How Did Romans 10:13 Turn Into 'The Sinners Prayer?'

[Winman]

Questions not being asked or answered:

1. If "call upon the name of the Lord" does not mean prayer, what does it mean?

2. If "shall be saved" does not refer to eternal salvation, what kind of salvation does it refer to?

3. Prayer is a work. Salvation comes by faith. So it is not the prayer that saves you. However, would God reject a sincere prayer for salvation as a work that proves faith?

Exactly, you must believe that you are a sinner and believe Jesus is the Son of God who died for your sins and rose from the dead before you will call upon him.

If you believe Jesus was just a normal man who died 2000 years ago, you are not going to pray to him, nobody prays to a dead person (well, most people do not).

The prayer is simply evidence of the faith already present in the heart.

The Lord is not going to reject you for doing what he commanded. If Jesus says, "come to me" (which he does), then he is not going to reject you for coming to him for salvation in the only way you can, which is prayer.

 

[Tom Butler]

The sinner's prayer is simply evidence of the faith that is already present in the heart. You are not going to call on Jesus and ask him to save you unless you truly believe you are a sinner, and unless you truly believe Jesus is the Son of God who died for your sins and rose from the dead. If you believe Jesus was simply a man who lived 2000 years ago who was put to death and is dead in the grave, you are not going to call on him.

So, you must truly believe the gospel to sincerely pray to Jesus and ask him to save you.

That said, you get some folks who pressure people to say a prayer they don't want to say. These persons are not saved. If you have to pressure a person into saying the sinner's prayer, most likely they do not truly believe.

In my case, I was a 10 year old boy afraid of dying and going to hell. I did not want to leave the church until I got the matter settled. No one had to pressure me into praying to Jesus and asking for forgiveness, not one bit.

I identify with your experience. I had heard many sermons, a lot of them about Hell, but never really gave them much thought until the Holy Spirit brought me under conviction. All of a sudden Hell seemed very real to me, and it scared me to death. Down the aisle I went.

I don't mind suggesting to someone who's under conviction that they simply ask God to save them. But beyond that, I can't help them. If they need help with the words, then I have not done a very good job of witnessing to them. At some point, I'm out of the picture and it's between him and God.

And you're right. If they're reluctant to pray for salvation, then back off. When the Holy Spirit brings them under conviction, and illuminates their mind, you won't be able to keep them away.

 

[Winman]

I identify with your experience. I had heard many sermons, a lot of them about Hell, but never really gave them much thought until the Holy Spirit brought me under conviction. All of a sudden Hell seemed very real to me, and it scared me to death. Down the aisle I went.

I don't mind suggesting to someone who's under conviction that they simply ask God to save them. But beyond that, I can't help them. If they need help with the words, then I have not done a very good job of witnessing to them. At some point, I'm out of the picture and it's between him and God.

And you're right. If they're reluctant to pray for salvation, then back off. When the Holy Spirit brings them under conviction, and illuminates their mind, you won't be able to keep them away.

Oh, agreed. The day I was saved the pastor preached all about hell. I believe the word of God and I was scared to death that if I left church I might be killed on the way home and go to hell. When the pastor invited anyone who wanted to know how to be saved to come down, I almost ran down to the front. I had never been in that church before and there was a big crowd, I didn't care, I wanted to learn how to be saved NOW. I didn't care what anyone else thought, I take the scriptures for REAL.

 

[salzer mtn]

I have a question. The bible said the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying God be merciful to me a sinner. I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other. What made this publican to know he was justified ? If you say, by scripture. Can you prove he even knew any scripture.

 

[Winman]

I have a question. The bible said the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying God be merciful to me a sinner. I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other. What made this publican to know he was justified ? If you say, by scripture. Can you prove he even knew any scripture.

We are not told what the publican knew, so that cannot be answered.

But we ARE told that this man went down to his house justified. He was saved, his sins were forgiven.

So, the sinner's prayer is absolutely scriptural unless you believe Jesus does not know sound doctrine.

 

[HankD]

Romans 10:13 and the modern day sinner's prayer have nothing in common. Whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall is saved is a far cry from doing a skip to my lou down the aisle during the invitation. Now, repeat after me "Lord, I know I am a sinner." Response, "Lord I know I am a sinner." "I believe You rose from the dead" "I believe you rose from the dead" etc, etc, etc. A parrot can do that.

That is not calling on the name of the Lord. Walking down the aisle is not calling on the name of the Lord. Repeating a prayer after a pastor is not calling on the name of the Lord. Standing up at the altar and shaking hands with the congregation is not calling on the name of the Lord.

One of the best examples in Scripture of calling on the name of the Lord is the man who says "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner" right where he was, at the time he was there.

He did not have to wait for the end of a service after 15 verses of "Just As I Am." He did not have to be within ten feet of the podium. By the way, the First Baptist Church of Jerusalem in 35 AD is a fairy tale.

The Lord saves. Feeling guilty sermons do not save. Neither does any other man made invention.

Thanks sn.

I wouldn't say that they have "nothing in common". I don't believe that every modern "call upon the name of the Lord" is a "skip to the Lou" pretense.

But I think I understand where you are coming from.

Matthew 13 speaks of the wheat and the tares. Jesus told us there would be "weeds" among the wheat, He called them "tares". I'm sure you are aware of this.

In fact He even said to leave them alone "lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them".

It is my opinion that tares can give a much more subtle presentation than a mindless recitation of words.

Be patient, perhaps some of the tares are destined to be transformed into wheat.

HankD

 

[Tom Butler]

So, is there more than one way to be saved?

1. Acts 9. The Ethiopian Eunuch: "I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God." Philip immediately baptized him.

2. Acts 16: The Phillippian jailer: "What must I do to be saved?" Paul and Silas: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you'll be saved."

3. Romans 10:9: Paul writes, "confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord. And believe that He rose from the dead. You'll be saved.

4. Romans 10:10: Paul continues, "With the mouth, confession is made to salvation." Confess what? That Jesus is Lord and rose from the dead.

5. Romans 10:13: Paul continues, "Call on the name of the Lord to be saved."

6. Acts 2; Peter, Day of Pentecost "Repent, and be baptized, for the remission of sins.

7. Acts 20:21 Paul to the Ephesian elders at Miletus "Testifying to Jews, and also to Greeks, repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ."

8. Luke 13:3 Jesus said "Unless you repent, you'll likewise perish."

Can all these verses be harmonized? Is there more than one way to be saved? Or are all these variations on the same theme?

 

[Winman]

Thanks sn.

I wouldn't say that they have "nothing in common". I don't believe that every modern "call upon the name of the Lord" is a "skip to the Lou" pretense.

But I think I understand where you are coming from.

Matthew 13 speaks of the wheat and the tares. Jesus told us there would be "weeds" among the wheat, He called them "tares". I'm sure you are aware of this.

In fact He even said to leave them alone "lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them".

It is my opinion that tares can give a much more subtle presentation than a mindless recitation of words.

Be patient, perhaps some of the tares are destined to be transformed into wheat.

HankD

Jesus clearly explained why the Pharisee was not saved and the publican was.

Luk 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

The Pharisee was no atheist, he truly believed in God, but he trusted in himself that he was righteous, he boasted of all his good works. This is exactly what is shown in Matthew 7 as well.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Again, these persons are not atheists, in fact, it is emphasized that they call Jesus "Lord, Lord" twice. These are Lordship salvationists if ever there was one. They trusted in themselves they were righteous like the Pharisee in Luke 18, they boasted that they prophesied in Jesus' name, cast out devils in his name, and did many "wonderful works" in Jesus name.

These folks believed in God, and they believed in their own works. These were not saved. It is no mystery, it is clearly shown.

The publican made no boasts. He confessed he was a sinner and cast himself completely on the mercy of God. He was saved.

 

[Winman]

Thanks sn.

I wouldn't say that they have "nothing in common". I don't believe that every modern "call upon the name of the Lord" is a "skip to the Lou" pretense.

But I think I understand where you are coming from.

Matthew 13 speaks of the wheat and the tares. Jesus told us there would be "weeds" among the wheat, He called them "tares". I'm sure you are aware of this.

In fact He even said to leave them alone "lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them".

It is my opinion that tares can give a much more subtle presentation than a mindless recitation of words.

Be patient, perhaps some of the tares are destined to be transformed into wheat.

HankD

Jesus clearly explained why the Pharisee was not saved and the publican was.

Luk 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

The Pharisee was no atheist, he truly believed in God, but he trusted in himself that he was righteous, he boasted of all his good works. This is exactly what is shown in Matthew 7 as well.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Again, these persons are not atheists, in fact, it is emphasized that they call Jesus "Lord, Lord" twice. These are Lordship salvationists if ever there was one. They trusted in themselves they were righteous like the Pharisee in Luke 18, they boasted that they prophesied in Jesus' name, cast out devils in his name, and did many "wonderful works" in Jesus name.

These folks believed in God, but they trusted in their own righteousness and works. These were not saved. It is no mystery, it is clearly shown.

The publican made no boasts. He confessed he was a sinner and cast himself completely on the mercy of God. He was saved.

 

[quantumfaith]

Jesus clearly explained why the Pharisee was not saved and the publican was.

Luk 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, [COLOR="Blue"[COLOR="red"]]God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are[/COLOR], extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.[/COLOR]
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

The Pharisee was no atheist, he truly believed in God, but he trusted in himself that he was righteous, he boasted of all his good works. This is exactly what is shown in Matthew 7 as well.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Again, these persons are not atheists, in fact, it is emphasized that they call Jesus "Lord, Lord" twice. These are Lordship salvationists if ever there was one. They trusted in themselves they were righteous like the Pharisee in Luke 18, they boasted that they prophesied in Jesus' name, cast out devils in his name, and did many "wonderful works" in Jesus name.

These folks believed in God, but they trusted in their own righteousness and works. These were not saved. It is no mystery, it is clearly shown.

The publican made no boasts. He confessed he was a sinner and cast himself completely on the mercy of God. He was saved.

Great analysis WM, there is so much more also in this passage of scripture which stands out to me.