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Featured How Does Penal Substitution Relate to Other Atonement Theories?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by taisto, Sep 8, 2023.

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  1. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    ????? Romans 6:23. 'For the wages of sin is death, BUT the gift of God is eternal life, in Christ Jesus our Lord.' It is God Himself who gives what you are pleased to call a caveat. God has provided a way that sinful men can be justified by God; that way is the penal substitution provided by the Lord Jesus Christ set forth by Paul in Romans 3.
    Now you are being silly. If I am calling God a liar, so is the vast majority of Baptists down the ages, including Bunyan and Spurgeon.
    It would certainly be true were it not for the 'but.'
    No. I am saying that the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. To find out how that gift of God comes to us we have to stop bouncing up and down on one verse of Scripture as if it were a trampoline and read the Bible properly.
     
    #41 Martin Marprelate, Sep 12, 2023
  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    You still don't comprehend.

    Simple forgiveness is typically viewed as forgiving somebody because that person is sorry.

    God forgives based on repentance (passages have been provided, although you deny their truth).

    This repentance is not just being sorry. It includes sorrow, but a "godly sorrow leading to repentance".

    It is a change of mind - changing from a mind set on the flesh to a mind set on the Spirit, God removing the old heart, the old spirit, and giving us new ones, God putting His Spirit in us, God recreating us, man dying to sin.

    This is what Pharisees could not grasp, what Nicodemus struggled with.

    I know that seems to you as foolishness. But to many of us it is the power of God unto salvation. That is why we argue so strongly.

    I would persuade you, if I could. But I can't do that is not my goal.
     
    #42 JonC, Sep 12, 2023
  3. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    You added an "unless".

    You said the wages of sin is death unless.

    The wages of sin is death. That is what sin produces, what we earn by sinning.

    And then there is a conjunction (a conjunction is used to introduce a phrase or clause contrasting with what has already been mentioned). This conjunction is "but' (you could use "yet").

    The gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus.

    Sin produces an earned wage - death.
    God gives an unearned gift - life.
     
    #43 JonC, Sep 12, 2023
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