How does your Church deal with Child professions of Faith?

[Yeshua1]

How do you know they are not faking it, or they have not been pushed & schooled by their parents. How do you know its the Holy Spirit & not some act?

well. we know God is no respector of persons, and called samual young age, and jeremiah/John the baptist called from the womb!

so the Lord determines when and how one of His get saved, so would say treat it as they were saved, but also as they will need to reconfirm and stay in the lord to show it while grow older!

For hell full of persons who walked theAlter and professed faith in jesus as a one time act, but NEVER confirmed it/proved it as actually being real!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

well. we know God is no respector of persons, and called samual young age, and jeremiah/John the baptist called from the womb!

so the Lord determines when and how one of His get saved, so would say treat it as they were saved, but also as they will need to reconfirm and stay in the lord to show it while grow older!

For hell full is of persons who walked the Alter and professed faith in Jesus as a one time act, but NEVER confirmed it/proved it as actually being real!

Nailed it! :thumbsup:

 

[annsni]

How do you know they are not faking it, or they have not been pushed & schooled by their parents. How do you know its the Holy Spirit & not some act?

As a parent, you just kinda know. I know my kids pretty well and know when they are feeding me a line, being a llama drama or truly sincere in their heart. Of course we could be wrong - but I watch them and have seen the fruit of the Spirit in their lives. Like I said, I have two adult daughters now and I can say without a doubt, their faith is their own. We've gone through periods of testing with both of them (testing from the outside - not from them) and I've watched them respond in a way that could not come from themselves but from the Spirit within.

 

[salzer mtn]

All I got to say is lucky for them they weren’t there and that they didn’t attempt to butt in that which was none of their business and try pull their authoritarian approval card out on us, especially on my call as a parent concerning the matter!

All i got to say is lucky for me i was not raised up by parents who pushed me into something i didn't understand. I was talked down to a altar when i was fifteen years old by well meaning but easy believism church members at their revival. This is the way their plan of salvation works, first everyone comes to the altar and tries to pray you into heaven (figuratively) next, they sing songs while you pray and countless people come by with words of incouragement to either tell you to hold on or to turn loose. Next, a more convincing person will come tell you that you have met all the requirements so get up and claim the victory. After all of this madness took place my mother came to where i was at and simply told me, if i didn't understand to come back to my seat. I did, and when i was twenty four years old i truly was born again and no one had to tell me anything, i told them. The bottom line is people will promote what they, themselves have.

 

[webdog]

We take them as being true conversions, but also with the admonition to parents to keep on raising them up in the lord, to keep encouraging and being involved in their chrsitian lives, as some were not really saved, so we want to keep the focus on Christ in their livesto make sure it was real and confirmed!

We do reserve the act of water baptism though to be administered upon a profession of faith at age 12 or later, so no 5 year old get dunked at our church![/QUOTE]

Thats very wise mu friend..... takes the guess work out of it.:thumbsup:

Where is the minimum age requirement in Scripture? My son has wanted to be baptized, and will at the next baptism service (had one this past Sunday but didn't know about it...one of the drawbacks of serving in a church and missing announcements in service occasionally). Knowing my daughter, she will want to follow suite, but I will make sure she understands its a principle of obedience and a sign of repentance before she does. My son at 7 already knows.

 

[webdog]

All i got to say is lucky for me i was not raised up by parents who pushed me into something i didn't understand. I was talked down to a altar when i was fifteen years old by well meaning but easy believism church members at their revival. This is the way their plan of salvation works, first everyone comes to the altar and tries to pray you into heaven (figuratively) next, they sing songs while you pray and countless people come by with words of incouragement to either tell you to hold on or to turn loose. Next, a more convincing person will come tell you that you have met all the requirements so get up and claim the victory. After all of this madness took place my mother came to where i was at and simply told me, if i didn't understand to come back to my seat. I did, and when i was twenty four years old i truly was born again and no one had to tell me anything, i told them. The bottom line is people will promote what they, themselves have.

So your personal bad experience needs to be the litmus test for everyone. Got it. :BangHead:

 

[Yeshua1]

Where is the minimum age requirement in Scripture? My son has wanted to be baptized, and will at the next baptism service (had one this past Sunday but didn't know about it...one of the drawbacks of serving in a church and missing announcements in service occasionally). Knowing my daughter, she will want to follow suite, but I will make sure she understands its a principle of obedience and a sign of repentance before she does. My son at 7 already knows.

Believe that we tie it into the ole 'Age of accountibility", which in bible times seemed to be around that age!

 

[salzer mtn]

I've visited churches that count personal contacts from each individual in each Sunday school class before church service so they can put the total on the board. My sister went to a church summer camp when she was a youngster and when she got home she told how the camp young peoples guides wouldn't let her go eat breakfast unless she made a profession of faith and be baptized. There are preachers that count converts like indians of the past counted coup on their enemies and especially prey on little children just for larger numbers. Salvation is a serious matter and is not to be taken lightly by anyone.

 

[Yeshua1]

I've visited churches that count personal contacts from each individual in each Sunday school class before church service so they can put the total on the board. My sister went to a church summer camp when she was a youngster and when she got home she told how the camp young peoples guides wouldn't let her go eat breakfast unless she made a profession of faith and be baptized. There are preachers that count converts like indians of the past counted coup on their enemies and especially prey on little children just for larger numbers. Salvation is a serious matter and is not to be taken lightly by anyone.

as calvinists, we know the lord can and does save children at young age, for salvation is of the lord, but also know they they will confirm that happened by staying with him when getting older!

 

[Scarlett O.]

I've lived enough to have seen many a times when someone - be they 5 or 50 - who "came forward" and engaged in a religious ritual/tradition without any real understanding.

It isn't an age. It a level of understanding and a sense of urgency brought about by the Holy Spirit.



Does one understand:

• sin (in general) and personal sin?
• conviction of sin?
• atonement by Jesus Christ and His death/resurrection?
• living under the Lordship of Christ?

It's not rocket science, you know, - despite all the complications we mix in with our "educated" religious selves.

I've worked with pre-schoolers and kindergarteners at church for 35 years. Are most of them ready for a profession of faith in Jesus Christ? No. But some 5-6-7 year olds I work with are and have been.

I have a particular boy now, in children's choir, named Jamie. He's 6. He has a severe speech impediment that's been improving, he loves Ironman, loves his little baseball team (he won the game ball last week), and he has a phenomenal understanding of spiritual things.

I talk to my little children's choir about spiritual matters. I asked them one day not to long ago why it was important to be good and behave and mind their teachers and parents.

Jamie said this, "Well, if you be bad and then say you love God, then people won't believe you. And if you be bad, then people can't see God inside you. We have to be good so God will show to other people who don't know Him."

Not bad. And there isn't a bible story that I can tell them that he doesn't already know and can draw applications to real life from it before I can finish telling it.

God is working in this little boy's life in a HUGE way. I see it.

 

[salzer mtn]

I've lived enough to have seen many a times when someone - be they 5 or 50 - who "came forward" and engaged in a religious ritual/tradition without any real understanding.

It isn't an age. It a level of understanding and a sense of urgency brought about by the Holy Spirit.



Does one understand:

• sin (in general) and personal sin?
• conviction of sin?
• atonement by Jesus Christ and His death/resurrection?
• living under the Lordship of Christ?

It's not rocket science, you know, - despite all the complications we mix in with our "educated" religious selves.



Jamie said this, "Well, if you be bad and then say you love God, then people won't believe you. And if you be bad, then people can't see God inside you. We have to be good so God will show to other people who don't know Him."[/FONT

God is working in this little boy's life in a HUGE way. I see it.

This proves my point. By the many times Jamie is referring to being good, could it be he thinks that being good is what makes him a Christian. Could it be Jamie is replacing Christ with being good.

 

[HisWitness]

Do they encourage? Do they discourage? Are they counciled? By whom? Is there a waiting period for baptism? In my church there are what seems an unusual number of people giving testimonies that they didn't feel that they had a genuine soul saving experience as a child and later were actually born again. These persons are rebaptised.I personally feel childhood decisions should not be solicited or encouraged, but never discouraged.

how can a young child(say 5,6 years old)even understand about the knowledge of good and evil--they are still learning to read and write?
Understanding about the proper things is a MUST before one is saved by God.
Im not saying that the Holy Spirit cant work in them,but im saying that they need proper understanding and need to HEAR--and them just starting to learn to read and write--I ask HOW can they understand properly--think about these things :godisgood::godisgood:

 

[HisWitness]

Let me ask...did the thief on the cross have such a complete and clear understanding of what he was doing, or did he simply understand his condition and cry out for help?

the thief had understanding on some things--he addressed Jesus as when Jesus came in his kingdom--Thief knew Jesus not only had a kingdom but was coming to set it up--well in order for that to happen the thief also believed in the Resurrection --how could he set up his kingdom and be dead ?

The thief understood many things if you dive into what was being said--so he knew more than people give him credit for:godisgood::godisgood:

 

[HisWitness]

Believe that we tie it into the ole 'Age of accountibility", which in bible times seemed to be around that age!

there is NO age of accountability according to scriptures--there is the knowledge of accountability however.

 

[webdog]

Believe that we tie it into the ole 'Age of accountibility", which in bible times seemed to be around that age!

If they realize their need of a sinner, they are already accountable.

 

[HisWitness]

If they realize their need of a sinner, they are already accountable.

realizing that they are a sinner is not just head knowledge(or mental knowledge)that is not the requirement for salvation--but it takes that head knowledge getting to the heart and becoming a reality--also need of Jesus is in the same likeness--and to have that they must have proper understanding for God to put that in their hearts through conviction of the Holy Spirit.

Its not a bubblegum chewing event of saying this prayer or doing the things people think you need to do.Its a DEEP CAUSED GRIEF by the Holy Spirit inside of a sinner's heart drawing them to Jesus and revealing to them who they are--who he is-

Now a question for you--if a 4,5,6 year old doesn't even know the concept of what Sin is--Sure they know some things to do that are right and things not to do that are wrong--but that's not the knowledge of good and evil.
Maybe they feel bad about doing something wrong(for various reasons--maybe not wanting to get grounded or spanked?)maybe they are just going down to the alter to satisfy their parents and make them happy?
Then they might get that Candy they otherwise would not get ?
But to be convicted by the Holy Spirit is a different thing indeed:godisgood:

 

[salzer mtn]

For one to realize they are a sinner is to realize you have offended God in words thoughts and deeds. It is to realize they have sinned against God and Him alone. David said, i have sinned against thee and thee only. For one to realize they are a sinner is to be convicted of sin's pollution, of sin's defilement to the very fiber of ones self. It is to loath ones self in their own eyes. There are many stony ground conversions because the ground (heart) was never worked up (plowed) by the Holy Ghost.

 

[Scarlett O.]

This proves my point. By the many times Jamie is referring to being good, could it be he thinks that being good is what makes him a Christian. Could it be Jamie is replacing Christ with being good.

I didn't say Jamie was saved. He doesn't think nor call himself a Christian. He hasn't expressed that desire. I said he understood spiritual matters that others his age don't.

He understood completely that our actions (those of us who "say we love God", as he says) had better match our confession, or we people will know we are lying hypocrites.

There are those here who are saying that children don't understand and can't understand.

They are wrong.

 

[webdog]

realizing that they are a sinner is not just head knowledge(or mental knowledge)that is not the requirement for salvation--but it takes that head knowledge getting to the heart and becoming a reality--also need of Jesus is in the same likeness--and to have that they must have proper understanding for God to put that in their hearts through conviction of the Holy Spirit.

Its not a bubblegum chewing event of saying this prayer or doing the things people think you need to do.Its a DEEP CAUSED GRIEF by the Holy Spirit inside of a sinner's heart drawing them to Jesus and revealing to them who they are--who he is-

Now a question for you--if a 4,5,6 year old doesn't even know the concept of what Sin is--Sure they know some things to do that are right and things not to do othat are wrong--but that's not the knowledge of good and evil.
Maybe they feel bad about doing something wrong(for various reasons--maybe not wanting to get grounded or spanked?)maybe they are just going down to the alter to satisfy their parents and make them happy?
Then they might get that Candy they otherwise would not get ?
But to be convicted by the Holy Spirit is a different thing indeed:godisgood:

Once one understands what sin is and the penalty for it, they are accountable. Of course just knowing we have sinned is not enough for salvation. My daughter clearly understood that when Jesus was being beaten and nailed it was serious business, and that our sin was being placed on him. The fear of punishment should never be discounted in dealing with children. They undertand action / consequence. We should be working with that, not brushing it under the rug.

 

[annsni]

This proves my point. By the many times Jamie is referring to being good, could it be he thinks that being good is what makes him a Christian. Could it be Jamie is replacing Christ with being good.

I don't see that at all. I see him understanding why we should be good after we are saved - not that it saves us but because we are a testimony to the world and it hurts God when we are not doing what we should.