How To Treat A Calvanist! Should we cut off Calvanists from the Body????

[TaliOrlando]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gteQn-ti790

Titus 3:10-11 (New King James Version)
10 Reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition, 11 knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned.


As some of you know, I have a youtube ministry & so do many others for God's Glory. Anyhow, this message is from a very popular channel called Tic Toc Ministries.

In it, she says that once we have warned Calvanists of their errors in following John Calvin over the word of God; if they are unwilling to listen, we should completely cut them off from the body.

She states that we should have no fellowship with them whatsoever if they are not willing to follow God's word. If we know them, not to answer their emails, if our pastor is a calvanists and he does not listen, to leave that Church as well.

I am not a calvanist, however, I have a very difficult time agreeing with what she says.

It could be because I am young and ignorant, but arent we all washed by the precious blood of the lamb?

What are your thoughts on this, is she or is she not right; you dont have to watch the video.. but based on what I told you, do you agree or disagree and why? Examples please! I plan on making a video response to this... but want to see what you think? :thumbs:

 

[Pastor Larry]

In it, she says that once we have warned Calvanists of their errors in following John Calvin over the word of God; if they are unwilling to listen, we should completely cut them off from the body.

It's bad that she's ignorant. It's worse that she proclaims it publicly on the internet. It is inexcusable that she is lying. She should be disciplined from her church for dishonesty and creating schisms in the body.

She states that we should have no fellowship with them whatsoever if they are not willing to follow God's word.

We Calvinists are following God's word. If she doesn't know that, then she is the one with the problem.

If we know them, not to answer their emails, if our pastor is a calvanists and he does not listen, to leave that Church as well.

I think this is good advice. For there is little reason for us to contend for the faith with people who are not willing to listen to the Book.

 

[puros_bran]

I say we banish them...no, no, wait...let's burn them at the stake.

The idea that someone holding to Calvins view of theology is not Christian almost strikes me as funny..and I don't even claim to be a Calvinist.

One side is demanding we boldly walk up to God and demand what's ours....

The other side demands we bow before God in agreement.....

I know who I'd rather side with.

 

[Gup20]

What are your thoughts on this, is she or is she not right; you dont have to watch the video.. but based on what I told you, do you agree or disagree and why? Examples please! I plan on making a video response to this... but want to see what you think?

Though Calvinists are only a minute portion of the body of Christ (10% by one survey I've seen), I don't think cutting off fellowship is the way to go. Calvinism, like Arminianism, Palegism, etc is a humanistic deception. You don't withhold truth from the deceived, you speak the truth in love.

Most Calvinists I've met love God, and genuinely think they are following God's word. They just haven't thought it through completely, and followed it to it's logical conclusions.

Like many deceptions (Word of Faith, Name it and claim it, etc) it's based on a principle that brings people comfort. For Calvinism, it is the idea that God is sovereign, and his will must always be done. But the deception is that it is ultimately self-serving.... if God is sovereign, then I have no personal responsibility. I don't have to do anything, I am how God made me to be - be that a sinner, a saint, or somewhere in between. When you say "God is sovereign", it sounds like you are glorifying God, but what you are really saying is "God is to blame, not me". Ultimately it's a self-serving doctrine.

But if we cut off fellowship with everyone who was selfish, we'd have pretty empty churches.

 

[puros_bran]

Painting the everyday average Joe who agrees with Calvins Doctrine as a hyper-calvinist is as wrong as painting your everyday average Joe who leans toward Arminian Doctrine as a Word of Faither...

 

[Thinkingstuff]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gteQn-ti790

Titus 3:10-11 (New King James Version)
10 Reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition, 11 knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned.


As some of you know, I have a youtube ministry & so do many others for God's Glory. Anyhow, this message is from a very popular channel called Tic Toc Ministries.

In it, she says that once we have warned Calvanists of their errors in following John Calvin over the word of God; if they are unwilling to listen, we should completely cut them off from the body.

She states that we should have no fellowship with them whatsoever if they are not willing to follow God's word. If we know them, not to answer their emails, if our pastor is a calvanists and he does not listen, to leave that Church as well.

I am not a calvanist, however, I have a very difficult time agreeing with what she says.

It could be because I am young and ignorant, but arent we all washed by the precious blood of the lamb?

What are your thoughts on this, is she or is she not right; you dont have to watch the video.. but based on what I told you, do you agree or disagree and why? Examples please! I plan on making a video response to this... but want to see what you think? :thumbs:

I think we can handle it the way Bernard Gui did in the 1200's

Heresy cannot be destroyed unless heretics are destroyed and . . . . their defenders and [supporters] are destroyed, and this is effected in two ways: . . . they are converted to the true... faith, or . . . burned.

BTW that was a joke.

 

[annsni]

She's an idiot.

I'll follow the Biblical doctrine of grace. I don't follow one man's teachings.

 

[historyb]

I don't think cutting off fellowship is the way to go. Calvinism, like Arminianism, Palegism, etc is a humanistic deception.

Bull hockey.

She's an idiot.


Amen!
I'll follow the Biblical doctrine of grace. I don't follow one man's teachings.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

I am certain all true believers would believe in the golden rule, and we know that many Calvinists or those leaning hard towards Calvinism seemed always primed and ready to call others heretics and align them with cults etc, so I am certain they would not be offended in the least if such was the treatment of themselves by others who do not agree with them. Would that not be the way the golden rule mandates that they would desire to have others do to them? Since they do that to others it must certainly be the way they desire for others to treat them. They should like and enjoy being called heretics, liars, and being associated with cults should they not?

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

Though Calvinists are only a minute portion of the body of Christ (10% by one survey I've seen), I don't think cutting off fellowship is the way to go. Calvinism, like Arminianism, Palegism, etc is a humanistic deception. You don't withhold truth from the deceived, you speak the truth in love.

Most Calvinists I've met love God, and genuinely think they are following God's word. They just haven't thought it through completely, and followed it to it's logical conclusions.

Like many deceptions (Word of Faith, Name it and claim it, etc) it's based on a principle that brings people comfort. For Calvinism, it is the idea that God is sovereign, and his will must always be done. But the deception is that it is ultimately self-serving.... if God is sovereign, then I have no personal responsibility. I don't have to do anything, I am how God made me to be - be that a sinner, a saint, or somewhere in between. When you say "God is sovereign", it sounds like you are glorifying God, but what you are really saying is "God is to blame, not me". Ultimately it's a self-serving doctrine.

But if we cut off fellowship with everyone who was selfish, we'd have pretty empty churches.

First of all, please get your statistics correct. The study that you are referring to is "10% of SBC pastors." and the question was if they were a full 5 point Calvinist not if they leaned one way or another, etc.

By the way, somehow I think that men like RC Sproul, Francis Schaeffer, Steve Brown, D. James Kennedy, etc. have "thought it through completely."

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

She's an idiot.

Agreed.

Tali, where DO you find these people???

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

FOS: By the way, somehow I think that men like RC Sproul, Francis Schaeffer, Steve Brown, D. James Kennedy, etc. have "thought it through completely."

HP: By now some probably have, but while some were living they were blinded by presuppositions steeped in error. That by no means takes away from the good these men accomplished in their lives and the clear stand on other truths that they were ‘right on’ concerning.

Take D.James Kennedy for instance. I cannot think of another believer alive that promoted the truth of many issues such as abortion, gambling, etc. from a Christian perspective than he. When it came to the issues we face daily he was right on, but when it came to the doctrinal side and his espousal of Calvinistic principles, I for one believe he was in clear error. When he preached clearly on the issues I supported him. When he got off on the sidetrack of promoting Calvinism I wrote him, but to little or no avail as far as I could tell. We all can be grateful for the good work he did in supporting Christian causes while he was living. An amazing and brilliant man for certain in many ways.

 

[JSM17]

Calvinism is a false doctrine.
The five tenants of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.
Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

JSM17: Calvinism is a false doctrine.

HP: I agree

JSM17: The five tenants of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.

HP: I agree.

JSM17: Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

HP: I would not agree.

JSM17: To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

HP: I believe that deception plays into the mix even more so than willing rejection of Gods’ Word. Certainly some have light revealed that they will not come to. Those alone would be guilty of rejecting God’s Word. I would hope that is not named once among us on this list.

 

[Rippon]

Calvinism is a false doctrine.

Calvinism is not a singular doctrine. Many folks who would never dream of calling themselves Calvinists hold to some Calvinistic beliefs. That's because Calvinism stems from the Bible -- not a man.

The five tenants (sic)of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.

You mean tenets. And the tenets of Calvinism are right under your nose -- in the very Scripture you claim you believe.

Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

Are you trolling here? Are you just trying to throw out red meat? No Christians are Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians?! Please back up -- say you're sorry and that you just wanted to be a flame-thrower in this post of yours.

To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

Calvinists do not hold to all the ideas of Calvin -- but the Scriptures from which they originate. Calvin just systematized things according to the way he believed the Word of God presented many doctrines -- not just what is referred to as TULIP.

Besides, you show complete ignorance of Calvin's works for you to say something so asinine. You would be humbled to read his devotion to the Lord and his careful expositions of the Word of God.

 

[historyb]

Calvinism is a false doctrine.
The five tenants of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.
Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

First you present very illogical and dumb arguments. Next the Trinity is not in the Bible should we reject that and third every single tenet of TULIP can be found in Scripture.

 

[gb93433]

A promoter of any ism should be removed. The central focus must be Christ. We are to preach Christ and Him crucified not an ism. There are many things I agree with Calvinists on and some I do not. Some Calvinists are not as Calvinistic as they claim. There are more than just the five point Calvinists. Some are 3, 4, 5, and 6.

Nobody needs to know about Calvinism to live the Christian life but they do need to know what the Bible teaches. That is one reason why I would like to see Calvinism eradicated.

 

[annsni]

Calvinism is a false doctrine.
The five tenants of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.
Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

Completely 100% disagree with this. The docrine of grace is clear in Scripture.

 

[annsni]

Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

I'm reporting this post. You have just told anyone who believes in the doctrine of grace that we are not saved. That is against the rules.

 

[saturneptune]

Calvinism is a false doctrine.
The five tenants of Calvinism are nowhere to be found in scripture.
Christians are not Calvinistic and Calvinists are not Christians.

To hold to the ideas of Calvin are to reject God's word.

There is some kind of game being played with the board in the last week or so. This is the third new member I have seen in recent days come out of the gate posting things designed to irritate people. It is obvious this type of poster has no interest in debate or an exchange of ideas. Sometimes I wonder if it is not the same person reregistering several times.