How we obtain our faith?, we receive our faith by divine allotment

[Scott Downey]

STRONGS NT 2975: λαγχάνω
λαγχάνω: 2 aorist ἔλαχον;
1. to obtain by lot (from Homer down): with the genitive of the thing, Luke 1:9 (cf. Buttmann, 269 (231); Winers Grammar, 319 (299)); to receive by divine allotment, obtain: τί, Acts 1:17; 2 Peter 1:1; on the construction of this verb with the genitive and accusative of the thing, see Matthiae, § 328; Winers Grammar, 200 (188); (cf. Buttmann, § 132, 8).

2 Peter 1:1
New International Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ,

To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

2 Peter 1:1
King James Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

 

[Dave G]

Strong's Greek: 2975. λαγχάνω (lagchanó) -- to obtain by lot
G2975 - lagchanō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (KJV)
G2975 λαγχάνω - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Thanks for pointing that out, Scott.
I'd never really looked at the meaning of the word in the Greek, having understood from my studies that the word "obtained" there is in the passive sense.

I do however, find it very useful knowing that the faith that sustains me in this life is not only the gift of God ( Ephesians 2:8 ), authored and finished by Jesus Christ ( Hebrews 12:2 )...
but that it also finds its support, not in just the translation, but in the original language as its foundation.

 

[Scott Downey]

Strong's Greek: 2975. λαγχάνω (lagchanó) -- to obtain by lot
G2975 - lagchanō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (KJV)
G2975 λαγχάνω - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Thanks for pointing that out, Scott.
I'd never really looked at the meaning of the word in the Greek, having understood from my studies that the word "obtained" there is in the passive sense.

I do however, find it very useful knowing that the faith that sustains me in this life is not only the gift of God ( Ephesians 2:8 ), authored and finished by Jesus Christ ( Hebrews 12:2 )...
but that it also finds its support, not in just the translation, but in the original language as its foundation.

have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

It seriously even says as much in the verse, we get our faith from God and Christ

Here it is again this idea

Acts 3:16
And His name, through faith in His name, has made this man strong, whom you see and know.

Yes, the faith which comes through Him has given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

Some say it is just poetry, not reality.

The apostles knew who to ask for more faith.
Luke 17:5
And the apostles said to the Lord, “Increase our faith.”

 

[Brightfame52]

STRONGS NT 2975: λαγχάνω
λαγχάνω: 2 aorist ἔλαχον;
1. to obtain by lot (from Homer down): with the genitive of the thing, Luke 1:9 (cf. Buttmann, 269 (231); Winers Grammar, 319 (299)); to receive by divine allotment, obtain: τί, Acts 1:17; 2 Peter 1:1; on the construction of this verb with the genitive and accusative of the thing, see Matthiae, § 328; Winers Grammar, 200 (188); (cf. Buttmann, § 132, 8).

2 Peter 1:1
New International Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ,

To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

2 Peter 1:1
King James Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

I believe it needs to be pointed out however that this pertains to the Elect of God only. Remember who Peter was writing to 1 Pet 1:2

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

They are alloted the Faith of Gods Elect Titus 1:1

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

 

[Scott Downey]

I believe it needs to be pointed out however that this pertains to the Elect of God only. Remember who Peter was writing to 1 Pet 1:2

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

They are alloted the Faith of Gods Elect Titus 1:1

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

Certainly, as only the elect obtain salvation, only they have obtained faith from God.
Even in the natural world we see that believing unto salvation in uncommon, many never show any interest in Christ. Without faith it is impossible to please God.
No one seeks for God
But they do seek the LORD after He has been at work in them, as in making them born of God as babes.

verses with 'babes'
BibleGateway - Keyword Search: babes

In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

as newborn babes, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby,

 

[ad finitum]

STRONGS NT 2975: λαγχάνω
λαγχάνω: 2 aorist ἔλαχον;
1. to obtain by lot (from Homer down): with the genitive of the thing, Luke 1:9 (cf. Buttmann, 269 (231); Winers Grammar, 319 (299)); to receive by divine allotment, obtain: τί, Acts 1:17; 2 Peter 1:1; on the construction of this verb with the genitive and accusative of the thing, see Matthiae, § 328; Winers Grammar, 200 (188); (cf. Buttmann, § 132, 8).

2 Peter 1:1
New International Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ,

To those who through the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours:

2 Peter 1:1
King James Version

1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Since the verb lachousin is an aorist active participle, it should be translated as per the KJV, "obtained" rather than the passive "received". They obtained their faith, they didn't passively receive it by "allotment".

 

[Brightfame52]

Since the verb lachousin is an aorist active participle, it should be translated as per the KJV, "obtained" rather than the passive "received". They obtained their faith, they didn't passively receive it by "allotment".

I believe both are true, it was given actively by God, but received passively by them. The main point is the faith wasn't of themselves but the gift/allotment of God !

 

[ad finitum]

I believe both are true, it was given actively by God, but received passively by them. The main point is the faith wasn't of themselves but the gift/allotment of God !

The verse doesn't say it was "given actively by God". Citing 2 Peter 1:1 as a support for that idea is reading something into the verse that actually isn't there. I think the technical term for that is eisegesis.

 

[Scott Downey]

Since the verb lachousin is an aorist active participle, it should be translated as per the KJV, "obtained" rather than the passive "received". They obtained their faith, they didn't passively receive it by "allotment".

they obtained their faith by allotment from God.
That understanding fully agrees with Romans 12, where God gives to everyman the measure of faith. (CHURCH people only)
NLV
God has given me His loving-favor. This helps me write these things to you. I ask each one of you not to think more of himself than he should think. Instead, think in the right way toward yourself by the faith God has given you.

Whole bunch of translations of Romans 12:3 here
Romans 12:3 - Bible Gateway

2 Peter 1
New Life Version really describes it well enough

1 This letter is from Simon Peter. I am a missionary of Jesus Christ and a servant owned by Him.
I am writing to those who have received the same faith as ours which is of great worth and which no amount of money can buy.
This faith comes from our God and Jesus Christ, the One Who saves.

 

[Scott Downey]

Some verses of interest, some say very clearly your faith has come from God.
That God gave you faith to believe the truth
And that your faith is holy as it is from God.

1 Corinthians 2:5
In this way, you do not have faith in Christ because of the wisdom of men. You have faith in Christ because of the power of God.
2 Corinthians 1:21
God is the One Who makes our faith and your faith strong in Christ. He has set us apart for Himself.
Ephesians 6:23
May all the Christian brothers have peace and love with faith from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Thessalonians 2:13
Christian brothers, the Lord loves you. We always thank God for you. It is because God has chosen you from the beginning to save you from the punishment of sin. He chose to make you holy by the Holy Spirit and to give you faith to believe the truth.

James 2:5
Listen, my dear Christian brothers, God has chosen those who are poor in the things of this world to be rich in faith. The holy nation of heaven is theirs. That is what God promised to those who love Him.

1 Peter 1:21
Because of Christ, you have put your trust in God. He raised Christ from the dead and gave Him great honor. So now your faith and hope are in God.

1 Peter 4:19
So if God wants you to suffer, give yourself to Him. He will do what is right for you. He made you and He is faithful.

Jude 1:3
Dear friends, I have been trying to write to you about what God did for us when He saved us from the punishment of sin. Now I must write to you and tell you to fight hard for the faith which was once and for all given to the holy people of God.

Jude 1:20
Dear friends, you must become strong in your most holy faith. Let the Holy Spirit lead you as you pray.

 

[Scott Downey]

Then another classic one about our faithfulness being a fruit of the Holy Spirit. It so then this is God's work inside of you, it did not come from yourself, your faithfulness is the gift of God.
Galatians 5, Paul contrast those who practice the works of the flesh who will not be with Christ, with those who are Spirit filled, the Holy Spirit indwelling them, similar to Romans 8:5-17, etc...


19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

 

[ad finitum]

they obtained their faith by allotment from God.
That understanding fully agrees with Romans 12, where God gives to everyman the measure of faith. (CHURCH people only)
NLV
God has given me His loving-favor. This helps me write these things to you. I ask each one of you not to think more of himself than he should think. Instead, think in the right way toward yourself by the faith God has given you.

Whole bunch of translations of Romans 12:3 here
Romans 12:3 - Bible Gateway

2 Peter 1
New Life Version really describes it well enough

1 This letter is from Simon Peter. I am a missionary of Jesus Christ and a servant owned by Him.
I am writing to those who have received the same faith as ours which is of great worth and which no amount of money can buy.
This faith comes from our God and Jesus Christ, the One Who saves.

Someone has made their translation into a paraphrase which would seem to incorporate their preconceived theological assumptions. However, that "translation" does not reflect the original. The KJV follows the Greek in this instance while the NLV does not. This is why one doesn't cite New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures as support for some theological ideas.

It is suggested that casting about for a translation that seems to support a desired theological understanding is not the way to discovering the mind of God.

 

[ad finitum]

Some verses of interest, some say very clearly your faith has come from God.
That God gave you faith to believe the truth
And that your faith is holy as it is from God.

1 Corinthians 2:5
In this way, you do not have faith in Christ because of the wisdom of men. You have faith in Christ because of the power of God.
2 Corinthians 1:21
God is the One Who makes our faith and your faith strong in Christ. He has set us apart for Himself.
Ephesians 6:23
May all the Christian brothers have peace and love with faith from God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Thessalonians 2:13
Christian brothers, the Lord loves you. We always thank God for you. It is because God has chosen you from the beginning to save you from the punishment of sin. He chose to make you holy by the Holy Spirit and to give you faith to believe the truth.

James 2:5
Listen, my dear Christian brothers, God has chosen those who are poor in the things of this world to be rich in faith. The holy nation of heaven is theirs. That is what God promised to those who love Him.

1 Peter 1:21
Because of Christ, you have put your trust in God. He raised Christ from the dead and gave Him great honor. So now your faith and hope are in God.

1 Peter 4:19
So if God wants you to suffer, give yourself to Him. He will do what is right for you. He made you and He is faithful.

Jude 1:3
Dear friends, I have been trying to write to you about what God did for us when He saved us from the punishment of sin. Now I must write to you and tell you to fight hard for the faith which was once and for all given to the holy people of God.

Jude 1:20
Dear friends, you must become strong in your most holy faith. Let the Holy Spirit lead you as you pray.

Even as proof-texts, these don't work. None of them say anything to the effect of, "God gave you faith to believe the truth". They don't even imply it.

 

[Scott Downey]

Even as proof-texts, these don't work. None of them say anything to the effect of, "God gave you faith to believe the truth". They don't even imply it.

Of course they do, thing is if you believed what scriptures say about these things, you would have to change how you think about election and predestination and calling.
You would have to become Calvinist in your theology.

What Is Faith and Where Does It Come From?.

Where does faith come from?
The first thing we must understand is that faith doesn’t originate from within us. We’re not born with a natural ability to believe. If we try to muster up faith by our own willpower, we’ll be discouraged. This is because we’re not the source of faith. Faith comes from God. God allots, or gives, faith to us. Second Peter 1:1 says:

“To those who have been allotted faith equally precious as ours in the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ.”

God is not only the Giver of faith, but He is also the Author, the Originator, of our faith. Hebrews 12:2 says:

“Looking away unto Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith.”

 

[ad finitum]

Of course they do, thing is if you believed what scriptures say about these things, you would have to change how you think about election and predestination and calling.
You would have to become Calvinist in your theology.

So is that how the interpretation of 2 Peter 1:1 works? Are Calvinist apologists obtaining their doctrine from what the verse actually says or are they imposing their Calvinist theology onto the verse? Is this because, "they believe NOT what scriptures say"?

 

[ad finitum]

Second Peter 1:1 says:

“To those who have been allotted faith equally precious as ours in the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ.”

As has been pointed out, the quoted translation submitted here does not reflect the verb as an aorist active participle. It does no good to keep posting it, even as a dubious proof-text. That just makes it worse than dubious.

 

[Dave G]

The verse doesn't say it was "given actively by God". Citing 2 Peter 1:1 as a support for that idea is reading something into the verse that actually isn't there. I think the technical term for that is eisegesis.

Exegeting the verse, I clearly see:

" Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:" ( 2 Peter 1:1 )

...that it is Simon Peter addressing those who have obtained like precious faith with "us"...
How?
Through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.

It most definitely does not, in any way, state that we already had it, but had obtained it.
That obtaining was through the righteousness of God.

If you are unable to see that, then it appears to me that you may have some difficulty accepting what the words say, my friend.
I encourage you to read it again.

 

[Scott Downey]

Exegeting the verse, I clearly see:

" Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:" ( 2 Peter 1:1 )

...that it is Simon Peter addressing those who have obtained like precious faith with "us"...
How?
Through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.

It most definitely does not, in any way, state that we already had it, but had obtained it.
That obtaining was through the righteousness of God.

If you are unable to see that, then it appears to me that you may have some difficulty accepting what the words say, my friend.
I encourage you to read it again.

These people who deny faith is a gift, seem to associate some of these faith scriptures with the religion of Christianity as in it's external form and practice like common core beliefs of the church, versus a faith based personal relationship with God..
.

 

[ad finitum]

Exegeting the verse, I clearly see:

" Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:" ( 2 Peter 1:1 )

...that it is Simon Peter addressing those who have obtained like precious faith with "us"...
How?
Through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.

It most definitely does not, in any way, state that we already had it, but had obtained it.
That obtaining was through the righteousness of God.

If you are unable to see that, then it appears to me that you may have some difficulty accepting what the words say, my friend.
I encourage you to read it again.

If they obtained it, how then was it given? If one is given a gift for Christmas, did they obtain it? They didn't. The giver obtained it and the one to whom it is given receives it passively.

Is that what the verse says happened? No. But are people claiming that's what it says anyway? Yes. Are they right? No.

 

[Dave G]

If they obtained it, how then was it given?

By God ( Ephesians 2:8 ), through Jesus Christ ( Hebrews 12:2 ).

If one is given a gift for Christmas, did they obtain it?

Yes.

"Obtain" means to gain something.
It can be either active or passive.

Today, we English speakers tend to use the word actively.

The giver obtained it and the one to whom it is given receives it passively.

I agree.

Is that what the verse says happened?

Yes.

But are people claiming that's what it says anyway? Yes. Are they right? No.

I respect your opinion, sir, but I also happen to disagree with it.

May God bless you with much in your studies.