How many more body bags?

[mima]

One way to study about how much the Moslems like America is to read the Koran. I read it; have you?

 

[LadyEagle]

Yes, much of it. And I have also studied the history of islam.

 

[The Galatian]

I remember a certain president prancing around a US carrier in a borrowed flight suit, under a big "Mission Accomplished" banner he ordered put up for him.

Over a thousand Americans have died since then. The bad stuff was just beginning.

All the stuff we got from the neocons was that it would be quickly over, and all the Iraquis would love us and form a peaceful, democratic nation.

Now the story's different.

Imagine that.

 

[NiteShift]

By way of comparison, US casualties in previous wars:

WWI - 204,000 wounded, 53,000 killed in action

WWII - 670,000 wounded, 291,000 killed in action

Viet Nam - 153,000 wounded, 58,000 killed in action.

Korea - 109,000 wounded, 27,000 killed in action.

And I don't recall anyone saying the fighting in Iraq would be quick or easy.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by Craigbythesea:
How many more body bags will our defense department have to buy before America decides that the war in Iraq is too expensive?

Here's one thing you and I are in agreement on Craig. Has long as wicked men rule the world(America included) there will be no end to the slaughter. The devices of these reprobates that are used to steal and pillage each other while they oppress the poor and needy have no end. But one day our LORD will come in flaming fire taking vengence..........

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by NiteShift:
And I don't recall anyone saying the fighting in Iraq would be quick or easy.

"Oh, no, we're not going to have any casualties." —President Bush, discussing the Iraq war with Christian broadcaster Pat Robertson, after Robertson told him he should prepare the American people for casualties.

"My belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators." –Vice President Dick Cheney, "Meet the Press," March 16, 2003.

"It's hard to conceive that it would take more forces to provide stability in post-Saddam Iraq than it would take to conduct the war itself and to secure the surrender of Saddam’s security forces and his army. Hard to imagine." –Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, testifying before the House Budget Committee prior to the Iraq war, Feb. 27, 2003.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
I note the US Military death toll for 2½-years
in Iraq is equal to the death toll in the
American abortion mills for TEN HOURS.

Now that nearly 3 years have passed, we
compare the number of US Military death
to 12 HOURS of abortion carnage.

But even yet, Failure in Iraq can be
snatched from the very jaws of Victory.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
I note the US Military death toll for 2½-years
in Iraq is equal to the death toll in the
American abortion mills for TEN HOURS.

Now that nearly 3 years have passed, we
compare the number of US Military death
to 12 HOURS of abortion carnage.

But even yet, Failure in Iraq can be
snatched from the very jaws of Victory. </font>[/QUOTE]Somehow I get no comfort from the comparison here brother. A tragic waste of life is still a tragedy. Both are state sanctioned killing.

 

[Ed Edwards]

I wasn't trying to give comfort to anybody.
We are comparing ounces to tones. The tons
are worse and we aught to do something about
them. Don't confuse the mice and the
elephants.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by Ed Edwards:
I wasn't trying to give comfort to anybody.
We are comparing ounces to tones. The tons
are worse and we aught to do something about
them. Don't confuse the mice and the
elephants.

So what should we do to stop the killing brother? Elect more republicans?

 

[Scott J]

Dying for the purpose of defeating an enemy sworn to destroy our way of life, religion, and philosophy of government is hardly comparable to the killing of innocent babies for nothing but convenience.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by Scott J:
Dying for the purpose of defeating an enemy sworn to destroy our way of life, religion, and philosophy of government is hardly comparable to the killing of innocent babies for nothing but convenience.

You can spare your propaganda with me Scott. It may work well with the party faithful.

 

[Scott J]

No propaganda necessary.

Who are our guys fighting in Iraq? Iraqis? Only those who were recruited by outsiders. We are fighting al Qaeda... you know, the guys responsible for both WTC bombings, the USS Cole, and other attacks on the US.

If folks like you had been listened to we'd all be under Nazi rule now. There were people then that didn't think the threat to America's security justified fighting another bloody war in Europe.

 

[ASLANSPAL]

Originally posted by ASLANSPAL:
This mis management of Iraq before and after will
be the subject of hundreds of books but some important questions are being raised because voices and questions are being raised across a
broad spectrum but one you are starting to hear
from parents is.

1.Either do it right or get out(which is very
legitimate).

2.Should American soldiers be dying for an Islamic
state or a fig leaf paper stating civil rights but
the reality on the ground is sharia is thriving.

3.Quit! the deception and speak the truth..especially about costs,training,lives and armor.

4.Should American soldiers referee a civil war and
with a big bulls eye on their backs?

5.Why do we allow Shias with American blood on their hands go free and in fact join the political
process?

7.Why is the Syrian and Iranian border porous?
not to mention Jordon,Kuwait, and Saudi Arabia.

8.Who will rescue the Christian minority in Iraq
from oppression and persecution?

9. Why did people get run off who spoke truth
to power about Iraq but then reward people of
failure with Congressional Medal of Freedoms?

10. 25,000 Mercenaries in Iraq raking in money
and soldiers doing the hard tasks?

11. 7% of our soldiers over there not Americans
but other nationals.

12. Where are the right wing sons and daughter who
speak of "stay the course" why are they not joining up.

13. Why is the coalition of the willing bailing out?

Iraq cost could reach in total a trillion dollars
unless the American people weigh in and demand
quality for their investment in blood and treasure.


9 of 10 Americans believe their should be protests
for and against the war and questions should be
addressed instead of cheap soundbites that just get people killed.

and Bush did hype quick resoluiton and gave
the big impression it would be easy..but now
look at the spin and they are backing away from
that..more deception and spin from and administration that has abysmally mis managed this
and now are breaking out more and more bandaids or
100 holes in the dyke and they only have 10 fingers.

Mark my words if bush/rove/cheney/rumsfeld ask for
another 80 billion these questions will be asked
perhaps not by special interests or congress but
by those 9 in 10 of the American population wanting answers ..that is their right.

So its not funny at all their are legitimate
questions...Americans are very trusting and forgiving but they do not like bad performance
from a President and his policies.The only
saving grace is that the soldier is preforming
above and beyond as they carry out orders it is
not their fault the policy is bad.


We mention body bags and compare other wars but
no one mentions the wounded and maimed this insurgency is about building a car bomb in an
hours time packed with 1000lbs of explosives and
blowing people to smithereens ..technology has
prevented deaths but instead we have a lot of
missing limbs..so it is not so much body bags
it is the living wounded and maimed as well.

but back to my salient point I think the
American people are saying this and from the
middle.


1.Either do it right or get out(which is very
legitimate).

If we decide to do it right and put more troops
in ..the American people may support that
if it means a secure Iraq,Non-Islamic state,freedoms for Christians,womens rights,etc..etc.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by Scott J:
No propaganda necessary.

Who are our guys fighting in Iraq? Iraqis? Only those who were recruited by outsiders. We are fighting al Qaeda... you know, the guys responsible for both WTC bombings, the USS Cole, and other attacks on the US.

If folks like you had been listened to we'd all be under Nazi rule now. There were people then that didn't think the threat to America's security justified fighting another bloody war in Europe.

Mine eyes have seen the glory
Of the coming of the Lord;
He is trampling out the vintage
Where the grapes of wrath are stored;
He hath loosed the fateful lightning
Of His terrible swift sword;
His truth is marching on.

Glory, glory, hallelujah
Glory, glory, hallelujah
His truth is marching on.

I have seen Him in the watch fires
Of a hundred circling camps;
We are building Him an altar
In the evening dews and damps;
I can see His righteous sentence
By our dim but flaring lamps;
His day is marching on.

Glory, glory, hallelujah
Glory, glory, hallelujah
His truth is marching on.

He has sounded forth the trumpet
That shall never sound retreat;
He is sifting out the hearts of men
Before His judgement seat.
O be swift, my soul, to answer Him
Be jubilant, my feet
Our God is marching on

Glory, glory, hallelujah
Glory, glory, hallelujah
His truth is marching on.

In the beauty of the lilies
Christ was born across the sea,
With a glory in His bosom
That transfigures you and me:
As He died to make men holy,
Let us die to make men free;
While God is marching on.

Glory, glory, hallelujah
Glory, glory, hallelujah
His truth is marching on.

 

[LadyEagle]

We are not dying to make men free. We are dying for an islamic state created by the Bush administration in Iraq with American blood and treasury, a policy which cannot possibly be successful - an islamic state cannot be a true democracy because the islamic religion (sharia law) is diametrically opposed to democracy. And we are caught in the middle of a civil war there between factions of the islamic state the Bush administration helped to create in a land that has been dominated by demons for thousands of years.

 

[poncho]

Let us die to make men free;

This cuts to the heart of war propagnda. No one is dying to set men free today. They are dying so a priviledged few can confiscate wealth and property and further centralize they're worldly power over other men.

It isn't about flags and glory or even freedom it's about sinister men craving total control and using their control of the media to engineer our consent to carry out their plans.

Men are dying so other men can enslave us all in a scientific high tech militarized fuedal system of land owning lords and peasants who will work their fields.

George Washington and Thomas Jefferson saw through their deceptions 200 years ago and did indeed set men free. Now we're being taken over by the same people's decendants and we're helping them to do it.

 

[Brother James]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
We are not dying to make men free. We are dying for an islamic state created by the Bush administration in Iraq with American blood and treasury, a policy which cannot possibly be successful - an islamic state cannot be a true democracy because the islamic religion (sharia law) is diametrically opposed to democracy. And we are caught in the middle of a civil war there between factions of the islamic state the Bush administration helped to create in a land that has been dominated by demons for thousands of years.

That's good preachin' sister.

 

[saturneptune]

It is time for a radical change.
http://www.constitutionparty.com/

 

[Scott J]

According to the guys who actually doing the dying... they are doing it to defeat threats to the US the most prominent of which at the moment is al Qaeda in Iraq.

The Kurds have a secular tradition. Between them, the Sunnis, and the Christians, the Shiites would face constant civil war if they tried to institute nationwide a sharia. Even the Shiites in Iraq are more secular than most.

I am sure there were probably those who thought democracy couldn't succeed in Japan after WW2. If anything, democracy was more contrary to their system than it is to Islamic theocracy.

We have no idea whether it can succeed or not. Right now, we are not failing. Absent foreign terrorists, Iraq would be relatively peaceful and progressing toward independence.

Ironically, al Qaeda's continued activities in Iraq are keeping our troops there. If they'd stop, we would have no reason to have combat forces stay.