How not to raise or disciplin your child

[seekingthetruth]

What is it about a father that gets so angry that he needs to publicly act out with a hand gun? That guy needs counseling..... I think he will get it when the resident states Children & Family Council Department gets wind of this. He will be toast.

Maybe so, but I bet noone tries to break into his house, or that any boys will disrespect his daughter.

You think the Dad was too hard. I think society has gotten too soft.

There is nothing wrong with a public display of a handgun by a law abiding citizen...it keeps the crooks in check.

John

 

[seekingthetruth]

I can't rightly say that this Dad failed at discipline somewhere along the line, because we don't know that and to say it is assuming. I can see a lot of care in this guy for his girl, and a lot of frustration at the same time. I won't use this time to shine a light upon my rearing of children in contrast and comparison, and use this as a time to tell about how great things are with them. It's not necessary, I don't need validation, nor would doing so prove this Dad didn't raise her right.

However, I know of a few families that have raised their children right, with discipline, respect, courtesy and more, and they have grown up with a sense of appreciation, gratitude and responsibility. Yet within these same families there was a child who rebelled and reacted in this same manner as this girl, while the others were honoring to their parents, obedient &c. All of them were raised the same, some turned out responsible, another rebelled and disrespected their parents. It doesn't mean that the parents didn't raise them right.

Did Dad lose his cool? Yep. We all have, probably not to that extent though. God probably has it all on video as well. :love2:

He was foolish to put the video online. I can see authorities acting upon this, even to the extent he has to pay restitution to his daughter for the laptop, which he bought for her and gave to her as a gift.

I don't agree with his methods, but I do agree in taking her laptop away, just not via a handgun. Way over the top.

Listening to the video it sounds as if his daughter has rebelled time and again, and that they've had several incidents with her behavior. She has what other kids suffer from these days, the sense of entitlement.

I agree with p4t here. I know of pastor's kids that were raised in the best of homes, but pick up this behavior from public schools.

John

 

[seekingthetruth]

I don't think so. What we are seeing is what she has been raised under. Her actions are a result of his life actions.

Why is this guy so bad for shooting a computer?

Me and my son once shot up and old 61 Ford pick up that was rusting in our field. Should I have my son taken away?

I think your problem is with hand guns in general....do you think that everyone that owns one is wrong?

John

 

[Gina B]

One problem solved. I'm totally fine with it, and if I wasn't, it doesn't appear to be anyone's problem but mine.

If anyone reads his FB page, he and the daughter are on great terms and back to a decent relationship. The video hits brought many people to his page, which helps raise funds for muscular dystrophy, and the funds so far are skyrocketing. The daughter got a job offer from it. The only people with any issues are some disgruntled people who think anyone with a firearm is a rednecked criminal to start with and of course, DHS is all over it because anyone who actually does anything creative with their kid MUST be a child abuser. *sigh* Had to laugh at a prior social worker posting on his page...she's watched the video and analyzed it to shreds and posted lengthy dissertations on exactly where his failings are as a parent, why his daughter did what she did (of course it's all his fault according to her, if he got hep from DHS, they could help him get over his issues and become a better person and parent).

Modern day abuse. Getting the nice laptop your parents bought and maintained for you shot with a pistol because you cursed your parents to the whole world. GIMME A BREAK!

 

[Berean]

Discipline starts day one. One of many examples; If the child is not wet,hungry or sick when you lay it down let it cry. This will eliminate problems later in adhering to bed times.All children are born minupulating their parents. IMHO the two biggest problems in rearing children is know how to mix love and discipline. Some need 80/20 L/D others need 20/80 L/D While others 50/50. This is the second greatest problem the first being knowing when and how far to let them out of the nest at a time Remember no two children are alike.

 

[Gina B]

Babies don't cry to manipulate, they cry because they have a need. Human companionship is a need just as much as hunger.
I'd be ten times more likely to call it child abuse when a parent lets a baby "cry it out" rather than soothing their helpless infant than I would over a parent destroying a laptop used to be obnoxious.
Still don't get why parents stick their kid in a crib in a separate room, seems weird and unnatural. All my kids slept with me and were held in a sling when not in bed and ALL of them transitioned to their own beds and rooms with no problem.
I'm guessing it was because they didn't have to be afraid of not having their basic needs met.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Maybe so, but I bet noone tries to break into his house, or that any boys will disrespect his daughter.

You think the Dad was too hard. I think society has gotten too soft.

There is nothing wrong with a public display of a handgun by a law abiding citizen...it keeps the crooks in check.

John

Yes well he wont have to worry about any disrespect by boys....very soon, that gal will be long gone....she will put so much distance between them that she will have her own way.....now he has drawn the line in the sand & there is no going back. & why, because a 15 YO (unmature girl wrote a letter). There were better ways to have handled that situation.

 

[Oldtimer]

As a former pastor once said: "Some parents of GOLD have children of LEAD and some parents of LEAD have children of GOLD."

I would be very reluctant to judge a parent(s) on nothing more than the way a child turns out!

Agree 100%

There were five of us reared by the same set of parents. Parents who instilled in us their beliefs and values.

Each of us turned out differently. For example: One brother has been married/divorced several times. Currently living with a woman who isn't his wife. Lord willing, spouse and I will celebrate our 46th anniversary later this year. Far different life experience for each of us, even though we have the same mother and father.

IMHO, no one can use any one of the FIVE of us to judge our parents.

 

[Gina B]

And speaking as the "white sheep reject child" in my family and having been raised pretty crazy, you can't judge a kid by the rest of their family either.

Anyone can rise above as well as sink below the ways they were raised, at any age. Humans are humans.

 

[mandym]

Babies don't cry to manipulate, they cry because they have a need.

They cry because of both. Its the parents job to determine which is going on.

Human companionship is a need just as much as hunger.

This blanket statement fails to address all the issues regarding crying babies.

I

'd be ten times more likely to call it child abuse when a parent lets a baby "cry it out"

Babies cannot always be held when they want. this teaches them they can get whatever they want when they want it, in other words spoils them. Learning to be content needs to be taught right from the gitgo.

Still don't get why parents stick their kid in a crib in a separate room, seems weird and unnatural.

To you it does. Babies do not need to learn to expect they get hauled around on hip at every moment.

All my kids slept with me and were held in a sling when not in bed and ALL of them transitioned to their own beds and rooms with no problem.

That was your choice. None of my kids slept with us. They learned early on to be content in their own bed. It seems weird and unnatural to have children in the bed with me and my wife. Not going to happen.

I'm guessing it was because they didn't have to be afraid of not having their basic needs met.

Which has what to do with anything?

 

[Gina B]

It has everything to do with it. Human companionship is a basic need, especially in babies. That child was carried in mamma's belly starting from the time they were an egg, then they were conceived, grew, and suddenly they are born and the parents stick them in a crib in their own room and let them "cry it out" to teach them a lesson? What is that lesson? What do they learn from that, except that they can't trust an adult to be there for them?

There's nothing wrong with keeping your baby attached to you. In fact, it's very right. I know from experience and watching other parents that babies who are not left to "cry it out" are much better attached to their parents, don't have nearly as much fear of abandonment when they have a babysitter for some need, because they have learned that they will be cared for and they learned to trust.

It is VERY natural to have baby in bed with mom and dad. We're one of the only countries who decided that it's best to separate them from birth. For what? Especially a nursing infant. It's much easier to reach over to the baby in the bed connected to yours and just pull him/her over to nurse. Unless, of course, one also holds to the idea that we shouldn't let babies eat when they're hungry, they have to auto-adjust to OUR schedules, when if you do it correctly, they'll naturally gravitate to a more natural rhythm of being up more during the day and night.

Babies are not born manipulating their parents through tears. That's a learned behavior. It's not manipulative to cry because you need to be held and cuddled or to cry when your belly is empty or when you just feel uncomfortable and can't express it. Crying is the expression of some type of need. Not some type of manipulation. I've seen more crazy "Christian" parents adopt this concept than anyone else in my life! I remember one poor kid's dad who called into Focus on the Family or whatever that show is because the kid wouldn't clean his plate, and the insane talk host told him that the kid throwing up was manipulation. This was kid who was going on two. You know how small their bellies are?! But no, the "Christian" thing to do is teach that kid a lesson...let them cry it out when they communicate in the only way they know how, and instead of taking into account that a toddler's belly only holds a couple tablespoons of food, discipline that kid so he/she cleans his plate and then punish him if he throws up because he's over full to show the kid who is boss.

Real smart. I detest the way so many people in the church treat babies. Schedule every moment of their lives from the day they are born to make it "easier" on the parents. That's not how God intended it and that's apparent in nature and apparent in how the baby responds to adults in their lives. It's sickening.

Call it my choice, but what it really is would better be called common sense. I CHOSE common sense and the result of treating babies like babies and responding to their needs paid off in a major way for the kids, which is our job, our duty as parents.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I agree with p4t here. I know of pastor's kids that were raised in the best of homes, but pick up this behavior from public schools.

John

...and I've taught some wonderful children from wonderful homes in public school who picked up their bad habits from the pastor's kids at church. :saint:

 

[Scarlett O.]

It has everything to do with it. Human companionship is a basic need, especially in babies. That child was carried in mamma's belly starting from the time they were an egg, then they were conceived, grew, and suddenly they are born and the parents stick them in a crib in their own room and let them "cry it out" to teach them a lesson? What is that lesson? What do they learn from that, except that they can't trust an adult to be there for them?

There's nothing wrong with keeping your baby attached to you. In fact, it's very right. I know from experience and watching other parents that babies who are not left to "cry it out" are much better attached to their parents, don't have nearly as much fear of abandonment when they have a babysitter for some need, because they have learned that they will be cared for and they learned to trust.

It is VERY natural to have baby in bed with mom and dad. We're one of the only countries who decided that it's best to separate them from birth. For what? Especially a nursing infant. It's much easier to reach over to the baby in the bed connected to yours and just pull him/her over to nurse. Unless, of course, one also holds to the idea that we shouldn't let babies eat when they're hungry, they have to auto-adjust to OUR schedules, when if you do it correctly, they'll naturally gravitate to a more natural rhythm of being up more during the day and night.

Babies are not born manipulating their parents through tears. That's a learned behavior. It's not manipulative to cry because you need to be held and cuddled or to cry when your belly is empty or when you just feel uncomfortable and can't express it. Crying is the expression of some type of need. Not some type of manipulation. I've seen more crazy "Christian" parents adopt this concept than anyone else in my life! I remember one poor kid's dad who called into Focus on the Family or whatever that show is because the kid wouldn't clean his plate, and the insane talk host told him that the kid throwing up was manipulation. This was kid who was going on two. You know how small their bellies are?! But no, the "Christian" thing to do is teach that kid a lesson...let them cry it out when they communicate in the only way they know how, and instead of taking into account that a toddler's belly only holds a couple tablespoons of food, discipline that kid so he/she cleans his plate and then punish him if he throws up because he's over full to show the kid who is boss.

Real smart. I detest the way so many people in the church treat babies. Schedule every moment of their lives from the day they are born to make it "easier" on the parents. That's not how God intended it and that's apparent in nature and apparent in how the baby responds to adults in their lives. It's sickening.

Call it my choice, but what it really is would better be called common sense. I CHOSE common sense and the result of treating babies like babies and responding to their needs paid off in a major way for the kids, which is our job, our duty as parents.

I try not to quote a longer passage, but this one bears repeating and re-reading.

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

There are some truly HORRIBLE Christian authors (and I'm not so sure about the Christian part) who teach that babies are manipulative from birth and should be spanked and spanked hard and with objects akin to a pvc pipe from infancy to stop them from crying.

One author, Ron Williams, and I read this with my own eyes said that when one is holding a 6th month and under and he cries and pushes against you that this is rebelliousness and should be beaten from him gently until he stops crying.

Babies and young children cry because they have a need. Especially when they cannot SPEAK - and if an adult believes them to be dry, with a full belly, or not sick - then they should STILL investigate as to why the baby is crying.

Skin to skin contact with an infant and guardian is critical. And if skin to skin contact isn't warranted, then chest to chest, will suffice. There's to much genuine science that proves that children who do not have their basic needs - and love and affection is a basic need - met by a guardian that a distrust follows and can be damaging. Sometimes babies cry and don't know why they are crying.

Certainly, if a child learns that you will give it what ever it wants, including the unnecessary extra cookie, toy, or other unnecessary thing, just to appease it, then the guardian needs to curtail that.

But if a baby is crying because it has a genuine need - and no, not all parents are experts and not all can tell 100% of the time what the need is - then I do not believe in allowing the baby to scream in agony just because a parent thinks they need to get over it.

And there is a reason why a woman's hip has a curve to it. Think about it.

 

[annsni]

Scarlett - That is just so sad.

I let my first child cry it out and it was horrible. I hated every second of it and swore I'd never do it again and I didn't. I responded to my kids' needs and helped them as they matured to understand what their needs were. Some slept with us, others slept next to us. All were responded to and all slept great within a few years. None are ax murders and so far we've gotten to 9, 11, 19 and almost 22 and they are great kids - although my oldest still needs to learn some more skills with money management. I wonder if that's because I let her cry it out.....

 

[Benjamin]

And there is a reason why a woman's hip has a curve to it. Think about it.

Ahh, ...hmm ...because their arms are weaker? :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Ahh, ...hmm ...because their arms are weaker? :smilewinkgrin:

Vive la différence :love2::thumbs:

 

[Scarlett O.]

Ahh, ...hmm ...because their arms are weaker?

:laugh: Ummm... no. Take another guess, there, brother! :laugh:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Here.....Brothers & Sisters....a Sermon (done today) LIFE OF FORBEARANCE! :thumbsup:

http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=212121316370