IF Your Baptist Group Approved Alternate Lifestyles, Would You Depart?

[jbh28]

That's the difficulty I have with Andy Stanley -- inviting them to worship with them. Real worship is with and among the redeemed. I kind of get his point in a sense, invite them in to hear the Gospel perhaps -- but to make it that they are there to worship as well, then there is the problem. The unrepentant cannot worship in spirit and in truth, no matter what they say they 'feel' when they do it -- Satan is deceptive and can grant feelings and emotionalism.

I would leave any church that accepts this lifestyle.

well said :thumbs::thumbs:

 

[Steadfast Fred]

In accordance with God's word, you tell a lie and you've broken the same law as the homosexual offender.

Do you consider yourself a Christian because we all know that you have told a lie?

Zaac,

No matter how hard you try, you'll never get a homosexual into heaven...or get him out of the lake of fire for that matter.

Now, you could reveal Christ to him in the Scripture, bringing him to a saving faith in Christ. But once he comes to Christ, he is a new creature. The old is gone. He would no longer be a homosexual...if he were saved.

Then, he would escape the lake of fire.

Instead of trying to justify his sin by pointing fingers at others, believe what the Bible says about those that practice that sin.

 

[Zaac]

Zaac,

No matter how hard you try, you'll never get a homosexual into heaven...or get him out of the lake of fire for that matter.

I can't get anybody into heaven. What I can do is love them and show them that ALL have sinned and fallen short of God's glory and that their sin is no worse than yours or mine.

Now, you could reveal Christ to him in the Scripture, bringing him to a saving faith in Christ. But once he comes to Christ, he is a new creature. The old is gone. He would no longer be a homosexual...if he were saved.

He may no longer be a homosexual, but that doesn't automatically stop the homosexual acts any more than getting saved will automatically stop a drug addict from still using.

Then, he would escape the lake of fire.

Instead of trying to justify his sin by pointing fingers at others, believe what the Bible says about those that practice that sin.

Instead of attempting to elevate yourself by making someone else's sin worse than your own, try telling Him that Scripture says 10 A person who follows all of God’s law but fails to obey even one command is guilty of breaking all the commands in that law. James 2:10

According to Scripture YOU are just as guilty of the homosexual offense as is the homosexual offender. Humble yourself and tell him THAT.

That's why ALL are in need of a Savior and why committing one trespass makes ALL unworthy.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Ahomosexual that is saved will no longer be a homosexual. He will not continue in his old lifestyle. Old gone, new habits.

You can say all you want that he will continue in his old sin, but you are wrong.

 

[quantumfaith]

Actually, Scripture calls all the following abominations:
1. A proud look
2. A lying tongue
3. Hands that shed innocent blood
4. A heart that devises wicked ideas
5. Feet that are swift in running to mischief
6. A false witness that speaks lies.
7. Those who sow discord among brethren.
8. All who are disobedient to God.
9. false measures used for deciet.
10. idolatry
etc...

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[quantumfaith]

Ahomosexual that is saved will no longer be a homosexual. He will not continue in his old lifestyle. Old gone, new habits.

You can say all you want that he will continue in his old sin, but you are wrong.

Steadfast, you as a believer even now do not struggle with sins in your life? I would venture to guess that YES you do. Does that mean that you are unrepentant? The ONLY one who can see another's heart is our maker. Not you, not me.

 

[quantumfaith]

I can't get anybody into heaven. What I can do is love them and show them that ALL have sinned and fallen short of God's glory and that their sin is no worse than yours or mine.



He may no longer be a homosexual, but that doesn't automatically stop the homosexual acts any more than getting saved will automatically stop a drug addict from still using.



Instead of attempting to elevate yourself by making someone else's sin worse than your own, try telling Him that Scripture says 10 A person who follows all of God’s law but fails to obey even one command is guilty of breaking all the commands in that law. James 2:10

According to Scripture YOU are just as guilty of the homosexual offense as is the homosexual offender. Humble yourself and tell him THAT.

That's why ALL are in need of a Savior and why committing one trespass makes ALL unworthy.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Wonder why that it?

Paul could obviously tell when one was "in the faith" and when one was not.

Sure, Paul was an Apostle. But what he wrote implied that one could know who was and was not saved. John did as well.

 

[Zaac]

Wonder why that it?

Paul could obviously tell when one was "in the faith" and when one was not.

Sure, Paul was an Apostle. But what he wrote implied that one could know who was and was not saved. John did as well.

I ASSUME that every person with whom I speak, in church and out, are unsaved.

They are all loved with the love of Christ and receive the same Gospel, BIBLICAL truth.

You commit the same sin for which you point the finger.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Luke 6:44 (KJV)
For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

 

[Zaac]

Luke 6:44 (KJV)
For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2 If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3 And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body [a]to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing. 1 Cor. 13:1-3

What good does it do to point out fruit or lack thereof if your speech is absent love and all they hear is "your sin is worse than mine" or "your sin is the worst of the worst"?

Scripture also tells us to examine ourselves . 5 Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you—unless indeed you [e]fail the test? 2 Cor. 13:5

In accordance with Scripture, we're guilty of breaking the same laws.

But by God's grace we have been saved. How about a little humility from the Church in pointing others toward Him and His grace?

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Homosexuality is an abominable act/lifestyle.

Is it a worse abomination that lying or adultery or theft or murder?

One cannot be a homosexual and a Christian at the same time.

One cannot persist in sin and have fellowship with God. That is the more accurate statement. One can be a Christian and still live in persistent sin. Christians compartmentalize their lives and give themselves permission to commit all kinds of sin, not just homosexual acts. I find it ironic that we label one who engages in such acts as "homosexual" for the purpose of setting him apart from us. We do not automatically label alcoholics, domestic abusers, adulterers, etc., with a special label that we then say prevents them from "being Christian." We offer them help and counsel and attempt to restore them.

That is all I'm saying we must do for the homosexual as well. In an earlier post, I pointed out that our church accepts them into services for the purpose of restoring them. That is the ministry of the church. No sin is beyond forgiveness, and no sin is so wicked that we should refuse to minister to the sinner. Many people cannot deal with alcoholics or drug addicts, but they don't vilify them as we tend to vilify those in the LGBT community. When they come to church, they should be welcomed and made to feel loved, just as the rest of us sinning Christians welcome one another on Sunday morning.

 

[Zaac]

Is it a worse abomination that lying or adultery or theft or murder?

One cannot persist in sin and have fellowship with God. That is the more accurate statement. One can be a Christian and still live in persistent sin. Christians compartmentalize their lives and give themselves permission to commit all kinds of sin, not just homosexual acts. I find it ironic that we label one who engages in such acts as "homosexual" for the purpose of setting him apart from us. We do not automatically label alcoholics, domestic abusers, adulterers, etc., with a special label that we then say prevents them from "being Christian." We offer them help and counsel and attempt to restore them.

Precisely.

That is all I'm saying we must do for the homosexual as well. In an earlier post, I pointed out that our church accepts them into services for the purpose of restoring them. That is the ministry of the church. No sin is beyond forgiveness, and no sin is so wicked that we should refuse to minister to the sinner. Many people cannot deal with alcoholics or drug addicts, but they don't vilify them as we tend to vilify those in the LGBT community. When they come to church, they should be welcomed and made to feel loved, just as the rest of us sinning Christians welcome one another on Sunday morning.

And that's the crux right there. God's people should be known for their love and not for their constant vilifying of someone else's sin.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Precisely.



And that's the crux right there. God's people should be known for their love and not for their constant vilifying of someone else's sin.

You can choose not to tell them their sin is an abomination in God's eyes if you want. Hold hands with them and sing Kum ba ya.

I will continue to tell them that their homosexual sin is an abomination in God's eyes andhtat all that are abominable will have their part in the lake of fire.

 

[quantumfaith]

Is it a worse abomination that lying or adultery or theft or murder?

One cannot persist in sin and have fellowship with God. That is the more accurate statement. One can be a Christian and still live in persistent sin. Christians compartmentalize their lives and give themselves permission to commit all kinds of sin, not just homosexual acts. I find it ironic that we label one who engages in such acts as "homosexual" for the purpose of setting him apart from us. We do not automatically label alcoholics, domestic abusers, adulterers, etc., with a special label that we then say prevents them from "being Christian." We offer them help and counsel and attempt to restore them.

That is all I'm saying we must do for the homosexual as well. In an earlier post, I pointed out that our church accepts them into services for the purpose of restoring them. That is the ministry of the church. No sin is beyond forgiveness, and no sin is so wicked that we should refuse to minister to the sinner. Many people cannot deal with alcoholics or drug addicts, but they don't vilify them as we tend to vilify those in the LGBT community. When they come to church, they should be welcomed and made to feel loved, just as the rest of us sinning Christians welcome one another on Sunday morning.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[quantumfaith]

Truth without love leads to legalism......hmmm, I have read that somewhere before.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Truth without love leads to legalism......hmmm, I have read that somewhere before.

Love is warning them that they cannot remain a homosexual and think they are going to escape hell.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Love is warning them that they cannot remain a homosexual and think they are going to escape hell.

By this statement you are saying that a believer who cannot escape the sin of homosexual behavior is doomed. You can't know that, and have no right to make such a pronouncement. God does not say it in His word. God calls the SIN an abomination, not the sinner.

No sin is sufficient to separate a believer from relationship, though it does fracture fellowship. Since you can't see into his/her heart, you are unqualified to say anyone in such sin, no matter what it is, is not a believer, and certainly his/her sin does not negate his/her faith, anymore than the other types of sin I listed in the earlier post separate those who practice them from their faith. More importantly, no sin separates anyone from God, if they have truly claimed Him as their Savior and Lord. To say otherwise contradicts the word of God.

 

[Zaac]

You can choose not to tell them their sin is an abomination in God's eyes if you want. Hold hands with them and sing Kum ba ya.

Why would I choose to tell them that their sin is anything less than what God says it is?

I will continue to tell them that their homosexual sin is an abomination in God's eyes andhtat all that are abominable will have their part in the lake of fire.

Then you likewise need to start telling them that Gods word says that you in your sin are guilty of committing the same homosexual offenses in His eyes that you point the finger at them for committing.:thumbs:

 

[Zaac]

Love is warning them that they cannot remain a homosexual and think they are going to escape hell.

Does your love do the same for the gossiper? The one with the lying tongue?the one with haughty eyes?the one who unrighteously judges?

Christians seem to be reluctant to admit that they even commit the same sins.

Love delivers itself in righteousness and humility, not in an air of your wrong is worse than mine.