Humans respond to God’s revelation of Himself

[canadyjd]

There is a small group of deceived individuals out there that believe God has tied His own hands and waits on pins and needles for human beings to “make the right choice” so He can save them.

Every time they make such claims they are denying scripture (God’s very Word) and elevating man to a position beyond his station and ability. Such thinking is secular and not biblical.

Let’s look at what scripture actually teaches..

God chose Abram (scripture does not say why) and Abram RESPONDED to God’s intervention and revelation of Himself by obeying and believing the promises of God.

God chose Moses, revealing Himself, and Moses RESPONDED to God’s revelation of Himself and obeyed God and demonstrated faith.

God revealed Himself to Jacob and he RESPONDED by refusing to let go until God blessed him.

The list is very long where God reveals Himself and people RESPOND to God.

Even in the passages where people are praying to God (women wanting children, Gideon and the fleece) these folks are already RESPONDING to what God has revealed of Himself through OT prophets, oral traditions, scrolls and such and RESPONDING to what God has revealed of Himself with prayers.

Jesus called His disciples and they RESPONDED by following Him.

In John 10, we see this principle applies to all believers. Jesus says “My sheep hear My voice, I call them by name, and they follow Me”

Very easy to understand for anyone without bias. Jesus calls (He reveals Himself) the sheep hear His voice (notice He calls them BY NAME; a specific call to specific sheep… NOT a general call to all hoping some will hear) and His sheer RESPOND by following Him. Each and every one.

There are some so blinded with hatred of the thought that God, in His sovereignty, has determined to eternal fate of all from before the beginning of creation they will twist every passage which teaches God’s sovereignty to mean the opposite of the context.

They start numerous threads saying, “let’s rewrite this passage”. They pretend to be wise but prove the opposite every time they post. They have no shame or willingness to accept any opinion other than their own.

They cannot understand is kind of power. They cannot comprehend is kind of love. They continue to lift up man and demand God RESPOND to them, when scripture clearly teaches all who are saved do so by RESPONDING to God.

peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

There is a small group of deceived individuals out there that believe God has tied His own hands and waits on pins and needles for human beings to “make the right choice” so He can save them.

Every time they make such claims they are denying scripture (God’s very Word) and elevating man to a position beyond his station and ability. Such thinking is secular and not biblical.

Let’s look at what scripture actually teaches..

God chose Abram (scripture does not say why) and Abram RESPONDED to God’s intervention and revelation of Himself by obeying and believing the promises of God.

God chose Moses, revealing Himself, and Moses RESPONDED to God’s revelation of Himself and obeyed God and demonstrated faith.

God revealed Himself to Jacob and he RESPONDED by refusing to let go until God blessed him.

The list is very long where God reveals Himself and people RESPOND to God.

Even in the passages where people are praying to God (women wanting children, Gideon and the fleece) these folks are already RESPONDING to what God has revealed of Himself through OT prophets, oral traditions, scrolls and such and RESPONDING to what God has revealed of Himself with prayers.

Jesus called His disciples and they RESPONDED by following Him.

In John 10, we see this principle applies to all believers. Jesus says “My sheep hear My voice, I call them by name, and they follow Me”

Very easy to understand for anyone without bias. Jesus calls (He reveals Himself) the sheep hear His voice (notice He calls them BY NAME; a specific call to specific sheep… NOT a general call to all hoping some will hear) and His sheer RESPOND by following Him. Each and every one.

There are some so blinded with hatred of the thought that God, in His sovereignty, has determined to eternal fate of all from before the beginning of creation they will twist every passage which teaches God’s sovereignty to mean the opposite of the context.

They start numerous threads saying, “let’s rewrite this passage”. They pretend to be wise but prove the opposite every time they post. They have no shame or willingness to accept any opinion other than their own.

They cannot understand is kind of power. They cannot comprehend is kind of love. They continue to lift up man and demand God RESPOND to them, when scripture clearly teaches all who are saved do so by RESPONDING to God.

peace to you

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
Rom 10:10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.


Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 1:14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God's own possession, to the praise of His glory.

Rom 10:13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

Joh 3:14 "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up;
Joh 3:15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.

Rom 1:20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

I am always surprised at those that tout the sovereignty of God and yet will deny that same sovereignty. God in His sovereignty has chosen to save those that choose to believe in Him. God foreknows all those that will freely trust in or reject Him but He does not cause either response.

If God were to be the one that "has determined to eternal fate of all from before the beginning of creation" as you claim @canadyjd then He becomes responsible for all those that are set to hell. Remember your the one that says He has determined it all.

You pretend to be wise but prove the opposite every time you post. You have no shame or willingness to accept any opinion other than their your own. Only God can save and He has chosen to save those that freely trust in Him. We see this in the OT and NT.

 

[canadyjd]

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
Rom 10:10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.


Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 1:14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God's own possession, to the praise of His glory.

Rom 10:13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

Joh 3:14 "As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up;
Joh 3:15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.

Rom 1:20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.

I am always surprised at those that tout the sovereignty of God and yet will deny that same sovereignty. God in His sovereignty has chosen to save those that choose to believe in Him. God foreknows all those that will freely trust in or reject Him but He does not cause either response.

If God were to be the one that "has determined to eternal fate of all from before the beginning of creation" as you claim @canadyjd then He becomes responsible for all those that are set to hell. Remember your the one that says He has determined it all.

You pretend to be wise but prove the opposite every time you post. You have no shame or willingness to accept any opinion other than their your own. Only God can save and He has chosen to save those that freely trust in Him. We see this in the OT and NT.

As usual, you cannot address any passages referenced in the OP which clearly demonstrate mankind responds to God.

Thank you for proving everything I stated in the original post.

peace to you

 

[Martin Marprelate]

God chose Abram (scripture does not say why) and Abram RESPONDED to God’s intervention and revelation of Himself by obeying and believing the promises of God.

Joshua 24:2-3. 'Thus says the LORD God of Israel: "Your fathers, including Terah, the father of Abraham, and the father of Nahor, dwelt on the other side of the River in old times; and they served other gods.
Then I took your father Abraham from the other side of the River, led him through all the land of Canaan, and multiplied his descendants....."'

 

[37818]

God has always kept a relationship with mankind in some way. Beginning with Adam and Eve. We have the God given Genesis account handed down to us by way of people He has kept His relationship to this day. We now have a 66 book Bible and our Christian faith.

 

[Silverhair]

As usual, you cannot address any passages referenced in the OP which clearly demonstrate mankind responds to God.

Thank you for proving everything I stated in the original post.

peace to you

It is really sad to see that you are so committed to your man-made philosophy that you will deny clear scripture that I posted.
The bible is clear that man must have knowledge of God before they can respond to God and it it though that knowledge they will either choose to accept or reject Him.

So no one would suggest that man does not respond to God as logically why would they respond to something they have no knowledge of.

“Faith comes by hearing...”: {Rom_10:17} we must first hear, in order that we may know what is to be believed. “Those who know Your name trust in You...” {Psa_9:10} A measure of knowledge is essential to faith: hence the importance of getting knowledge. “Incline your ear and come to Me; listen, so that your soul may live.” {Isa_55:3}, such was the word of the ancient prophet, and it is the word of the gospel still.

You may quote scripture but you draw the wrong conclusion from the text. Scripture is the standard not your man-made philosophy as you seem to think as shown by your comments.

 

[canadyjd]

It is really sad to see that you are so committed to your man-made philosophy that you will deny clear scripture that I posted.
The bible is clear that man must have knowledge of God before they can respond to God and it it though that knowledge they will either choose to accept or reject Him.

So no one would suggest that man does not respond to God as logically why would they respond to something they have no knowledge of.

“Faith comes by hearing...”: {Rom_10:17} we must first hear, in order that we may know what is to be believed. “Those who know Your name trust in You...” {Psa_9:10} A measure of knowledge is essential to faith: hence the importance of getting knowledge. “Incline your ear and come to Me; listen, so that your soul may live.” {Isa_55:3}, such was the word of the ancient prophet, and it is the word of the gospel still.

You may quote scripture but you draw the wrong conclusion from the text. Scripture is the standard not your man-made philosophy as you seem to think as shown by your comments.

Unable to respond to the OP. Unable to understand God’s love, God’s power, God’s plan because you are ALWAYS focused on man and not God.

That is why you continue in error, including the belief, “Many are saved having never heard the gospel”

VERY SAD, Indeed

peace to you

 

[Deacon]

So we see Sovereignty vs. Free will - I'm in the middle ground between the two.

We have a choice everyday to respond to God in way that pleases him.
There appears to be a balance between God's sovereignty and his desire for mankind to make a choice to follow after him.

God has clearly presented a path to follow.
There are numerous examples of God's 'chosen people' walking away from the instructions of the LORD.
In example after example in the Torah, we read about mankind's failings...and God's continued faithfulness.

God holds people accountable for their decisions.
He sees and responds to our choices.

For the ways of everyone are before the eyes of the Lord,
And He observes all his paths.
Proverbs 5:21 NASB (2020)​

God chose Solomon and revealed to him that he had a choice.

As for you, my son Solomon, know the God of your father, and serve Him wholeheartedly and with a willing mind;
for the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts.
If you seek Him, He will let you find Him; but if you forsake Him, He will reject you forever.
1 Chronicles 28:9-10 NASB (2020)
​

There is a reason why God revealed himself to mankind.
He's looking for us to respond to him and walk in a like manner.

I, the Lord, search the heart, I test the mind,
To give to each person according to his ways,
According to the results of his deeds.
Jeremiah 17:10 NASB (2020)​

God calls out to all mankind (the world) but only some hear him;
God's Spirit is a mysterious influencer.

Sometimes we, his sheep, respond by following after him, other times we go astray.
He listens for his sheep to cry out and rescues us from our wanderings.
God's grace through Jesus is a wondrous power which covers our sins.

Rob

 

[Silverhair]

Unable to respond to the OP. Unable to understand God’s love, God’s power, God’s plan because you are ALWAYS focused on man and not God.

That is why you continue in error, including the belief, “Many are saved having never heard the gospel”

VERY SAD, Indeed

peace to you

You just do not like that fact that I quote scripture in response to your errant post. And you still deny the sovereignty of God by your silly comments. You refuse to allow God to save as He see fit. Why do you limit God?

Answer this @canadyjd were the saints of the OT saved when they trusted in God?

 

[canadyjd]

You just do not like that fact that I quote scripture in response to your errant post. And you still deny the sovereignty of God by your silly comments. You refuse to allow God to save as He see fit. Why do you limit God?

Answer this @canadyjd were the saints of the OT saved when they trusted in God?

Answer me this, @Silverhair, can you name one OT saint that didn’t RESPOND FIRST to God’s revelation of Himself?

You refuse to acknowledge that God has revealed to us exactly how He has planned to save every single person that will be saved. You don’t like God’s plan, as revealed in scripture, so you modify God’s plan to fit your secular man made philosophy that lifts man above God and demands God respond to man instead of man resounding to God.

According to scripture, the OT saints were saved by believing God’s promises concerning the coming Messiah. That is the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

I understand you are enraged at the thought of God being in control of the salvation of every single person that will ever be saved.

That is your secular man made philosophy leading you into error.

Very Sad

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

So we see Sovereignty vs. Free will - I'm in the middle ground between the two.

We have a choice everyday to respond to God in way that pleases him.
There appears to be a balance between God's sovereignty and his desire for mankind to make a choice to follow after him.

God has clearly presented a path to follow.
There are numerous examples of God's 'chosen people' walking away from the instructions of the LORD.
In example after example in the Torah, we read about mankind's failings...and God's continued faithfulness.

God holds people accountable for their decisions.
He sees and responds to our choices.

For the ways of everyone are before the eyes of the Lord,
And He observes all his paths.
Proverbs 5:21 NASB (2020)​

God chose Solomon and revealed to him that he had a choice.

As for you, my son Solomon, know the God of your father, and serve Him wholeheartedly and with a willing mind;
for the Lord searches all hearts, and understands every intent of the thoughts.
If you seek Him, He will let you find Him; but if you forsake Him, He will reject you forever.
1 Chronicles 28:9-10 NASB (2020)
​

There is a reason why God revealed himself to mankind.
He's looking for us to respond to him and walk in a like manner.

I, the Lord, search the heart, I test the mind,
To give to each person according to his ways,
According to the results of his deeds.
Jeremiah 17:10 NASB (2020)​

God calls out to all mankind (the world) but only some hear him;
God's Spirit is a mysterious influencer.

Sometimes we, his sheep, respond by following after him, other times we go astray.
He listens for his sheep to cry out and rescues us from our wanderings.
God's grace through Jesus is a wondrous power which covers our sins.

Rob

I think you are missing the point. Solomon responded to God’s revelation of Himself. Did Solomon make a choice? Of course he did. Does every person that has ever been saved or will be saved make a choice? Of course they do.

But by doing so, they are responding to what God has already done. God is not responding to man by revealing Himself to him. Man is responding to God.

I would rather not chase the rabbit hole of the “freewill” verses “human will enslaved to sin” debate, which would take the focus off mankind responding to God in salvation.

Thank you for expressing your opinion in a civil and respectful manner.

peace to you

 

[Deacon]

Solomon responded to God’s revelation of Himself. Did Solomon make a choice? Of course he did. Does every person that has ever been saved or will be saved make a choice? Of course they do.

But by doing so, they are responding to what God has already done. God is not responding to man by revealing Himself to him. Man is responding to God.

I would rather not chase the rabbit hole of the “freewill” verses “human will enslaved to sin” debate, which would take the focus off mankind responding to God in salvation.

Thank you for expressing your opinion in a civil and respectful manner.

peace to you

This is Christianity 101.

We love because he first loved us (1 John 4:9-10).​

The heavens tell of the glory of God;
And their expanse declares the work of His hands.
Psalm 19 (NASB (2020)​

Paul, in the Epistle to the Romans (Romans 1:19-20), tells us that General Revelation is enough to convict mankind of his sinfulness.

For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes,
that is, His eternal power and divine nature,
have been clearly perceived, being understood by what has been made,
so that they are without excuse.​

It's impossible for anyone to get way from God's revelation of himself.

Scripture is one form of his revelation (Special Revelation);
Nature (the heaven's) is another form of revelation (General Revelation).​

God revealed himself because he loves us (John 3:16).

Without revelation mankind would be without a witness of God, and we all would be lost.
Simply said, without God's revelation the world would not know of God.

God pursues us.
God waits eagerly for us to respond to his revelation.

Like sheep, "there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous people who have no need of repentance."
Luke 15:7 (NASB 2020)

...there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents. Luke 15:10b (NASB 2020)​

Rob

 

[canadyjd]

This is Christianity 101.

We love because he first loved us (1 John 4:9-10).​

The heavens tell of the glory of God;
And their expanse declares the work of His hands.
Psalm 19 (NASB (2020)​

Paul, in the Epistle to the Romans (Romans 1:19-20), tells us that General Revelation is enough to convict mankind of his sinfulness.

For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes,
that is, His eternal power and divine nature,
have been clearly perceived, being understood by what has been made,
so that they are without excuse.​

It's impossible for anyone to get way from God's revelation of himself.

Scripture is one form of his revelation (Special Revelation);
Nature (the heaven's) is another form of revelation (General Revelation).​

God revealed himself because he loves us (John 3:16).

Without revelation mankind would be without a witness of God, and we all would be lost.
Simply said, without God's revelation the world would not know of God.

God pursues us.
God waits eagerly for us to respond to his revelation.

Like sheep, "there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous people who have no need of repentance."
Luke 15:7 (NASB 2020)

...there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents. Luke 15:10b (NASB 2020)​

Rob

There are two types of God’s revelation to humanity.

1. General revelation: found in creation is sufficient to understand God e it’s. According to Romans 1, all have rejected general revelation therefore, it saves no one.

2. Special revelation: This occurs when God intentionally choses specific people and reveals Himself to them. Hebrews 1 tells us that in times past this occurred in various and Sundry ways. Burning bushes, talking donkeys, visions, dreams, angels etc. In these last days, God has revealed Himself through His Son Jesus, the ultimate revelation of God.

Please provide scripture to support your statement God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation?

peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

There are two types of God’s revelation to humanity.

1. General revelation: found in creation is sufficient to understand God e it’s. According to Romans 1, all have rejected general revelation therefore, it saves no one.

2. Special revelation: This occurs when God intentionally choses specific people and reveals Himself to them. Hebrews 1 tells us that in times past this occurred in various and Sundry ways. Burning bushes, talking donkeys, visions, dreams, angels etc. In these last days, God has revealed Himself through His Son Jesus, the ultimate revelation of God.

Please provide scripture to support your statement God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation?

peace to you

Please provide the post where I ever said "God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation".

General revelation is provided so that all can know God and as we know most will reject Him but that does not mean all will reject Him.

Why do you just have such a low view of the sovereignty of God and His love for His creation?

Remember He wants to draw all to Himself and has provided the means for them to know Him. You even listed some of them but left of His creation, conviction of sin the gospel message.

God can and does use various means but you just continue to deny that as God He can do as He wants, He does not need your permission @canadyjd before He can save the person that calls out to Him.

 

[canadyjd]

Please provide the post where I ever said "God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation".

General revelation is provided so that all can know God and as we know most will reject Him but that does not mean all will reject Him.

Why do you just have such a low view of the sovereignty of God and His love for His creation?

Remember He wants to draw all to Himself and has provided the means for them to know Him. You even listed some of them but left of His creation, conviction of sin the gospel message.

God can and does use various means but you just continue to deny that as God He can do as He wants, He does not need your permission @canadyjd before He can save the person that calls out to Him.

Please provide proof I ever claimed you posted any such thing.

“most” do not reject general revelation. All reject general revelation according to Romans 1.

I am not surprised your beliefs are based on secular philosophy instead of God’s Word. That is why you continue to post error upon error.

peace to you

 

[Silverhair]

Please provide proof I ever claimed you posted any such thing.

“most” do not reject general revelation. All reject general revelation according to Romans 1.

I am not surprised your beliefs are based on secular philosophy instead of God’s Word. That is why you continue to post error upon error.

peace to you

Your post # 13 "Please provide scripture to support your statement God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation?"

This is where you fall of the truck @canadyjd you cling to out of context verses in the attempt to prove your point. So if none can accept Gods' general revelation as you claim the scripture proves then as we follow the context then all have "exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator" and " the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful,". I could go on but I am sure you would not say all men are like that. So if all men are not like that then the question you have to answer is why not?

Does that mean that some men actually did not reject the general revelation, sure seems that way.

 

[Deacon]

Please provide scripture to support your statement God is waiting eagerly for us to respond to His revelation?

peace to you

Am I misunderstanding you?

2 Peter 3:9 (NASB 2020)
The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance.​

This idea you mention in the opening post: 'God revealing himself; people responding' is expressed in 1 John 4:19, "We love because he first loved us."
God made the first move and expects a response.

Jews had a special relationship with God; God revealed himself to them.
You listed a number of faithful 'chosen ones' in your opening post.

They looked at the gentiles as impure, unclean, unholy, not chosen.

The idea that God only came to the Chosen People was strong,
yet there were provisions in the Torah that those outside the 'chosen circle' could enter in.

So strong was this exclusionary impression that after Jesus' death and resurrection, there was a struggle to allow gentiles to 'enter in".
The response of Peter when he was firmly told by God to go to the unholy, unclean gentile, Cornelius.

...God has shown me that I am not to call any person unholy or unclean. (Acts 10:28 NASB 2020)​

Separate yourself from the idea that you know of God's sovereign foreknowledge.
We are to be a witness to the world (Matt. 28:19) because God desires all to know of him.

For those that become saved, that knowledge lead to salvation.
For those that didn't listen, those that didn't have ears to hear, those that rejected his revelation, that knowledge will lead to damnation.

1 Timothy 2:3–4
This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who wants all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.​

Rob

 

[canadyjd]

Your post # 13 "Please provide scripture to support your statement God is waiting eagerly for for us to respond to His revelation?"

This is where you fall of the truck @canadyjd you cling to out of context verses in the attempt to prove your point. So if none can accept Gods' general revelation as you claim the scripture proves then as we follow the context then all have "exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator" and " the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful,". I could go on but I am sure you would not say all men are like that. So if all men are not like that then the question you have to answer is why not?

Does that mean that some men actually did not reject the general revelation, sure seems that way.

I wasn’t talking to you in Post #13. Therefore, you have failed to prove I said that about something YOU posted.

Not surprising, you don’t read and understand these posts any better than you can read and understand scripture.

And, not surprisingly, you think it’s all about You.

peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

Am I misunderstanding you?

2 Peter 3:9 (NASB 2020)
The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance.​

This idea you mention in the opening post: 'God revealing himself; people responding' is expressed in 1 John 4:19, "We love because he first loved us."
God made the first move and expects a response.

Jews had a special relationship with God; God revealed himself to them.
You listed a number of faithful 'chosen ones' in your opening post.

They looked at the gentiles as impure, unclean, unholy, not chosen.

The idea that God only came to the Chosen People was strong,
yet there were provisions in the Torah that those outside the 'chosen circle' could enter in.

So strong was this exclusionary impression that after Jesus' death and resurrection, there was a struggle to allow gentiles to 'enter in".
The response of Peter when he was firmly told by God to go to the unholy, unclean gentile, Cornelius.

...God has shown me that I am not to call any person unholy or unclean. (Acts 10:28 NASB 2020)​

Separate yourself from the idea that you know of God's sovereign foreknowledge.
We are to be a witness to the world (Matt. 28:19) because God desires all to know of him.

For those that become saved, that knowledge lead to salvation.
For those that didn't listen, those that didn't have ears to hear, those that rejected his revelation, that knowledge will lead to damnation.

1 Timothy 2:3–4
This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who wants all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.​

Rob

The argument of 2 Peter is the “unwilling for any to perish” is referring to any of the chosen.

Concerning the 1 Timothy passage, Paul had just instructed Timothy to offer prayers and supplications for “all men”. He then says God desires all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. It appears the the context favors “all men without distinction (Jew or Gentile, right ch or poor)” rather than “all men without exception”

When you consider other passages written by Paul that clearly indicate God has “chosen” who will be saved (Romans 8 and 9) and the method by which they would come to a knowledge of the truth (the preaching of Jesus Christ and Him crucified) 1 Corinthians 1, that would present a conflict with believing Paul was saying God desired all men, without exception, to be saved.

Some have sought to reconcile these passages in at least two different ways.

1. As mentioned, Paul is referring to all men without distinction, which is a common theme in his writings.

2. The second is argument is the “hidden will” of God and the “revealed will” of God. The revealed will being God would rather every person on the planet come to a knowledge of salvation. The “hidden will” is that, since all men have rejected God and are damned, God has chosen some, according to His own goodness, to bring a remnant to salvation.

Both ideas have scriptural support.

However, the reading of God desires all men, without exception, to be saved directly conflicts with many passages of scripture.

Those that support that understanding, imo, cannot reconcile the passages.

peace to you

 

[kyredneck]

Am I misunderstanding you?

2 Peter 3:9 (NASB 2020)
The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not willing for any to perish, but for all to come to repentance.

John said the very same thing here:
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come forth, my people, out of her, that ye have no fellowship with her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues:
5 for her sins have reached even unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. Rev 18

From The Comforter's first sermon (to the Jews):
Save yourselves from this crooked generation. Acts Of The Apostles 2:40

Peter (and John) was apostle to JEWISH Christians, his audience was the JEWISH generation on whom 'the wrath' was to come and bring to a violent end the Sinai Covenant.

7 But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore of sound mind, and be sober unto prayer: 1 Pe 4