If you are not a Calvinist or an Arminian ...

[Ray Berrian]

Ken Hamilton,

What was the purpose of the rite of circumcision?

You question was a very good one. I have not fully decided in my own mine as to whether every person circumcised as an Israelite was finally saved. I have never heard anyone go into this deep meaning and truth.

 

[pinoybaptist]

Originally posted by Baptist Believer:
&lt;snip&gt; </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Nonsense. Salvation does not depend upon “proper” doctrine. Like many other things in life, “it’s not what you know, but WHO you know.”

</font>[/QUOTE]

No. In salvation, it is different from life. In salvation, it is not who you know, but who knows you.

You really need to bone up on the Scriptures (John 3, Ephesians 2:8-10, and all the other teachings of Jesus) before you declare that someone is not in the Kingdom!

Yet, Jesus also taught that in "that day many shall come to me and say, 'Lord have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name cast out demons ? ....and I shall say unto them, "....I never knew you"..'.

 

[Eric B]

"Knowing" goes both ways; referring to an intimate relationship. If a person does not know Jesus as Lord and Savior, then it's not that Jesus doesn't know who he is; it's that He doesn't know them in a saving relationship. In the context, the reason He doesn't know them is because they are "workers of iniquity"; not they are workers of iniquity because He didn't know them.

 

[pinoybaptist]

Originally posted by Eric B:
"Knowing" goes both ways; referring to an intimate relationship. If a person does not know Jesus as Lord and Savior, then it's not that Jesus doesn't know who he is; it's that He doesn't know them in a saving relationship. In the context, the reason He doesn't know them is because they are "workers of iniquity"; not they are workers of iniquity because He didn't know them.

And what are works of iniquity ? Who are workers of iniquity ? When is one not a worker of iniquity ?

 

[pinoybaptist]

Sorry about this p.s., Eric B. My pointer was resting on the "add reply" button and my wife accidentally leaned on the mouse.
To continue the questions:
The context also includes the fact that these "workers of iniquity" were preaching and healing and casting out demons in Jesus' Name and that this event was future, not at that present time.
So, don't tell me "workers of iniquity" refer to those who are adulterous, prostitutes, gamblers, drunks, brawlers, and such.
Apparently, one cannot preach in Jesus' Name without in one way or another extolling Him or lifting Him up, and yet, Jesus says He never knew them.

 

[Eric B]

A person can "extol" Jesus and even do things in His name without having an saving knowledge of Him. Like the Jews who "believed on Him" for political reasons, and who turned away when He didn't do what they expected. Still in their sins, they are "workers of iniquity". The only future thing is "that day", which refers to the judgment (when they actually enter the Kingdom of Heaven-- and this according to pre-millennial belief. No time to get into debate as to whether "Kingdom" is the Church or whether this implies judgment of righteous and unrighteous is at the same time). If they didn't "know" Him that way, they He didn't "know" them that way either.

[ August 11, 2002, 05:52 PM: Message edited by: Eric B ]

 

[Ray Berrian]

Eric,

Your post dated August 11---5:52 was interesting. I especially liked your first sentence. A lot of people extol Him and work under His Name without knowing Him personally and intimately. This helps explain Matt. 7:22-23. Can you imagine, some will have been pastors and elders who thought they were among the elect, but in fact did not know Him through receiving His Son. He obviously is more than doctrine.