1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Jesus limited the kingdom to spiritual. The Pharisees thought it was physical and rejected him because he refuted that position.
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How does Revealtion 20:10 Support annihilation?
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
I proved you wrong as have some others.
Hilter is a municipality in the district Osnabrück, Lower Saxony, Germany. It is located in the hills of the Teutoburg Forest.
I looked up "lost Granmda" on the net & got this - “Having a grandmother is like having an army. This is a grandchild’s ultimate privilege: knowing that someone is on your side, always, whatever the details. Even when you are wrong. Especially then, in fact. A grandmother is both a sword and a shield.” – Fredrik Backman
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The opening verses of Revelation concern -
things which must shortly come to pass; ..... Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
John quotes from his Olivet prophecy of the AD 70 destruction in v. 7 -
7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all [kindreds of the earth] tribes of the land shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
Mat. 24:30 and then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth/land mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Rev. 11 describes the destruction - of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified. - See Isaiah 1.
Rev. 18:24 gives the reason for Jerusalem's destruction - see Mat. 23:34-36
The horsemen of Rev. 6 implement the four deaths to be inflicted on Jerusalem according to Eze. 14:19-21, yet a remnant will be delivered from that destruction - 22-23 - corresponding to the 144,000 in Rev. 7 & 14.
Peter was concerned about the scoffers questioning Jesus' coming for destruction before this generation passed, & saying - Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. - The older members/fathers of this generation had passed away. So Peter reminds them of God's timing. 1,000 years as one day - the day of the Lord will come. And it did, and the scoffers perished.
Whether Peter knew of John's "millennium" prophecy I don't know, but he could be alluding to it, & refuting those who were questioning Jesus' this generation prophecy.
"Spiritual" kingdom, & other fulfilments of prophecy is misunderstood by those who insist on "literal/grammatical/historical" interpretation of prophecy & is dismissed as "unjustifiable allegory."
Man is essentially three components - body, mind & soul. All our activities concern our bodies, mental nature or spiritual. In this we are distinct from animals that are essentially physical, though of course do form relationships.
Our spiritual nature & activities are real activities that correspond to fulfilment of prophecy in the present Gospel age - new birth, baptism, communion, prayer, assembly for worship. loving relationships, spiritual gifts & activities, witnessing to unconverted, rebuking sin, charitable giving, etc. Many of these have counterparts in Old Covenant laws & rituals.
Supremely we see the present fulfilment of OC messianic prophecies relating to David's Son & the kingdom of Israel in the Lord Jesus Christ & his redeemed people, the church, which comprises both Israelties/Jews & Gentiles as one body united by baptism & a living faith.
In Rev. 20 & the "millennium" John sees Satan bound - to deceive the nations no more - and he also sees the souls of the martyrs & other faithful. Souls, not resurrection bodies. We know Jesus triumphed over Satan at the cross, bound the strong man & freed his captives. And victorious from the grave he gave the "great commission" to the Apostles to preach to all nations. He also warned his disciples that they too would be persecuted as their Lord was, so John sees the souls of dead believers living & reigning with Christ during the millennium.
Note that in John 5 Jesus teaches that hearing & believing is a form of resurrection, aka the new birth described in John 1 & 3. It is that new birth aka first resurrection that ensures that believers will not suffer the second death. Unbelievers of course do not experience that first resurrection. They will suffer the second death.
Now compare Rev. 20 with 2 Thes. 1. Note that -
3 We are bound to thank God always for you, brethren, as it is meet, because that your faith groweth exceedingly, and the charity of every one of you all toward each other aboundeth; 4 so that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: 5 which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: 6 seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; 7 and to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 when he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.
Notice the highlighted verses that teach that the wicked will be judged by fire when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven for the vindication of his saints. No future millennium there - it's the absolute end of the present Gospel millennium.
Neither you nor anyone else has done that.
You must not have read all I said about this subject. My other thread aonios explains my views further.
Just asking for a friend, but are you a gnostic?
No, it doesn't. If there is no eternal hell there is no eternal life, and no eternal God. You can't have it both ways.
Yes, we have. You just ignored it instead of responding to our quotes of bible passages which prove you wrong.
Heaven is eternal, so is hell....
And I've quoted Bible passages, commentary, and references that prove me right. You cannot make an age mean an eternity no matter how hard you try. They are not the same thing. An age is not unconditionally infinite, whether applied to heaven or hell. I suggest you read my thread aionios again carefully. The same word is used to apply to both, and mean the same thing -- an eon or age, which is a long, indefinite period of time.
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For one thing, Dr. Lorraine Day thinks everyone will be saved from his sins and for another thing she denies the holocaust. I don't know what makes her a Greek expert.
I wasn't recommending the article based on her other views. I just thought it was a good study of the word and its usage.
Are you reading other people's posts? I find plenty to disagree with on the forum, but I read the posts, look up the Scriptures & am learning all the time.
Have you read my post #63 above? Any comments?
In that post, in your quote of 2 Thes. 1, the correct and literal rendering of verse 9 should read "age-abiding destruction". God -- our parent, our Father -- punishes for correction and reformation. Punishing for correction rules out punishing forever, unless the one being punished refuses to be corrected.
That's just it--millions of people refuse to be corrected and choose to go to eternal hell. A God of Love cannot force one to love Him but must allow freedom of choice.
No, you have not. The bible does not contradict itself.
And there you go. You admit you deny heaven is eternal. You admit you deny God is eternal. Both are αιονιος.