If the United States Is Going to War With Venezuela...

[KenH]

The first military action taken without declaring war was in 1798 by President Adams

Reminds me of the Israelites after they left Egypt - it didn't take long for them to start bellyaching and complaining. Fallen man is the same today as in the late 1700s as in the book of Exodus as in the book of Genesis - failing to live up to even the most basic standards of conduct.

 

[KenH]

BUT it does not State that Congress MUST declare war!

That is not the only mistake they made in writing the Constitution. For instance, another one is that the preamble starts "We the People", but it should have started "We the States". It was the States who created the federal government.

Folks like Patrick Henry and other anti-federalists have been proven correct in arguing against leaving the Articles of Confederation of 1781 and adopting a new Constitution.

 

[Charlie24]

Concerns over a president getting the United States involved in a war outside of the constraints of the Constitution did not start when Donald Trump became president.



That is a horrible position for the United States to be in. The framers of the Constitution did not make provision for political parties in the construction of the Constitution, much less expecting political parties to be a check on the exercise of power by the executive branch(that was to be accomplished by each of the three branches fighting to keep the other branches out of their business); a problem which has become much worse during the 21st century when a political party of the same party as the president has control of the Congress, as then the Congress pretty much is just a rubber stamp for the president.

Well, Ken, sounds like you need to run for Congress and fix all these problems being that you're so worried about it.

Me, I cast my vote and render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's.

 

[Salty]

That is not the only mistake they made in writing the Constitution. For instance, another one is that the preamble starts "We the People", but it should have started "We the States". It was the States who created the federal government.

Folks like Patrick Henry and other anti-federalists have been proven correct in arguing against leaving the Articles of Confederation of 1781 and adopting a new Constitution.

Why replace the Articles of Confederation

 

[KenH]

Well, Ken, sounds like you need to run for Congress and fix all these problems

Already did, back in 2014. I was the Libertarian Party congressional candidate for the fourth district of Arkansas. The highlight of my campaign was participating in a debate that was televised statewide.

 

[KenH]

Why replace the Articles of Confederation

Liberty or Empire? Reconsidering the Articles of Confederation - Front Porch Republic

The Articles of Confederation undoubtedly had their problems. But the spirit of concurrence they embodied is worth celebrating. To revitalize American public life, we should revisit this period in our nation’s history and pay careful attention to its lessons.

www.frontporchrepublic.com

 

[Charlie24]

Already did, back in 2014. I was the Libertarian Party congressional candidate for the fourth district of Arkansas. The highlight of my campaign was participating in a debate that was televised statewide.

View attachment 13007

Would you say from that experience that politics is a dirty business, or did you see it another way?

 

[KenH]

Would you say from that experience that politics is a dirty business, or did you see it another way?

It wasn't in my case, as all three of us were quite cordial with each. There was nothing even approaching a personal attack during the one hour debate; we all stuck to discussing the issues. The statewide newspaper, the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette, even wrote an editorial about how our debate was a model as to how political debate should be handled in the United States.

It was shown live and then re-aired. It was kind of shocking to be flipping through the TV channels on a Sunday afternoon and suddenly seeing my own mug on the TV.

I have a DVD of the debate, so I got it out and watched it about a year ago. After watching again ten years later, it was interesting how the things I was saying back then, I am still saying today, which shouldn't be surprising as my philosophy of government would be the same regardless of the issues of the day. It was eye-opening when I realized that the U.S. national debt in 2024 was twice as much as it was when I talked about it in the debate.

Had some other media appearances on radio - on a local station, one in Fort Smith, and one on a national show on a radio station in Atlanta that someone I had become friends with hosted. I also had a couple of other joint appearances with my Republican and Democratic competitors in Hot Springs during the campaign.

Being rather introverted, it was quite an interesting experience, but not one I would want to repeat.

 

[Van]

"Since the War Powers Resolution of 1973, sitting Presidents have submitted over 132 reports to Congress. These include the airlift and evacuation operations carried out in Cambodia(1975), committing forces to Beirut, Lebanon (1982/83), the Persian Gulf War (1991), and beyond. Challenges to the resolution include Ronald Reagan's deployment of troops to El Salvador in 1981, the continued bombing of Kosovo during Bill Clinton's administration in 1999, and military action initiated against Libya by Barack Obama in 2011." [from the internet]

Basically, it appears "challenges" to Presidential unilateral military actions occur when the party other than the President's party has control of a house of congress. Like the "debt limit" the resolution or act is used for political purpose and does not make America great.

 

[Reynolds]

Article I - Section 8 - "The Congress shall have Power to,.." "...to declare war..."
Note: it says Congress has the power to declare war
BUT it does not State that Congress MUST declare war!

Is this a "loophole" maybe - but as kyredneck stated "it's brevity leaves it wide open to interpretation."

When is last time we fought a declared war? Might surprise quite a few.

 

[Salty]

When is last time we fought a declared war? Might surprise quite a few.

WW II

 

[Salty]

When is last time we fought a declared war? Might surprise quite a few.

The last declaration of War was on 4 Jun 1942 with of vote of 73-0 in the Senate and 361-0 in the House.
This declaration was against Romania
In 1942, there were 96 Senators and 434 House members

 

[kyredneck]

Concerns over a president getting the United States involved in a war outside of the constraints of the Constitution did not start when Donald Trump became president.



That is a horrible position for the United States to be in. The framers of the Constitution did not make provision for political parties in the construction of the Constitution, much less expecting political parties to be a check on the exercise of power by the executive branch(that was to be accomplished by each of the three branches fighting to keep the other branches out of their business); a problem which has become much worse during the 21st century when a political party of the same party as the president has control of the Congress, as then the Congress pretty much is just a rubber stamp for the president.

Ben Franklin: "a republic if you can keep it"

 

[Salty]

How often does the US see a unified government?​

According to data collected by the Office of the Historian and the Clerk of the House’s Office of Art and Archives, the U.S. government has been unified 48 times since 1857 — 23 times under Democrats and 25 under Republicans.

Throughout that time, the government was divided only 38 times. This means that a majority of elected governments have been unified since the advent of the modern party system.

Here is the link:

 

[KenH]

“The state therefore has two natural functions, functions essential to the existence of any peaceful, ordered society: to protect the rights of citizens against violent or fraudulent assault, and to judge in conflicts of right with right. It has a further third function, which is another aspect of the first, that is, to protect its citizens from assault by foreign powers. These three functions are expressed by three powers: the police power, which protects the citizen against domestic violence; the military power, which protects the citizen against violence from abroad; and the courts of law, which judge between rights and rights, as well as sharing with the police power the protection of the citizen against domestic violence.
…
But since this institution must possess a monopoly of legal physical force, to give to it in addition any further power is fraught with danger; that monopoly gives to the state so much power that its natural functions should be its maximum functions.”

- Frank S. Meyer, "In Defense of Freedom: A Conservative Credo", published in 1962

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"If you analyze it I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."

- Ronald Reagan, interview in Reason magazine, July 1975

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“I can find no warrant for such an appropriation in the Constitution, and I do not believe that the power and duty of the General Government ought to be extended to the relief of individual suffering which is in no manner properly related to the public service or benefit. A prevalent tendency to disregard the limited mission of this power and duty should, I think, be steadfastly resisted, to the end that the lesson should be constantly enforced that though the people support the Government the Government should not support the people.”

- President Grover Cleveland, veto of Texas Seed Bill in 1887