Hunting vs Foraging

You know, people all across America enjoy the thrill of walking into a steakhouse and ordering a big fat ribeye. You're probably one of them. Yet, the end result is the same exact thing... an animal dies a not-so-pleasant death so that you can enjoy your nice meal. There's no difference. Now, if these restaurant trips were not thrilling and they only existed to put nutrition in your body... the fat content in beef would be much lower, there wouldn't be such a thing as steak sauce, there wouldn't be fancy decorations inside the restuarant... no, make no mistake, people highly enjoy going out to eat, and in fat I'd say that it's probably thrilling.

One thing I thought I'd mention that hunters often say yet non-hunters don't seem to understand:

"It's the thrill of the hunt, not the thrill of the kill".

Experienced hunters don't have a bloodlust and want to see something die. It's everything else in the experience that makes it thrilling. Non-hunters don't believe this or at least don't understand it, they think all hunters are just lusting to kill something. That's just not the case. You'll never understand this unless you actually do it, and sitting here jabbering about it saying the same mess over and over again doesn't count.

 

Then you are not seeing the argument being made. The sole purpose of hunting is either...

A. For food, since one does not have the resources to buy it.

B. For fun...the enjoyment of killing an animal.

You cannot say the sole purpose in doing so is both combined. I have yet to hear someone chime in that at the point of starvation, they enjoyed killing an animal for food.

Was your steak as a result of killing for fun, or because you cannot afford food? I never once said it's ok as long as you don't enjoy it. I know plenty of people who enjoy goiing grocery shopping, me not being one of them. If you cannot afford food, and must hunt to stay alive...and enjoy doing so, all the power to you.

BTW...how does my view define me as a "liberal"? If anything it's as conservative as can be, and the enjoyment of hunting for "sport" is the liberal view.

 

I missed this. Could you post it again or specify the post number? The Word really says it's a sin to enjoy the hunt?

 

I think you are making a faulty argument, in which you are setting up only two alternatives, neither of which actually fits my family's case.

A. Yes, my family does it for food. However, we could go to the grocery store instead. And often do. However, venison can be quite a bit healthier than store beef. And several of us like its taste better than beef.

B. There is no more enjoyment there than my grandmother had when she grabbed a chicken in the chickenyard, wrung its neck and plucked it.
Or when someone turns a pig into German sausage.
Killing is not enjoyable. It is necessary to get the meat, though.

Many people these days don't realize what farmers do, so we can buy food at the grocery store.

How about C. also?

A love of fresh air and being outside? Time to spend with family?

There are other valid reasons.

 

I haven't seen too many compelling scriptures supporting your point of view either though. It's simply not addressed well. When hunting IS addressed, it's addressed as a normal thing to do, nothing bad. I am quite sure that the people who went hunting in the biblical days did in fact thoroughly enjoy it. I don't see what the problem is whatsoever if we continue to do the exact same thing they were doing. They weren't condemned for it, so like I said... what's the problem?

I completely understand any arguments against people who only want the kill and could care less about the meat and have no respect.

 

Typically, anti-hunters are liberal tree-huggers.

 

Another thing to think about... man cannot synthesize his own protein like an animal does. We can't just eat grass and get protein like a cow. We need to "steal" these amino acids from other sources. Even the best source of plant protein (soybeans) only includes 18 amino acids out of a possible 20, which is supplied by animals, obviously we were designed to eat some meat. Now if we do eat meat, then an animal has to die for us to do so, whether a worker at a factory chops off his head, or I put a bullet through both lungs.

Now, here's the twist... what if that factory worker enjoys his job of chopping off cow heads??? If you truly believe the way you do, then by eating store bought meat then you are potentially causing a good person to do a non-Christian thing, which should be just as bad as doing it yourself. So, the only way to completely avoid any non-Christian actions, at least going by your values, is to quit eating meat. Which, is great. If you truly believe that, then I support you in your decision. I really do. But, if you continue to eat store bought meat regardless of all this, then you are WRONG, and there is nothing wrong with hunting. The only difference is that you don't have to see the animals face and see blood coming out of its nose and witness the last seconds of it's life, which, is a tough thing to do. (The real bloodlust people truly enjoy this part of the experience, but that's usually not the case) No, all you see is a nicely wrapped piece of meat that doesn't remind you of a dead bloody animal at all. It doesn't change the facts, only your perception.




I guess to sum up my thoughts... given that:

1. Man has always hunted.

2. Man was not condemned for hunting during the bible days.

3. Man has always felt satisfied and thrilled when a hunt was successful.

4. Meat that I get from a successful hunt is MUCH better for me and my family than storebought meat.



Basically I conclude that:

1. If anything, God wants me to go hunting.

2. If I feel thrilled about a successful hunt, I should not feel ashamed of it, because if God frowned upon these actions, he wouldn't have made me in such a manner that I experience such feelings.

 

We hunt for sport and eat the deer we kill. Webdog is apparently trying to create some kind of false dichotomy in this... but there isn't one.

I also butcher my own to save money.

In our area however, farmers beg people to kill deer even if they leave them laying in the fields. Deer do can do thousands in crop damage. My county had close to 2,500 over the 11 days of first gun season... and a human population of about 7,500. MO overall had around 240,000 reported deer kills. That isn't anywhere close to enough to prevent signficant crop damage next year. In fact, rules for our area are that you can only kill one buck but as many does as you are willing to buy $7 tags for. We have a second rifle season for antlerless deer only. MDC is trying to bring the population down before damage and disease costs become more significant.

That brings up another very good reason to hunt even for sport- population control. Out of control population results in disease and even starvation.

 

Well you answered well when you said "As I see it"

Abortion is against Gods word. Hunting is wrong "as you see it"

That is the difference.

 

When you eat you take part in the killing and you take pleasure in your part. You justify it because you dont see the blood and hire somebody else to do the killing so you can take pleasure in your part.

 

Webdog

You have said in the past that you enjoy watching football. Football is a violent game. Is watching or participating in violence for fun a Christ like activity.

If violence against animals is wrong even when the meat is used. Then violence against humans for sport and no other reason is really wrong.

I think it is easy to condem activitys that we do not ourselfs participate in or do not understand. You are obviously not a hunter and you do not understand why others hunt. That is ok but to condem it based on what you do not understand and with no Biblical support it unfair.

 

You have just admitted you kill for fun...with the food a secondary reason. Just as I stated. Population control is hardly "sport". I don't see Orkin employees claiming extermination to be "sport".

 

Football isn't "violent", it's physical. How can you even compare a physical sport to killing an innocent animal for "fun"?

 

Funny how people always brings up subjects to ask if they are un-Christian or to just blatantly state how un-Christian they are, only if they don't do those activities themselves. Aren't we supposed to not be judgmental? I think it's especially judgmental when there is no biblical proof behind your judging.

 

I agree with this statement 100% actually, but your recent comments totally contradict this statement and show your true attitude. The problem is that even if you hunt for food, you're probably going to enjoy it, yet you're saying that's wrong, but this original statement is totally different than what you're saying now. We are hard-wired to feel deep satisfaction in a successful hunt, so I don't see what the problem is.

What happened is that you shot a deer then had to watch it die and you felt sorry for it, yet you don't feel sorry for that cow that you didn't have to watch die.

 

You keep insisting on a dichotomy that simply doesn't exist. It is one experience, not multiple ones. We enjoy the sport and we enjoy the meat.

Your insistence on an either/or would be just as ridiculous as saying are you a Christian or do you love Jesus. You have to choose one as primary... Of course you don't have to choose. It is both.

And yes, it is fun to hunt and there is a thrill of the kill just as there was throughout biblical times.

I never denied it.

False analogy. Hunting is a sport with a beneficial side effect.

 

No. We are not supposed to judge by personal standards rather than God's standard.

Precisely.

 

It is not one "experience". The motives and intentions are clearly different.

So it's "thrilling" to kill? Does this appease the flesh, or is it done for the glory of God in killing something God deems "good", solely for the "thrill"?

Define "sport" and the "beneficial side effect" for the animal being hunted...