Immersion

This is my last reply to this post. This has nothing to do with the Catholic Church. The whole purpose is to be faithful to God‘s word … not as un-Catholic as possible. The claim that baptism is merely a symbolic ritual, is simply not taught in scripture. Faith is what saves and faith is received by word and sacrament (and God’s word is attached to the sacraments). Baptism unites us to Christ (Rom 6:3-5) we do not see baptism and faith as being opposed to one another, just like we don’t see the word of God and faith as being opposed to one another. God’s word is connected to Holy baptism “by the washing of water with the word” (Eph 5:26), in baptism God makes promises and we believe them and we cling to them by faith.

We are baptized into Christ through the life giving waters of holy baptism.

1Pe 3:20 because they formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water.
1Pe 3:21 Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Does Holy baptism save? According to sacred scripture baptism now saves you. So the answer to that question is a obvious yes. All the baptismal passages talk about the cleansing, washing, renewal, rebirth, regeneration, forgiveness, receiveing…It’s all gift talk…Holy baptism is a gift that we receive promises and those promises are received by faith. It is an objective means of grace.

1. Jesus said that his church would stand and the gates of hell would not prevail again it (Matthew 16:18)
2. The Bible says the church is the pillar of truth (1 Timothy 3:15)
3. The entire church throughout history believed in baptismal regeneration and the only ones to deny baptismal efficacy were the anabaptists of the reformation who were largely heterodox or even Heretical (anti-Trinitarian) in their doctrines. All the church fathers (Irenaeus, who was discipled by Polycarp who was discipled by Apostle John) affirmed it. Every council that spoke of baptism affirmed it, and, what's more, a straightforward reading of the baptism passages also teaches baptismal regeneration.

So either Christ failed to keep his promise, or your view is not apostolic.

May God’s grace and peace be with you.

 

And so we disagree. You have articulated your position well and supported it with scripture and I appreciate that. Now, back to the OP.

Do you have any passages of scripture where “baptizmo” means anything other than immersion into water. Not your opinion, but what is actually stated in scripture

peace to you

 

Last post for real. The Orthodox Church considers, sprinkling and pouring valid* (your answer might very with Orthodox)… they do not consider full immersion absolutely necessary for a baptism to be valid. For example if Catholic became Orthodox, they would not have to be rebaptized. The normal mode of admission of holy baptism in the Orthodox Church is full immersion x3. Also, they would not consider a Baptist baptisms valid unless there were immersed three times.

 

It is simply untrue that Baptists believe baptism “means nothing”. They don’t believe it is necessary for salvation.

The question of the OP is what does the word baptism mean? In 1st century Kone Greek it means to immerse in water. That definition may have evolved to mean “apply water: by sprinkling, pouring or immersing”; but it means immerse in water when used in scripture.

peace to you

 

Ironically Baptist have a very low view of baptism. “It is just like a webbing ring” … “it is merely a symbol” (some try to make is more than a symbol but they still don’t see it as a means of grace)… “it is not salvic” … “baptism is not a means of grace” … “baptism is not necessary” … How about re-baptisms … which is sacrilegious (a sin) and you see it commonly in Baptist churches … not to mention many (not all) make a spectacle show out of Holy baptism with production style projector screens …etc. Orthodox, Catholics, Lutherans, Anglican, Presbyterians all have a much higher view of baptism then Baptist.

On a side note there is no “once saved always saved” so if you despise our baptism … you are going to hell.

Baptist: Can any of the Church Fathers be pastors at your church? Answer: no