Implications of Common Law Marriage

[annsni]

Can you show me in scripture one couple that was married in a church?

Since the church wasn't in existence for the vast majority of the Scriptures and when it was, we are not told of every practice of the church - because there were just common traditions and cultural norms at the time, they didn't go into details. Can you show me where a couple married outside of the cultural and religious norm of the time?

 

[Victorious]

I can show you in scripture examples of couples being married by no more than declaring their intentions and living together and raising children.

Can you show me in scripture one couple that was married in a church?

If you can't, how can you claim it is "more bible"?

peace to youraying:

Butting in here, sorry. Not recorded, but then, not all things were recorded. The issue of a reocgnized marriage is fully covered by scripture, however.

The post "Immorality in the Church" on the Pasotoral forum has also gone down this rabbit trail of common law marriage and here is what I posted there:

Yes, in some states it might be legal, but we also have more than civil legalities to consider. Again, whether the opposing team likes it or not, Romans 14 and 1st Corinthians 8 does address the biblical principle of the second greatest commandment.

So many of us today have failed to realize that along with the blessing of salvation, comes the responsibility of ambassadorship.

"...giving no cause for offense in anything, so that the ministry will not be discredited" (2 Corinthians 6:3 NASB)

When we are saved, we no longer serve ourselves, but God. How can we approve what the world snickers at lasciviously? How can we be examples for our children to live godly if we reject the "acceptable" and honorable way of a marriage union? The liberty we claim for ourselves could be the bondage we put others through. And I will continue to ask the question - what is the difference between fornication and what the world calls "shacking up?"

God's Kingdom is certainly not about us. Our lives should bring glory to God and not be a stumbling block to anyone. How can common law marriage edify?

 

[canadyjd]

What would be an affront to God in having a state marriage? I don't see one bit how this can be offensive to God.

This isn't about you. This is about Christians who see it differently than you.

Why are we condemning those Christians who do believe a "state marriage" is an affront to God, that they are biblically sound in their refusal to participate? They base their opinions on scriptural examples of marriage.

They want to live as God has ordained they live. No one has yet to show from scripture why they are wrong.

If you can't give them a sound, biblical argument for why they are wrong, then you have nothing but secular arguments.

How often can a true Christian be convinced to go against his/her conscience and conform to the culture and the world?

Why do other Christians demand they conform to the culture and the world, violating their understanding of scripture and their own conscience in the process.

peace to youraying:

 

[Marcia]

And yet, you make the assertion without showing scripture in context to support you claim that it is not backed up by the bible.
Or to violate our conscience. As you know, some things aren't mentioned in scripture where our conscience must guide us.1984 again and again.
You stated that it doesn't matter what Gen. 2 says....those who support homose*ual marriage agree with you and use the same argument.

I can't state it clearer.

peace to youraying:

Where does the Bible say we should not obey the government if it violates our conscience?

I'm still not getting the homose*ual argument yuou keep referring to. What is their argument that you keep using as some kind of refutation of what I'm saying? You've never expressed it.

I do not see what 1984 has to do with anything.

 

[canadyjd]

Since the church wasn't in existence for the vast majority of the Scriptures and when it was, we are not told of every practice of the church - because there were just common traditions and cultural norms at the time, they didn't go into details. Can you show me where a couple married outside of the cultural and religious norm of the time?

There are plenty of examples. Cain's son took two wives. He started a new tradition. Sodom had its own culture and traditions. David had many wives, even one that was already married. Solomon had 300 wives and 1000 concubines. There's a tradition for you. Moses allowed divorce (because of the hardness of their hearts) and started a new tradition. The Romans basically had a contractual system that could be dissolved rather easily.

The question is....do any of those cultural and religious tradition reflect God's intention for marriage as found in scripture?

If you can show me scripture to support the assertion that they do, I'll be happy to look at it.

peace to youraying:

 

[Victorious]

This isn't about you. This is about Christians who see it differently than you.

Why are we condemning those Christians who do believe a "state marriage" is an affront to God, that they are biblically sound in their refusal to participate? They base their opinions on scriptural examples of marriage.

They want to live as God has ordained they live. No one has yet to show from scripture why they are wrong.

If you can't give them a sound, biblical argument for why they are wrong, then you have nothing but secular arguments.

How often can a true Christian be convinced to go against his/her conscience and conform to the culture and the world?

Why do other Christians demand they conform to the culture and the world, violating their understanding of scripture and their own conscience in the process.

peace to youraying:

You have ignored the scripture I posted and the biblical principles that they imply. How do you interpret them?

"Romans 14 and 1st Corinthians 8 does address the biblical principle of the second greatest commandment.

So many of us today have failed to realize that along with the blessing of salvation, comes the responsibility of ambassadorship.

"...giving no cause for offense in anything, so that the ministry will not be discredited" (2 Corinthians 6:3 NASB)

 

[canadyjd]

...Yes, in some states it might be legal, but we also have more than civil legalities to consider. Again, whether the opposing team likes it or not, Romans 14 and 1st Corinthians 8 does address the biblical principle of the second greatest commandment..."...giving no cause for offense in anything, so that the ministry will not be discredited" (2 Corinthians 6:3 NASB)

My hypothetical couple is offended that you accept government recognized marriage. It is, based on their study of scripture, an affront to God.

In my hypothetical couple's mind, your acceptance of something so obviously polluted by the culture, and by your criticism of their attempt to follow the Word of God, you have become a stumbling block to them. You are giving offense.

In my hypothetical couple's mind, your witness of Christ is discredited because you are choosing to follow the world and the culture instead of following the Word of God, and in fact are attacking those who are following God's Word.

Therefore, according to the scripture you have quoted, you must renounce government sponsored marriage so as not to be a stumbling block to those you seem to consider to be weaker Christians.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

Where does the Bible say we should not obey the government if it violates our conscience?

Acts 5:29 "But Peter and the apostles answered and said, 'We must obey God rather than men.'"

peace to youraying:

 

[Victorious]

You are assuming to speak for God when you tell us what God will recognize as marriage without backing it up with scripture. If you can back it up with scripture, then God has spoken for Himself, through His Word.Same as scripture. "For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife and the two shall become one flesh." Gen. 2 or there about.

When you leave your family and start your own, you are married. If you can show me otherwise in scripture, I'll be happy to look at it.

peace to youraying:

You want specific scripture that tells you "common law" marriage is fornication??? Tell us why it's not! You haven't answered that yet. What's the difference? Just a matter of how many years you live together without a ceremony? Show me where in other cultures you don't have a ceremony of some sort or a dowry being offered?

You have even suggested that common law marriage can be valid in God's eyes even in states where it is illegal. Ah well... you may certainly go by your own conscience, but when we are saved, we are to understand what the will of the Lord is, not "do what is right in our own eyes."

We really do need to think of ourselves as extensions of Christ's Body. When you leave your parents to start a famly, it doesn't necessarily mean you are married! How many leave home just to end up pregnant and alone? The problem with all your arguments are that you are seeing things through the eyes of the world although you are shouting "show me scripture!" We have, and you reject it.

From all I've seen of your replies, you are not seeing this issue in light of Christianity. It may be legal, but so is abortion. It may be entered into by two people who are going by what their consience dictates, but does their behavior edify the Body of Christ or cause your brother or sister to stumble?

I don't know any pastors who would teach that this arrangement is godly. I'm sure there might be a few who are misguided, but it can only lead to moral laxity and spiritual harm. You tend to ignore the following verses, but I'm going to post it one last time. If you truly want to understand, my suggestion is that you contemplate the meaning:


"However not all men have this knowledge; but some, being accustomed to the idol until now, eat food as if it were sacrificed to an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled. But food will not commend us to God; we are neither the worse if we do not eat, nor the better if we do eat. But take care that this liberty of yours does not somehow become a stumbling block to the weak. For if someone sees you, who have knowledge, dining in an idol's temple, will not his conscience, if he is weak, be strengthened to eat things sacrificed to idols? For through your knowledge he who is weak is ruined, the brother for whose sake Christ died. And so, by sinning against the brethren and wounding their conscience when it is weak, you sin against Christ. Therefore, if food causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause my brother to stumble." (1 Corinthians 8:7-13 NASB)

Substitute food for unlicensed sex. Same biblical principle.

 

[Victorious]

Acts 5:29 "But Peter and the apostles answered and said, 'We must obey God rather than men.'"

peace to youraying:

So, does your conscience tell you that you must pay taxes?

 

[canadyjd]

Substitute food for unlicensed sex. Same biblical principle.

:laugh: I know that didn't come out like you intended. But it is funny.

You seem to be worried someone might be intimate without a government license giving them permission to be intimate.

I thought we were talking about marriage. Marriage is much more than s*x.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

So, does your conscience tell you that you must pay taxes?

Yes, and so does scripture.

peace to youraying:

 

[JustChristian]

This isn't about you. This is about Christians who see it differently than you.

Why are we condemning those Christians who do believe a "state marriage" is an affront to God, that they are biblically sound in their refusal to participate? They base their opinions on scriptural examples of marriage.

They want to live as God has ordained they live. No one has yet to show from scripture why they are wrong.

If you can't give them a sound, biblical argument for why they are wrong, then you have nothing but secular arguments.

How often can a true Christian be convinced to go against his/her conscience and conform to the culture and the world?

Why do other Christians demand they conform to the culture and the world, violating their understanding of scripture and their own conscience in the process.

peace to youraying:

If Christians can reject a state marriage why can't they reject the state in general and specifically a war the state initiates?

 

[Victorious]

Yes, and so does scripture.

peace to youraying:

Well, it's okay to laugh...probably did come out funny. But s*x IS the issue after all. In actuality, it's about morality and our responsibility as Christians to abstain from all appearances of evil.

It's a very serious subject, actually, because we can either be examples of moral integrity or join the world in its moral downslide.

I have seen common law marriages result in generations of single mothers and unresponsible fathers. It's nice that your hypothetical couple is so dedicated. Will their children also follow suit?

 

[Marcia]

Acts 5:29 "But Peter and the apostles answered and said, 'We must obey God rather than men.'"

peace to youraying:

First of all, this had to do with preaching the gospel.

Secondly, this does not say to disobey the gov't if it violates your conscience.

Peter was being told by the religious leaders not to preach the gospel. This has nothing to do with your scenario.

 

[annsni]

This isn't about you. This is about Christians who see it differently than you.

Why are we condemning those Christians who do believe a "state marriage" is an affront to God, that they are biblically sound in their refusal to participate? They base their opinions on scriptural examples of marriage.

They want to live as God has ordained they live. No one has yet to show from scripture why they are wrong.

If you can't give them a sound, biblical argument for why they are wrong, then you have nothing but secular arguments.

How often can a true Christian be convinced to go against his/her conscience and conform to the culture and the world?

Why do other Christians demand they conform to the culture and the world, violating their understanding of scripture and their own conscience in the process.

peace to youraying:

If someone says that a state marriage is an affront to God and cannot prove it Scripturally, then they are wrong. Period. If they wish to choose to not have a state marriage, that is between them and God. But to say that a state marriage is wrong - and affront to God - and therefore a sin, they are telling me that I sinned in marrying my husband.

 

[annsni]

My hypothetical couple is offended that you accept government recognized marriage. It is, based on their study of scripture, an affront to God.[/COLOR][/COLOR]

In my hypothetical couple's mind, your acceptance of something so obviously polluted by the culture, and by your criticism of their attempt to follow the Word of God, you have become a stumbling block to them. You are giving offense.

In my hypothetical couple's mind, your witness of Christ is discredited because you are choosing to follow the world and the culture instead of following the Word of God, and in fact are attacking those who are following God's Word.

Therefore, according to the scripture you have quoted, you must renounce government sponsored marriage so as not to be a stumbling block to those you seem to consider to be weaker Christians.

peace to youraying:

So this couple instead chooses to do what homosexuals have been doing for many years and have ceremonies before God and not the government. And that's better than a state marriage? Talking about being polluted by the culture.

 

[saturneptune]

If someone says that a state marriage is an affront to God and cannot prove it Scripturally, then they are wrong. Period. If they wish to choose to not have a state marriage, that is between them and God. But to say that a state marriage is wrong - and affront to God - and therefore a sin, they are telling me that I sinned in marrying my husband.

I double amen to that. Not only is marriage not an affront to God, He says get married. I believe it was ordained in Genesis. Besides that, we are to obey the laws of the land God has put us in.

 

[canadyjd]

If Christians can reject a state marriage why can't they reject the state in general and specifically a war the state initiates?

Off subject.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

Well, it's okay to laugh...probably did come out funny. But s*x IS the issue after all. In actuality, it's about morality and our responsibility as Christians to abstain from all appearances of evil.

You are wrong. The issue is not s*x.

The issue is what/who defines a biblical marriage?

Does the government decide what is evil, or does God's Word?

It's a very serious subject, actually, because we can either be examples of moral integrity or join the world in its moral downslide.

We cannot depend on government laws to stop a moral downslide. We can only depend on the Word of God to transform people's lives.

I have seen common law marriages result in generations of single mothers and unresponsible fathers.

I've seen traditional marriages result in the exact same thing.

I guess that "license to have s*x" didn't make much of a difference after all, huh?

peace to youraying: