How many of you adhere to free grace theology?

[37818]

I never claimed that salvation was a 'merited gift.' I agree with you that salvation is unmerited. However, that does not mean it just washes over us and we take no action. Jesus calls us into discipleship. Salvation is a side-effect of discipleship, not the focus of it.

Your whole post is to put down "easy believism." You seem to want to make works, such as discipleship as a part of what is required in order to have salvation.

You choose to complicate the simplicity in Christ. Multiple issues. I'll gladly deal with one issue at a time. But multiple issues at once no.

My position is simple. In my own words. God does the saving on His terms And He does the keeping.

Romans 1:16, ". . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . ."

1 Corinthians 15:1-4, ". . . the gospel . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . "

1 John 5:1, ". . . Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . ."

 

[Baptist Believer]

Your whole post is to put down "easy believism."

I have been comparing what was claimed about “Free Grace” from the article posted to the scriptures.

Isn’t that what we are supposed to do?

Why don’t you respond with scripture that supports the “Free Grace” position instead of mischaracterizing my motives?

You seem to want make works, such as discipleship as a part of what is required in order to have salvation.

You misunderstand my position. You are confusing effort with “works” (aka, earning) salvation.

You choose to complicate the simplicity in Christ.

Jesus said, “Follow Me.” That’s very simple. To accuse me to making it complicated is astounding.

Multiple issues. I'll gladly deal with one issue at a time. But multiple issues at once no.

I have only responded to the issues you have raised.

My position is simple. In my own words. God does the saving on His terms…

I agree.

And He does the keeping.

I agree. Any perception that I don’t agree is coming from your presuppositions.

Romans 1:16, ". . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . ."


1 Corinthians 15:1-4, ". . . the gospel . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . "


1 John 5:1, ". . . Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . ."

I agree with all of these passages, in their proper context. And all of these passages were written to people who were already disciples, explaining what had already happened in their lives.

 

[37818]

I have been comparing what was claimed about “Free Grace” from the article posted to the scriptures.

Isn’t that what we are supposed to do?

One can do that.

Why don’t you respond with scripture that supports the “Free Grace” position instead of mischaracterizing my motives?

I do not think so. You argued.

Jesus calls us into discipleship. Salvation is a side-effect of discipleship, not the focus of it.

And you claimed.

You misunderstand my position. You are confusing effort with “works” (aka, earning) salvation.

I consider discipleship a work.

I have only responded to the issues you have raised.

In disagreement. Which is fine by me. I stated my objection.

 

[Deacon]

I think I was a Free Grace advocate before it was even defined, but as I grow older my experiences have strengthened my belief.

1. Through my church I have developed many relationships with those afflicted with an addiction, drugs, alcohol, smoking, etc. I’ve served with, taught, and discipled quite a few. Sadly I’ve seen quite a few dedicated workers ‘fall off the wagon’. Sometimes addictions can be tamed, sometimes they rear their ugly head up and take over.
2. As a health worker I’ve seen some elderly believers as they are failing.
Brain function alters and something about them changes. Things (words, actions, proprietary) that they once avoided enter their lives. It gets ugly sometimes.
3. My own life, even as a believer for more than half a century, my testimony still has its and downs.
I don’t believe that if my life depended upon my own efforts of discipleship I’d qualify. All my life depends upon the grace that God showered upon me when he chose me as his own.

Rob

 

[JesusFan]

One can turn away from Jesus for a time, but not for a lifetime.

I think it should be noted that a lot of people turning away from the church today are doing it because they have an issue with the church communities they have experienced, not because they have an issue with Jesus. I know many people like this.

Most of them will eventually find their way back to a fellowship of believers, whether it be a formal church or simply a gathering of Christ's body in a much more informal way.

The way one can know whether or not someone is a disciple of Christ is by the fruit of their lives. If they do not exhibit the fruit of the Spirit, one cannot have confidence that they belong to Christ Jesus, even if they claim to be pastors or religious leaders:

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. Now those who belong to Christ Jesus crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. (Ephesians 5:22-24)​

Agree with you that many seem to turn away for a season and a time due to getting upset at God, angry how things happened, were treated badly by others, but even then they shall in time return back to the fold as are part of his flock!
I just do not see where scriptures states can lose faith and just deny Jesus and never repent and turn back and have assurance of salvation!

 

[JesusFan]

Your whole post is to put down "easy believism." You seem to want to make works, such as discipleship as a part of what is required in order to have salvation.

You choose to complicate the simplicity in Christ. Multiple issues. I'll gladly deal with one issue at a time. But multiple issues at once no.

My position is simple. In my own words. God does the saving on His terms And He does the keeping.

Romans 1:16, ". . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . ."

1 Corinthians 15:1-4, ". . . the gospel . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . "

1 John 5:1, ". . . Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . ."

I think issues with so called "free graced" theology is when it reduces down to one can make a one time profession of faith, and hold to that alone as assurance really got saved, even though was no evidence nor fruit to support that really happened!

 

[37818]

I think issues with so called "free graced" theology is when it reduces down to one can make a one time profession of faith, and hold to that alone as assurance really got saved, even though was no evidence nor fruit to support that really happened!

Either one believes in salvation as an actual gift or one does not. Either one actually was given it or one is toast.

 

[JesusFan]

Either one believes in salvation as an actual gift or one does not. Either one actually was given it or one is toast.

True salvation will mean to some degree evidence and fruit of actually changed person and life, correct?

 

[37818]

True salvation will mean to some degree evidence and fruit of actually changed person and life, correct?

2 Corinthians 5:17 from the gift.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Either one believes in salvation as an actual gift or one does not. Either one actually was given it or one is toast.

I don't think there is anyone involved in this discussion who doesn't believe it is a gift.

I also don't think that anyone involved in this discussion denies the perseverance of the saints.

I consider discipleship a work.

That is a common error. Beginning discipleship to Jesus does not ensure salvation, but it can the human will into a position where one can receive the grace of God and believe with a saving faith (not merely intellectual assent). As I pointed out in a previous point (with which you have not engaged), Abram/Abraham entered into discipleship (obedience/learning) with God well prior to the time he came to faith. Discipleship (and intellectual assent) began in Genesis 12:1, but saving faith came in Genesis 15:6. Paul uses the story of Abraham as an exemplar for the salvation of all who come to faith in Christ, both in Romans 4 and in Galatians 3.

Of course, this undermines the "Free Grace" position that asserts "intellectual assent" is all that matters for salvation. That view completely ignores the teaching of the Parable of the Sower, a teaching that is so fundamental, that ALL of the Synoptic Gospels give significant attention to it (see Matthew 13; Mark 4; and Luke 8). Of course, the Parable of the Sower demonstrates my position, that simply giving intellectual assent and having a bit of excitement over an encounter with God does not bring saving faith on its own. There is a type of active faith that can happen when a human heart is ready to receive it. That often happens within the context of overt or covert discipleship.

 

[37818]

That is a common error.

Too bad. Discipleship is a work.