I just drugged myself

Nothing wrong with grape juice for sure. When growing up my mother sometimes use horse liniment on our sore muscles and I still whinney sometimes.


Horseburger

 

Possible, JoJ. But it is also Dr Luke may have been there to set broken limbs or for other needs. There is not one verse in the Word of God that says he prescribed drugs to anyone.

Wonder why Luke didn't have any instance of prescribing drugs to a person.

As to Paul telling Timothy to take a little wine (grape juice), that wine was not something to alter the mind, but to settle the stomach. It was not some chemical man makes under microscopes or in petri dishes. It was not something to cause side effects that were worse than the original ailment.

 

Just curious Digging, are you against vitamins as well?

 

tim,

I get my vitamins naturally. from veggies and fruits grown in the garden.

 

Like I said I was just curious.. I obviously disagree with you, but that's OK...
I disagree with myself sometimes.

I can agree with you that I hate the side effects of the meds out there.
And those TV commercials!!!! They are so stupid.

I have actually called the drug reps in the Drs. office "high paid drug pushers"

We go to the pediatrician's office and these drug reps come in and take the Dr's time. I was very aggravated waiting for over an hr so the Dr could talk to these "drug pushers" I told them so, and the Dr. bent over laughing. He had never seen anyone have the guts to call them that.

IMO there is too much money in drug companies.. that is why prescriptions are so $$$$

 

So you think Luke spent years with Paul and never gave him medicine? A doctor who never gave medicine? That's rich! :tongue3:

Check your Bible again. God approves of medicine. Jer. 8:22--"Is there no balm in Gilead; is there no physician there? why then is not the health of the daughter of my people recovered?" You may say that's just a metaphorical use. God would not use a metaphor based on somethig unrighteous when talking about the spiritual needs of His people.

Jesus Himself endorsed going to doctors. Mt 9:12--"But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick." If taking medicine was wrong that would have been a perfect chance for Jesus to say, "They that are sick need a physician--but just don't take their medicine." :type:

 

JoJ,

Check yer calendar. I think you may be shocked to realize this is the 21st century and not the 1st.

Thinhs were much different back then. Why, many things that people were dying from in the 18th century they don't die from today.

And you think Luke gave out prescription drugs? LOL

 

A balm was a salve, not a pill.

 

Funny--your profile says you are an IFB, like me. Personally I believe that ALL Scripture is profitable. Though it was written in the 1st century, it is ALL profitable for the 21st.

Who said anything about prescription drugs? I didn't, and I don't remember you doing so. I was under the impression from what you have written that you were against ALL drugs. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Here's another verse for you. If it is wrong to use nature to produce medicine in the lab, then why does the Bible talk about herbs for healing in the New Jerusalem: "In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations" (Rev. 22:2)

Now it is your turn. Give me a verse--any verse--saying why medicine, even prescription medicine, is wrong.

I believe I have you figured out. Are you a follower of the Hallelujah Diet? I'm an old-time Fundamentalist, brother, in the mold of John R. Rice and Monroe Parker. That generation and my generation never taught or believed that stuff. Even Lester Roloff never went near as far as the HD, and yet Malkmus claims to follow him.

Malkmus is not a Fundamentalist. I heard one of his tapes with a testimony by a Charismatic on it. Friend, you need to cast that stuff in the wastebasket of theology, because that guy doesn't have a Biblical leg to stand on. Just some friendly advice from an old time Fundamentalist.

 

So prescription salves are okay but prescription pills are wrong? The principle is the same. You have to do better than that. Give me Scripture saying that pills are evil.

 

Show me where pills were prescribed in the Word.

 

JoJ,

We could go back and forth with this until the Lord comes, but the fact is, nowhere can we find doctors giving pills in the Bible. Salves for the skin were used, and wine was suggested to calm Timothy's stomach. Those are the only instances of possible medicines in the Word of God. And the only one of those that was internal was the wine which was not alcoholic, and was nothing more than grape juice. Hardly material enough to advocate putting in our bodies what they call cures today.

I beleive with all the medications available today, and doctors a plenty, many don't even think of taking an ill to the Lord who wants us to cast our burdens on Him.

He is still the healer He was nearly 2000 years ago. And did He not say our faith can move the mountains in our lives? Many trust Him with their souls, but don't think to trust Him with their health, finances, and needs.

 

Oh, come now, you can do better than this. Your argument from silence is very weak. We are going back and forth with me saying what the Bible says and you saying what the Bible does not say. In my view that means I win hands down!!

I have listed several passages positive towards doctors and medicine, but you have not listed a single passage, not one single passage that is negative. Try digging deeper into the Word!! :thumbsup:

Lets review the score:
DITW: No passages negative towards doctors and medicine.
JOJ: Passages postitive towards doctors and medicine: Luke accompanying Paul and writing two books, Jer. 8:22, Matt. 9:12 (I didn't even include the parallel passages in Mark and Luke), Rev. 22:2.

Looks to me like I win the debate hands down. :thumbs: :smilewinkgrin:

I will agree with you on one thing. We should trust the Lord first. And I actually have Scripture for that, even though you have not given any. 2 Chron. 16:12--"And Asa in the thirty and ninth year of his reign was diseased in his feet, until his disease was exceeding great: yet in his disease he sought not to the LORD, but to the physicians." But do you know what? God may actually lead us in that case to go to a doctor rather than healing us directly. The point of Scripture is that we should go to God first and then, if He so leads us, to the physician.

God heals through doctors, since Jesus Himself specifically endorsed the help of physicians. Yet you have refused to acknowledge that on this forum. I don't mean to be unkind, and in fact mean to rebuke you in love with the following statement. Are you sure you have the right name on this forum? You are not acknowledging some of the Scripture I have given you, in particular the passage where Jesus endorsed going to a physician. I made a vow to the Lord many years ago that when I found Scripture that was different from a position I held, I would change my position, not my interpretation of Scripture. Are you willing to do that?

 

Oh, come on now, diggin'. This is just plain ridiculous.
What salve for the skin can you possibly recommend to a Christian leper nowadays ? You have no idea the misery and shame lepers go through. I do. I lived in proximity to lepers in my country for years.

What wine can you recommend for the peptic or gastric ulcer sufferer ? Even the one suffering from diarrhea ? How do you know that the illness Timothy had was as intense as rampaging diarrhea, or perforated ulcers ?

I am diabetic. Uncontrolled, the doctors say. Would you recommend I go out and buy a bottle of Welch's ? That would up my blood sugar level from uncontrolled to rampaging, and even you would have to agree to that.

For blood pressure many swear to the efficacy of garlic bulbs put under the tongue. I tried that. Discarded my pills for a week. Tell you what, not only did my friends have to yell at me to talk with me for a week because they kept their distance from my breath, one doctor even remarked they need to come up with a special sphygmomanometer with higher digits to measure my blood pressure. Needless to say, I went back to pills.

I admire your candor, man, but, what you're saying is just way off.

You don't know that for a fact, do you ?

Well, have you moved mountains yet ? Ain't nobody sayin' nuthin' here 'bout Jesus being healer as passe already, so far.

All we're sayin' as I see it is that science and human knowledge, even of and from unbelievers, are blessings for the benefits of God's people which God in His infinite wisdom provided.

Remember the silver and gold that Egyptians gave to the Israelites on their way out of Egypt ? Blessings, man, yet the Bible tells us not to put our trust in riches or on man.

I think it's all a matter of perspective.

We trust the Lord to make things work, if they do, then praise and honor and thanksgiving goes to Him FIRST. We run to the Lord in times of illness and troubles, true, and then we make use of provisions which are already at hand.

Someone said: We go to a doctor and when somebody we love dies, say it's the Lord's will, but, when he lives, "man, that doctor was good !".

Now, that is wrong.:tonofbricks:

 

Why this dichotomy between prescribed pills and over-the-counter pills? Many over-the-counter pills were once prescribed. The difference is artificial. The Bible doesn't mention pills, true, but it does mention other medicines. Why make a difference where the Bible doesn't?

In fact, your difference between pills and balms is also artificial. I have a skin disease called Rosacea that became an eye disease called Ocular Rosacea. And yes we pray about it all the time. God brought it into my life to teach me some things, just like He brought Paul's thorn in the flesh into Paul's life (2 Cor. 12:7).

I can take antibiotic pills (made from a natural source, remember?) for the disease or I can use blephamide salve for my eyes. You know which is more dangerous, which I have to use more carefully? The eye salve.

Now, the Bible mentions "eyesalve" positively in Rev. 3:18--"I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see." If the two medicines do exactly the same thing, why is it right to use the eyesalve, which is the more dangerous medicine, but not the pills?

 

I take prescribed medications every day for physical, and mental illness.
It is my belief that God uses Doctors to help diagnose, and treat illnesses.
The medications I now take, I will take for the rest of my life.

 

I knew it, I knew it.

I went to the Dr today and she put me on blood pressure meds....

YOu all jinxed me!!! lol

 

Well, let me put it another way. I don't like to put anyone on the "spot", so to no one in particular, but addressed to all:

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:4, "Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire"?

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:5, "Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever"?

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:6-12?

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:13, "He watereth the hills from his chambers: the earth is satisfied with the fruit of thy works"?

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:14, "He causeth the grass to grow for the cattle, and herb for the service of man: that he may bring forth food out of the earth;" We see the thought and the proclamation do not end here. There is more to be added to this sentence.

Isn't there one of you here that believes Psalms 104:15, "And (He causeth) wine that maketh glad the heart of man, and oil to make his face to shine, and bread which strengtheneth man's heart"?

How can we continue to try and explain away part of two verses in the Bible, dislodge it and attribute the first of the sentence to God, and then dissect the remainder, pulling out the wine, and then give the glory to God of what's left? When we take from His Word and make it our word, it would seem to me we are following another light.

 

Why Tinytim,

[sarcasm]
Obviously, you don't trust God...you're going on that evil, sinful blood pressure meds...where's your faith?
[/sarcasm]

Sorry... I guess it could be worse...your Dr. could have told you to cut out the BB!