If Texas secedes, would others follow suit?

[righteousdude2]

First of all, I am not saying Texas will, in fact secede from the US. But, if they did and were successful at it, would others follow their lead? And which states do you feel are more likely to jump ship?

And if Texas and others did remove themselves from this sinking democracy, do you think they might for a country and ban together?

My thoughts are, should Texas make it on their own, others would follow, and in order to be stronger, I think they just might join with each other. The rebel flag may well fly again over the nation of seceded states! Yahoo! :thumbsup:

So, what do you think?

 

[wpe3bql]

Don't know if TX will or not, but it's interesting to recall that the 11th POTUS (& the 2d of the 3 POTUS's that TN gave to the USA), James K. Polk [The first "dark horse" candidate to actually win the POTUS's office] campaigned heavily on his so-called "re-annexation of TX" [TX at that time was technically considered as a "republic."] among other Manifest Destiny slogans.

Mr. Polk was POTUS, 1845-1849. He died in June, 1849, a few months after leaving office.

 

[TCassidy]

There are large secessionist movements in Oklahoma, Colorado, Arizona, and northern California. It is possible that all or some would join Texas in seceding from the Union.

 

[Alcott]

There are large secessionist movements in Oklahoma, Colorado, Arizona, and northern California. It is possible that all or some would join Texas in seceding from the Union.

Much of that vast land came to the USA through the Mexican Cession, when 'we' forced Mexico to give it up after the war in the 1840's, which proved to be a catalyst in accelerating the slavery debate as to whether states can choose for themselves to allow it.

But I think it's a valid question: would Mexico reclaim its lost lands if they seceded from the USA? That, like secession, is not a seriously-considered dilemma right now. But if we are going to discuss one, I think the other is jsut as valid.

 

[Salty]

Proposals of new States

 

[Zaac]

First of all, I am not saying Texas will, in fact secede from the US. But, if they did and were successful at it, would others follow their lead? And which states do you feel are more likely to jump ship?

And if Texas and others did remove themselves from this sinking democracy, do you think they might for a country and ban together?

My thoughts are, should Texas make it on their own, others would follow, and in order to be stronger, I think they just might join with each other. The rebel flag may well fly again over the nation of seceded states! Yahoo! :thumbsup:

So, what do you think?

It would be illegal for Texas to attempt to secede from the United States. It is a state in the United States...a UNION of states. When it joined the Union it ceded its right to unilaterally secede. The land belongs to the United States of America, not to Texas.

If the rest of the union decided to get rid of Texas they could. But Texas can't take US land and secede.

 

[TCassidy]

It would be illegal for Texas to attempt to secede from the United States. It is a state in the United States...a UNION of states. When it joined the Union it ceded its right to unilaterally secede. The land belongs to the United States of America, not to Texas.

If the rest of the union decided to get rid of Texas they could. But Texas can't take US land and secede.

Wrongo! Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the united States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other "free and independent State") from the United States. Joining the "Union" was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government "experts"—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that "All political power is inherent in the people ... they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

Likewise, each of the united States is "united" with the others explicitly on the principle that "governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed" and "whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends [i.e., protecting life, liberty, and property], it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government" and "when a long train of abuses and usurpations...evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security."

 

[Revmitchell]

If anyone has ever read the Declaration of Independence they would know that secession is possible.

 

[Zaac]

Wrongo! Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the united States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other "free and independent State") from the United States. Joining the "Union" was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government "experts"—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

It doesn't have to include that explicitly or implicitly. Upon joining the United States, the land called Texas became the property of these United States. That's why they can take it if they choose to do whatever the heck they want.

It may have been voluntary for the citizens of Texas to say they wanted to enter the Union, but they had no say so in the acceptance. Texas is a state because the Congress of the United States passed bills making them a state.

As the Pledge states, we are indivisible. You gave up your right to secede when you became part of the nation. The only way to undo such a bond is to undo the Constitution and dissolve the United States. And I would like to see Texas try that act of war.

The only option Texas has is to remain one of the 50. So get as cocky as yall like, the land upon which you sit is CONTRACTUALLY part of the UNITED STATES. Sovereign or not, you can't just break the contract without the consent of the other 49 parties.

Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that "All political power is inherent in the people ... they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

Likewise, each of the united States is "united" with the others explicitly on the principle that "governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed" and "whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends [i.e., protecting life, liberty, and property], it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government" and "when a long train of abuses and usurpations...evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security."

Still leaves secession as a virtual impossibility without the consent of the other states.

 

[Zaac]

If anyone has ever read the Declaration of Independence they would know that secession is possible.

If anyone has ever read history, they will know that the laws of this country aren't based upon the Declaration but on the Constitution.

If anyone has ever read history they would know that no one said it was impossible. It's been tried before and failed. You remember that whole Civil War thingy, dontcha?

Indivisible. If you want to secede, you'll secede without the land that's part of the United States.

Besides, all we have to do to shut Texans up is tell them that secession leaves Texas and Texas A&M and Baylor and TCU and Texas Tech and the University of Houston OUT of the NCAA and that means no college football, and all talk of seceding will disappear like a vapor along with the politicians who dared to even suggest such a thing.

 

[targus]

Zaac and his talking hat.

 

[Alcott]

Besides, all we have to do to shut Texans up is tell them that secession leaves Texas and Texas A&M and Baylor and TCU and Texas Tech and the University of Houston OUT of the NCAA and that means no college football, and all talk of seceding will disappear like a vapor along with the politicians who dared to even suggest such a thing.

:laugh: That would only intensify the rivalries. Ask OU supporters if they would shut down the Red River Shootout if such happened. Oklahoma would probably choose to join us.

 

[TCassidy]

Zaac and his talking hat.

Yes, once again Zaac shows his absolute inability to engage in critical reasoning. He was given the facts and just ignored them. He was shown that the Constitution makes no mention of secession, but does tells us that we have the right to change our government and that all such actions are in the hands of the people. If the people of Texas decide to secede, the rest of the country has nothing to say about it. In this country, the PEOPLE are sovereign, not Congress, not the President, not the government. The PEOPLE. Zaac is apparently not aware of that little factoid.

 

[carpro]

Yes, once again Zaac shows his absolute inability to engage in critical reasoning. He was given the facts and just ignored them. He was shown that the Constitution makes no mention of secession, but does tells us that we have the right to change our government and that all such actions are in the hands of the people. If the people of Texas decide to secede, the rest of the country has nothing to say about it. In this country, the PEOPLE are sovereign, not Congress, not the President, not the government. The PEOPLE. Zaac is apparently not aware of that little factoid.

Zaac has never been interested in facts...on any subject.

But he's certainly got his ignorance on display here. He needs to stick to race issues where canned rhetoric is furnished for him to use.

 

[InTheLight]

Sounds like TCassidy and Carpro have been reading the Texas secessionist propaganda.

 

[carpro]

Sounds like TCassidy and Carpro have been reading the Texas secessionist propaganda.

You really should be more original instead of spamming different threads with the same words.

Getting lazy?

 

[Zaac]

Sounds like TCassidy and Carpro have been reading the Texas secessionist propaganda.

Pretty much. Every year or two, Texans get to smelling themselves and think that they are something that they are not.

Texas exports and does business abroad because it is a part of the United States. Take away the United States, and Texas becomes a southern version of Canada that we completely shut down.

When Texas joined the Union, they were agreeing to governance by the Union. The people of Texas can't just have land that is part of the United States. They don't get to secede without the approval of the other 49.

And why should the other 49 states give up the resources of that land just because a handful of Texans don't like Obama?

We will run them down to Mexico with their tails between their legs before they subtract that land from the United States.

 

[Doubting Thomas]

Wrongo! Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the united States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other "free and independent State") from the United States. Joining the "Union" was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government "experts"—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that "All political power is inherent in the people ... they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

Likewise, each of the united States is "united" with the others explicitly on the principle that "governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed" and "whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends [i.e., protecting life, liberty, and property], it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government" and "when a long train of abuses and usurpations...evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security."

Good post :thumbs:

All this discussion is pretty much just academic, as there is not a huge numerical push for Texas (or any other state for that matter) to secede currently. However, if more and more folks thinks believe that the federal govt is erodoing their rights, and they believe the current political system offers any true recourse, then many more might start considering secession as an option. If things really start going south (no pun intended) then it may be various state and local governments that will pick up the pieces when the dust clears.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

First of all, I am not saying Texas will, in fact secede from the US. But, if they did and were successful at it, would others follow their lead? And which states do you feel are more likely to jump ship?

And if Texas and others did remove themselves from this sinking democracy, do you think they might for a country and ban together?

My thoughts are, should Texas make it on their own, others would follow, and in order to be stronger, I think they just might join with each other. The rebel flag may well fly again over the nation of seceded states! Yahoo! :thumbsup:

So, what do you think?

Most people believe that if Texas got off this sinking ship, Oklahoma would go with them. Hopefully, Alabama would, too.

 

[Use of Time]

Take Florida with you too.