If it's not the Gospel, what is it??

[savedbymercy]

I have never seen a bigger attempt at twisting scripture. This completely ignores the fact that God reached out to Pharaoh. Also those verses are not about God's justice against sin. They are about God's mercy on His people. Those are two completely different things.

As has been said, there is nothing praise worthy about sending someone to hell without a chance of redemption. As the scriptures you posted have noted it is mercy where we find what is praise worthy. There is no mercy in your twisting of scripture and there is no mercy in your false doctrine and misunderstanding of what election is. The very verses you posted defeat your own argument.

Evasion and Rabbit Trail !

 

[DHK]

Then your statement is invalid and not supported by scripture ! Did you understand what I wrote in response to your invalid statement ? Please rehearse back to me what I said !

:laugh::laugh:
Have you got Alzheimer's and can't remember what you said?
You want me to rehearse what you said? What a joke! :laugh:

My statement is valid, very valid. You won't find the ugly doctrine of reprobation in the Bible. That is why I can't quote scripture to support it. Duh!

 

[convicted1]

I have never seen a bigger attempt at twisting scripture. This completely ignores the fact that God reached out to Pharaoh. Also those verses are not about God's justice against sin. They are about God's mercy on His people. Those are two completely different things.

As has been said, there is nothing praise worthy about sending someone to hell without a chance of redemption. As the scriptures you posted have noted it is mercy where we find what is praise worthy. There is no mercy in your twisting of scripture and there is no mercy in your false doctrine and misunderstanding of what election is. The very verses you posted defeat your own argument.

The Pharaoh that tortured Israel when Moses came back? I dunno about that. Every message God gave Moses was to let His people go or else...

Exodus 9:15-17 YLT
"for now I have put forth My hand, and I smite thee, and thy people, with pestilence, and thou art hidden from the earth. And yet for this I have caused thee to stand, so as to show thee My power, and for the sake of declaring My Name in all the earth; still thou art exalting thyself against My people -- so as not to send them away;"

Romans 9:17 for the Writing saith to Pharaoh -- `For this very thing I did raise thee up, that I might shew in thee My power, and that My name might be declared in all the land;'

It appears God raised him up to show him who's the Boss, imo...

 

[Revmitchell]

Evasion and Rabbit Trail !

Ok well it appears you do not have the ability to deal with reasonable arguments.

 

[savedbymercy]

[emoji23][emoji23]
Have you got Alzheimer's and can't remember what you said?
You want me to rehearse what you said? What a joke! [emoji23]

My statement is valid, very valid. You won't find the ugly doctrine of reprobation in the Bible. That is why I can't quote scripture to support it. Duh!

Yeah rehearse it back to me so that I know you understand what I wrote ! And yes your comment was invalid !

 

[savedbymercy]

The Pharaoh that tortured Israel when Moses came back? I dunno about that. Every message God gave Moses was to let His people go or else...

Exodus 9:15-17 YLT
"for now I have put forth My hand, and I smite thee, and thy people, with pestilence, and thou art hidden from the earth. And yet for this I have caused thee to stand, so as to show thee My power, and for the sake of declaring My Name in all the earth; still thou art exalting thyself against My people -- so as not to send them away;"

Romans 9:17 for the Writing saith to Pharaoh -- `For this very thing I did raise thee up, that I might shew in thee My power, and that My name might be declared in all the land;'

It appears God raised him up to show him who's the Boss, imo...

It appears you have the ability to evade and make rabbit trails !

 

[convicted1]

It appears you have the ability to evade and make rabbit trails !

Huh?? I was supporting you.


Are you EvaneglistBR549's twin?

 

[RLBosley]

I think someone got their wires crossed.

 

[savedbymercy]

Huh?? I was supporting you.


Are you EvaneglistBR549's twin?

Sorry, that was not meant for you but another poster !

 

[convicted1]

Sorry, that was not meant for you but another poster !

Okay. Good. I was wondering what happened....whew.....

 

[Protestant]

God loves all people. Otherwise the Great Commission is a lie. The second of the Two Great Commandments is a lie. In effect, if God loves only the elect, we make God a liar.

Yes, the Lord loves all kinds of people.

His love is not limited to race, social status, gender, age or religion.

But please remember the Scripture which reminds us that we are not naturally born into God’s blessed family, children whom He loves unconditionally.

Rather, we are born children of God’s wrath (Eph. 2:3) and must be adopted into His family through faith in Christ Jesus. (John 1:12).

Furthermore, the love of God does not abide on the unbeliever.

Rather, the wrath of God abideth on the unbeliever. (John 3:36).

The Great Commission is not a lie.

Only God knows to whom He will show mercy and compassion. If Saul the Christian-killer can be saved there is hope for even the most vile sinner. Therefore, we are to preach the Gospel to every creature.

The second great commandment is only a lie if you tell the unbelieving sinner that God loves him in his unbelief.

John 3:16 tells of God’s worldwide love for both believing Jew and Gentile (whosoever believeth). It also speaks to justification by faith alone in Christ alone.

Luke 15:7 tells of God’s love for all repentant sinners, no matter who they are.

God’s love for the Elect is that which actually powerfully efficaciously saves His people. (Matt. 1:21). Note the emphatic “he shall save His people from their sins.”

Who are His people?

They are those who love God. (Romans 8:28)

And why do they love God?

Because God loved them first. (1 John 4:10; 4:19).

Please consider the fact that God is not under any obligation or debt to love or save one person. (Romans 11:35).

For all persons are naturally at enmity with God and cannot please God. (Romans 8:7-8).

All persons deserve (earn) God’s justice, not His love.

That God has chosen to love and graciously save some does not make Him evil for not loving and saving every man without exception. (Matt. 20:15-16).

Christ has propitiated the justice due all God’s Elect.(Romans 5:8).

Had Christ not died a penal substitutionary death on behalf of the Elect, no one could be saved.

However, because God’s immutable justice was satisfied through Christ’s active and passive obedience, God was now able (without denying His justice and holiness) to reconcile sinners to Him forever.

I hope this helps explain a few fundamental Bible truths essential to understanding our salvation.

....truths which our Lord wills us to know what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, as well as his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) and hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.

 

[Iconoclast]

Yes, the Lord loves all kinds of people.

His love is not limited to race, social status, gender, age or religion.

But please remember the Scripture which reminds us that we are not naturally born into God’s blessed family, children whom He loves unconditionally.

Rather, we are born children of God’s wrath (Eph. 2:3) and must be adopted into His family through faith in Christ Jesus. (John 1:12).

Furthermore, the love of God does not abide on the unbeliever.

Rather, the wrath of God abideth on the unbeliever. (John 3:36).

The Great Commission is not a lie.
Only God knows to whom He will show mercy and compassion. If Saul the Christian-killer can be saved there is hope for even the most vile sinner. Therefore, we are to preach the Gospel to every creature.

The second great commandment is only a lie if you tell the unbelieving sinner that God loves him in his unbelief.

John 3:16 tells of God’s worldwide love for both believing Jew and Gentile (whosoever believeth). It also speaks to justification by faith alone in Christ alone.

Luke 15:7 tells of God’s love for all repentant sinners, no matter who they are.

God’s love for the Elect is that which actually powerfully efficaciously saves His people. (Matt. 1:21). Note the emphatic “he shall save His people from their sins.”

Who are His people?

They are those who love God. (Romans 8:28)

And why do they love God?

Because God loved them first. (1 John 4:10; 4:19).

Please consider the fact that God is not under any obligation or debt to love or save one person. (Romans 11:35).

For all persons are naturally at enmity with God and cannot please God. (Romans 8:7-8).

All persons deserve (earn) God’s justice, not His love.

That God has chosen to love and graciously save some does not make Him evil for not loving and saving every man without exception. (Matt. 20:15-16).

Christ has propitiated the justice due all God’s Elect.(Romans 5:8).

Had Christ not died a penal substitutionary death on behalf of the Elect, no one could be saved.

However, because God’s immutable justice was satisfied through Christ’s active and passive obedience, God was now able (without denying His justice and holiness) to reconcile sinners to Him forever.

I hope this helps explain a few fundamental Bible truths essential to understanding our salvation.

....truths which our Lord wills us to know what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, as well as his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) and hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.

Thank you protestant for this fine post....you saved me much typing and have furthered the discussion:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[savedbymercy]

Yes, the Lord loves all kinds of people.

His love is not limited to race, social status, gender, age or religion.

But please remember the Scripture which reminds us that we are not naturally born into God’s blessed family, children whom He loves unconditionally.

Rather, we are born children of God’s wrath (Eph. 2:3) and must be adopted into His family through faith in Christ Jesus. (John 1:12).

Furthermore, the love of God does not abide on the unbeliever.

Rather, the wrath of God abideth on the unbeliever. (John 3:36).

The Great Commission is not a lie.

Only God knows to whom He will show mercy and compassion. If Saul the Christian-killer can be saved there is hope for even the most vile sinner. Therefore, we are to preach the Gospel to every creature.

The second great commandment is only a lie if you tell the unbelieving sinner that God loves him in his unbelief.

John 3:16 tells of God’s worldwide love for both believing Jew and Gentile (whosoever believeth). It also speaks to justification by faith alone in Christ alone.

Luke 15:7 tells of God’s love for all repentant sinners, no matter who they are.

God’s love for the Elect is that which actually powerfully efficaciously saves His people. (Matt. 1:21). Note the emphatic “he shall save His people from their sins.”

Who are His people?

They are those who love God. (Romans 8:28)

And why do they love God?

Because God loved them first. (1 John 4:10; 4:19).

Please consider the fact that God is not under any obligation or debt to love or save one person. (Romans 11:35).

For all persons are naturally at enmity with God and cannot please God. (Romans 8:7-8).

All persons deserve (earn) God’s justice, not His love.

That God has chosen to love and graciously save some does not make Him evil for not loving and saving every man without exception. (Matt. 20:15-16).

Christ has propitiated the justice due all God’s Elect.(Romans 5:8).

Had Christ not died a penal substitutionary death on behalf of the Elect, no one could be saved.

However, because God’s immutable justice was satisfied through Christ’s active and passive obedience, God was now able (without denying His justice and holiness) to reconcile sinners to Him forever.

I hope this helps explain a few fundamental Bible truths essential to understanding our salvation.

....truths which our Lord wills us to know what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, as well as his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) and hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.

None for whom Christ died are born under God's condemnation and wrath, even while they're unbelievers and enemies rejecting God, because even while they're enemies they were reconciled to God , not by anything they did or didn't do, but by the Death of God's Son Rom 5:10 so you are in grave error my friend when you say that those Christ died for are either condemned John 3:18 or under God's wrath John 3:36 !

 

[steaver]

Icon...Thank you protestant for this fine post....you saved me much typing and have furthered the discussion

None for whom Christ died are born under God's condemnation and wrath, even while they're unbelievers and enemies rejecting God, because even while they're enemies they were reconciled to God , not by anything they did or didn't do, but by the Death of God's Son Rom 5:10 so you are in grave error my friend when you say that those Christ died for are either condemned John 3:18 or under God's wrath John 3:36 !

You gotta love it!! One Divinely Enabled Cal telling another Divinely Enabled Cal they are in grave error! "We believe what we believe because God opened our eyes to the truths of Calvinism". Now why has God opened you guy's eyes to opposing truths??

 

[OldRegular]

None for whom Christ died are born under God's condemnation and wrath, even while they're unbelievers and enemies rejecting God, because even while they're enemies they were reconciled to God , not by anything they did or didn't do, but by the Death of God's Son Rom 5:10 so you are in grave error my friend when you say that those Christ died for are either condemned John 3:18 or under God's wrath John 3:36 !

You are ignoring Scripture!

Ephesians 2:1-3
1. And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2. Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3. Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

2 Corinthians 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ’s stead, be ye reconciled to God.

 

[OldRegular]

You gotta love it!! One Divinely Enabled Cal telling another Divinely Enabled Cal they are in grave error!

steaver,

The above statement shows just how utterly ignorant of the Biblical Doctrines of Sovereign Election and Grace, what some call by the "nickname" Calvinism!

 

[steaver]

steaver,

The above statement shows just how utterly ignorant of the Biblical Doctrines of Sovereign Election and Grace, what some call by the "nickname" Calvinism!

Yes brother, and this from a man who doesn't understand he is a Calvinist :smilewinkgrin:

Oh, and let me remind everyone for the umpteenth time, not one, no not one, post pointing out which part of my sermon contains a dishonest statement and why.....but I have no understanding :smilewinkgrin:

 

[OldRegular]

Oh, and let me remind everyone for the umpteenth time, not one, no not one, post pointing out which part of my sermon contains a dishonest statement and why.....but I have no understanding :smilewinkgrin:

Wrong as usual steaver. In my post #4 I said your OP was malarky. I should have called it Bull Dung. Then I showed you Scripture defining the Gospel.

 

[OldRegular]

Does anyone else here find it strange that Calvinist spend so much time and effort avoiding the honest conclusions of their own TULIP?

If TULIP is the Gospel, the Calvinist have no other choice but to believe those who do not believe it is the Gospel are following a false gospel and thus must be unsaved. But they squirm and struggle with accepting the reality of their own belief system.

And if it's not the Gospel, then what is it??

I don't think a Calvinist could explain what it is apart from believing it is the very Gospel of God, Divine Revelation, when God Himself via the Holy Spirit causes them to see that it is indeed the Gospel.

To do so would under-mind the very doctrine they believe in. They have no choice but to believe it is the very Gospel because the teaching of the doctrine itself declares that one cannot believe anything apart from God making them believe it.

The Calvinist is stuck is he not? Can a Calvinist declare TULIP is not the Gospel? Can a Calvinist declare TULIP does not come from any Divine revelation?

Again, if TULIP is not the Gospel, then what is it? According to a Calvinist that is, only a Calvinist can answer this question. Is it the Gospel, or is it something else, and if so what is it? And if it is the Gospel, how can one reject TULIP and still be saved?

Can you name those Calvinists who claim that TULIP is the Gospel. If you cannot then my assessment of the OP in the preceding post, is correct.

 

[steaver]

can you name those calvinists who claim that tulip is the gospel. If you cannot then my assessment of the op in the preceding post, is correct.

sbm........