooters or a midnight street corner. I don't see any justification in the text for supposing that Jesus put Himself into that type of situation when he went to that well, nor do I see you quoting any cultural authorities that might indicate your theory to be true.

Andy

 

[dianetavegia]

On the contrary, the woman who went to the well in the heat of the day went during that time to avoid the stares, catcalls, shunning from other women. Jesus knew who He would meet and met her for God's glory and purpose.

The woman at the well came to Jesus... in her sinful state.

Diane

 

[HappyG]

aefting,

Once again, I will ask you what I asked Blackbird earlier. Have you been outside in the public lately? The girls who just walk the streets are dressed more scantily than Hooters girls. And many look like prostitutes to be quite honest? And if their goal is to attract men? Would Jesus talk with them? Absolutely.

If you are saying that Jesus would not talk with people that have a stated goal of enticing men because he was afraid that he would be spoken badly of or even fall into sin, I just disagree. I don't think that he would hang out in places for extended periods of time with no purpose and thus opening himself up to temptation but I definitely think he would go places to talk with "sinners" even if the religious crowd had a problem with it.

As far as this womans exact dress, I can't speak to that as I wasn't there. But how do you think a woman in our culture who has had 5 husbands and is now living with a man who is not her husband would look, walk, and talk? What do you think her persona would be when she talked with men? What do you think people in a town that really wasn't that large would think of her whenever she was talking with a "strange man" at the well?

I bet most men knew better than to be seen talking with her. The rumors would get back to their wives.

I guess if you disagree with that...then we just disagree. And that is okay. It probably affects how you minister and how I minister.

I pray that you are blessed and reach many "prostitutes and Hooters girls" with the love of Christ.

 

[GODzThunder]

Jesus went into the home of sinners and brought salvation to their home. This is not a home though. Jesus never went to the brothel to speak with the sinners there and he never went to the massage parlor to witness.

As for your repeted statement, HAppy G, of how the women at hooters are not dressed as the women on the streets...Just because they are not AS bad does not cover the fact that they are dressed to entise. You skirt the issue by trying to justify in your mind that such associations are ok because there are worse things in the world. I love those people who work there with the love of God but I will not and cannot see giving my money to an investment that exploits. And to hold a bible study there they must make purchases. I see this as a Church ministry giving money to a brothel.

 

[HappyG]

GodzThunder,

I don't follow your logic for the most part.

I think I have stated my points and opinions on this pretty clearly.

I just pray that you are reaching "prostitutes and Hooters girls" with the love of God!

 

[Gib]

Can't we get some wings and just all get along?

 

[BornBaptist]

Originally posted by dianetavegia:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by BornBaptist:
AND YOU LET HER MARRY HIM???

She was almost 26 and 5 months pregnant. She hadn't lived in our home since she was 19. We were only invited to the wedding 4 days before because we had taken a stand against her living with this guy.

If you think a parent can tell a grown child who they can marry, you must not have grown children.

Diane </font>[/QUOTE]Right... I didn't realize she was that old... Sorry..

and Yes, you are correct, you can't make 'em when they are adults.

BornBaptist

 

[GODzThunder]

didn't you know that my logic is the only logic and that all other logic is heritic and is cultic in nature. I am also the only one who knows how to properly translate the Bible from the autographs

jk. Happy we will just have to agree to disagree on our personal convictions and yes friend, I am doing all we can here to convert (sucessfully) harlots and theieves and the like!!!