No…not interested
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Interview with ARCHBISHOP CARLO MARIA VIGANÒ APOSTOLIC NUNCIO
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VDMA
Member
Where there is forgiveness of sins there is life. Faith is what saves, and faith is received by word (law/gospel) and sacraments (holy baptism, holy absolution and the blessed sacrament). Forgiveness of sins is attached to baptism, absolution, the Lord’s super, and God’s Word is attached to the sacraments received by faith.
Lutherans do not have an official number of sacraments, we adhere to a minimum of three sacraments, holy baptism, holy absolution (we do not require penitence, or mandate private confession, but it should not be despised, I fear for those who do not confess mortal sin, scripture doesn’t teach “once saved always saved”) and holy communion. We allow for more depending how they are defined.
Lutherans do not teach the Catholic view of ex opere operantis: “from the work of the one performing it”. God’s word and faith, faith in Christ Jesus is always attached to the sacraments. Without faith you lose the benefits of the sacrament.
Sacred scripture clearly teaches baptismal regeneration, and the necessity of Holy baptism. All the church fathers (Irenaeus, who was discipled by Polycarp who was discipled by Apostle John) affirmed it. Every council that spoke of baptism affirmed it, and, what's more, a straightforward reading of the baptism passages also teaches baptismal regeneration. You cannot find a single church father that rejected baptism regeneration.
I can give a complete list of sacred scripture if you want. But it usually ends up being a loop argument.
WhaddaBout the Thief on the Cross
The Augsburg Confession of Faith: I, art. ix
Note: The Bible teaches that Baptism is a gift of God’s grace by which He applies the benefits of Christ’s life, death, and resurrection to us personally. Because all people are conceived and born in sin, we all need salvation. Because Baptism is God’s way of bringing us salvation, infants should also be baptized. During the Reformation, as now, some Christian groups turned Baptism from God’s saving activity into an act of Christian obedience. This view of Baptism arises from the denial of original sin and a semi-Pelagian view of salvation, whereby faith becomes the good work we contribute. This article concentrates on what God gives in this Sacrament. (See also Ap IX; SA III V; LC IV.)
1 Concerning Baptism, our churches teach that Baptism is necessary for salvation [Mark 16:16] and that God’s grace is offered through Baptism [Titus 3:4–7]. 2 They teach that children are to be baptized [Acts 2:38–39]. Being offered to God through Baptism, they are received into God’s grace.
3 Our churches condemn the Anabaptists, who reject the Baptism of children, and say that children are saved without Baptism.
I seen Baptist who have been baptized multiple time! It a sin to be re-baptized after having a valid trinitarian baptism as an infant or adult, it is sacrilegious.
Zwingli (who was a hectic) errors on Christology lead him to reject the true corporal body and blood of Christ. He literally resurrected the error of Nestorianism. Nestorianism separated the two natures in Christ so that there were two natures and two persons.
The Augsburg Confession of Faith: I, art. x
Note: By the time the Augsburg Confession was written, deep divisions had arisen among the various reformers concerning the Lord’s Supper. The Lutherans were very careful to distance themselves from those who reject that the body and blood of Christ are in fact truly present in His Supper and distributed to all those who eat and drink. Transubstantiation, consubstantiation, or any other human speculation asks the wrong question: how is Christ present? Lutheranism has no theory or philosophical explanation of how Christ is present. Rather, Lutherans insist on answering the what of the Lord’s Supper. We believe, teach, and confess that of the bread, Christ said, “This is My body,” and of the wine, “This is My blood.” These are given and shed “for the forgiveness of sins” (Matthew 26:26–28). We reject any teaching that is contrary to our Lord’s Word. (See also Ap X; SA III VI; LC V; FC Ep VII and SD VII.)
1 Our churches teach that the body and blood of Christ are truly present and distributed to those who eat the Lord’s Supper [1 Corinthians 10:16]. 2 They reject those who teach otherwise.
I here Baptist alway say “only the precious blood of Christ can save” and I agree.
I think of the Alan Jackson song.
"There Is Power In The Blood"
There is power, power, wonder-working power
In the blood of the Lamb
There is power, power, wonder-working power
In the precious blood of the Lamb
Where is this wonder working power? Is it something you just have to imagine or did Christ give us a way to to receive His body and blood?
Mankind fell by eating, man kind saved by eating, man ate from a living tree and death came, man eats the fruit from a dead tree, the cross and life comes.
The medicine of immortality (the blessed sacrament), it's it's potent stuff. Where there is forgiveness of sins there is life.
Jesus comes to us in the Mass and we receive His precious Body and Blood for the forgiveness of sins—the Blessed Sacrament. Does Jesus come to the Baptist church? Because he come to my parish.
Have you ever thought about why Baptist have empty crosses? They have empty Crosses for a reason. Baptist are making a Christological confession with empty crosses.
Baptist do not have the Lord’s super become invalidated by their own confession. It is for the same reason a Mormon baptism is not valid even if they use the same words Scripture uses, the baptism is not valid. Baptist confess the Lord’s Super is merely bread and wine, we take them at their word. It is not the Lord’s super they are merely consuming bread and wine.
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I wonder why Nancy rabid pro abortion stance and recent rants don't fall into the mortal sin category in the eyes of The Pope?
The Alan Jackson song? That song predates his release by a century or more. I do like his version. Alan cut the gospel albums as a present to his mother. Not sure how devout he is. Not very from what I understand.
Baptists have an empty cross because we serve a Risen Savior.
All in all, I could never be a Lutheran. Baptists follow scripture, that is our way… or at least the Old School Baptists do. It was the Catholics who killed and torchered so many that that mentality is abhorrent to me. And I have studied your theology and found it to be faulty in its Catholic like adherences. Of course you could never understand, and I have to smile at this since I went to a WELS for a short time and was called a heretic by one of their elders. I also went to an orthodox Presbyterian church. There they told me my child was in hell because he wasn’t infant baptized. Today I shake my head. LOL!
this is what happens when you have a church institution that is man made. This pope from my prospective anyway should resign.
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VDMA
Member
I can answer that question. It does fall into the mortal sin category becomes she is actively promoting mortal sin as being virtuous, etc. Church discipline has already been enacted by her Bishop from San Francisco. Her bishop directed his diocese to withhold Holy communion from Nancy Pelosi. It is unfortunate that the head bishop of the Catholic Church did not respect his decision. But then he comes out praising the courts decision. From the headlines: ‘Pope Francis wades in to Roe vs Wade abortion ruling as he compares termination to 'hiring a hitman to solve a problem'
Mortal sin indicates a contempt for the divine law. Mortal sins goes beyond the golden calf of the day such as abortion and LGBTQ+. For example, adultery, abortion, pornography, drunkenness, are mortal sins.
VDMA
Member
No, Baptist have empty crosses because of their Christological errors with the two nature of Christ.
Some Baptist make that error. Most might. The empty cross is to celebrate the completed work of the cross.
VDMA
Member
I am not Catholic, so I am not going to respond to the red-herrings, Calvinist were wicked there is plenty of blood shed to go around. Calvinist persecuted Lutherans. The OPC are Calvinist, Calvinism is false teaching.
WELS are very low church. So why did he call you a hectic? What is the context, people do not call other people hectic without reason.
Baptist (non-sacramental churches were never a thing) claim to follow scripture. Bible believing churches, believe what sacred scripture teaches about sacraments. Baptist/“Reformed” misuse logical syllogism to overthrow scriptural teachings. Honestly, you have been lured away by false and doctrines. Baptist are heterodox.
Back in the day, the only thing the Cals, Lutherans, and RCC could agree on was that the Baptists were the boogeyman.
37818
Well-Known Member
Where do you find this in any of the 66 Books?
Well you know what they say about opinions…
But to a point, if you feel that way about Baptists then why the heck are you on a Baptist Forum? Seems like all you want to do is criticize and stir up trouble.
Has he proofed yet?
I just want to make note of something for all those who wish to be part of a hierarchical church with branches (in some cases global) The New Testament standard for each church is that it is an independent church, answerable only to her Head, which is Christ (Ephesians 5:23).
I don’t know how we got off track. We were originally talking about Archbishop Vilano
VATICAN CITY — As Pope Francis continued attempts to mediate the conflict in Ukraine, former Vatican envoy and outspoken papal critic Archbishop Carlo Maria Viganò released a letter Monday (March 7) blaming "deep state" forces in the United States, the European Union and NATO for triggering the current war and demonizing Russia.
"The United States of America and the European States must not marginalize Russia but build an alliance with it, not only to restart trade for the prosperity of all, but in lieu of the reconstruction of a Christian Civilization, which will be the only one able to save the world from the transhuman and medical-technical globalist monster," the archbishop wrote in his nearly 10,000 word letter.
The archbishop, once the papal nuncio to the United States among other countries, has a keen understanding of what happens in rooms of power and influence, but since accusing Francis of covering up allegations of sex abuse against disgraced ex-cardinal Theodore McCarrick, going so far as to ask for the pope's resignation in 2018, Viganò has been welcomed into the ranks of a small but outspoken Catholic conservative right. His rhetoric has increasingly leaned on anti-migrant, anti-vaccine and pro-Trump takes.
VATICAN CITY — As Pope Francis continued attempts to mediate the conflict in Ukraine, former Vatican envoy and outspoken papal critic Archbishop Carlo Maria Viganò released a letter Monday (March 7) blaming "deep state" forces in the United States, the European Union and NATO for triggering the current war and demonizing Russia.
"The United States of America and the European States must not marginalize Russia but build an alliance with it, not only to restart trade for the prosperity of all, but in lieu of the reconstruction of a Christian Civilization, which will be the only one able to save the world from the transhuman and medical-technical globalist monster," the archbishop wrote in his nearly 10,000 word letter.
The archbishop, once the papal nuncio to the United States among other countries, has a keen understanding of what happens in rooms of power and influence, but since accusing Francis of covering up allegations of sex abuse against disgraced ex-cardinal Theodore McCarrick, going so far as to ask for the pope's resignation in 2018, Viganò has been welcomed into the ranks of a small but outspoken Catholic conservative right. His rhetoric has increasingly leaned on anti-migrant, anti-vaccine and pro-Trump takes.
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Yea and the goal was always to eradicate the boogeyman! How very Christian of them. Jews were not spared either.
Hi EWF,
I apologize for being so blunt with you earlier. I don’t usually do that. Hopefully we can talk. When you started your thread I really wanted to answer but I waited because I wanted to see how many Catholics would answer you. You said kind words about Archbishop Vigano so I want to respond. This is a very controversial subject and very difficult for a Catholic to talk about on a Protestant forum. I will probably be criticized by everybody. This needs to be answered but the answer must be proportionate. I hope I’ve done that. It is in very strong language but I think it needs to be because of the subject matter. When I speak about the Catholic Church critically it is only in light of the possibility that we are in the end times and I will not criticize anyone by name. That’s above my pay grade. It wouldn’t be wise to do that. OK. Well, I’m going to answer but, because of the subject matter, I have to say a couple of things first.
Where I Stand
I believe the Catholic Church is the only church established by Jesus Christ and there is no other. There is no where else to go. I love the Catholic Church with my whole heart and that’s why I am on this forum. I believe every person on this forum and in the whole world should come into the Catholic Church. This is the way God intended it, for us to be in unity, and it is disobedient not to. I am in the Church and thriving in it. To the contrary of what others may say, the Catholic Church is Eucharistic-Centered and this means Christ-Centered. It is definitely biblically based but Eucharistic-Centered. God is present in His Written Word and He is present in us but there is a hierarchy of “Presences” and the Eucharistic Presence is the highest presence because Christ is “Substantially Present”. Both the Written Word and the Word made Flesh (John 6) are important and both comprise the Catholic Mass. It is only through the sacraments that you receive sanctifying grace and this grace is what you need to get to heaven. If you make it to heaven it is only through the graces that flow through the Catholic Church. All 40,000+ denominations are not slices of the one pie. The Catholic Church is the “One” pie by itself. There is only one bride, which is the Catholic Church, and one bridegroom, which is Jesus Christ. Scandal is no reason to leave. You don’t leave Peter because of Judas! As I like to say, Jesus picked 12 apostles and one betrayed Him. One out of twelve is 8.33%. Pretty high number. Jesus said the gates of hell would not prevail against the church (Matt 16:18). I agree with you on Biden and Pelosi. I’ve heard priests say, objectively speaking, that they are to be pitied because they will go to hell. We need to pray for them. The only way I would leave the Catholic Church is if, at every Catholic Church, the words of Consecration at the Catholic Mass were changed and it was doubtful that Christ was substantially present on the altar. That’s one example. Of course I would not be leaving the church but only waiting to find the real Mass. When I think of this I think of Dan 12:11. I think we would have to be in the end times for that to happen. Another example would be if, at every Catholic Mass, something sacriligious was done. Again, we would have to be in the end times for that to happen. If either one of these happened, I wouldn’t go anywhere else and I would stay home and probably say the Mass as a prayer from my 1828 altar missal (the Latin Mass). Also I would pray all my devotionals especially the rosary and wait for God to tell me what to do. The church would be somewhere and I would just need to find it. It could be a remnant (Matt 16:18) in the end times and I would hopefully find it, probably through the help of an angel. If many in the Catholic Church were heading into apostasy, which they will in the end times, you cannot leave it. Of course, it’s really not the church heading into apostasy but many of its members. The problem with Modernism is that many of these people stay in the church, including the upper clergy! Protestants physically left the Catholic Church 500 years ago but today, many Modernists stay! This is why I think there will be a major split if we are, in fact, in the end times. Fr Malachi Martin once said when you are an apostate and stay in the church you don’t know that you are one! This describes Modernists (ex: Pelosi and Biden). He said you can be an apostate without leaving. Fr. Malachi Martin is unusual because he saw the Third Secret of Fatima so he probably knew something that we don’t. The Catholic Church is the “New Israel” (Rom 11, John 15) and, just like the old Israel in the OT, if you wanted to go to heaven you had to stay in it. Israel violated God’s law and it caused them to go into bondage (ex: Babylonian Captivity) but the Israelites stayed in it. The prophets were examples of just men who stayed in Israel while in bondage. It’s the same with the Catholic Church. So I’m staying. That’s where I stand.
Personal Info
I have been called a “Traditionalist” but I see myself as just a Catholic who never changed. I love the SSPX and the way they do things but I won’t go there. In my 50’s I served the Latin Mass again, for a few years, as an altar boy for a priest who studied in the seminary in Encone under Archbishop Marcel Lefevbre (Founder and Superior General of the SSPX). In the mid-1970’s he left Encone, remained loyal to Rome, and was ordained in Rome by Cardinal Oddi. Brilliant and holy man! I’m 67 years old and those my age were probably the last ones to grow up in the old way. I started Catholic School in 1961 and became an altar boy in 1963. Back then it was the Latin Mass only and it was Mass first period every day! We learned from the Baltimore Catechism. Very strict!
Archbishop Vigano
He’s a big reason why I recently became more interested in prophecy. I’ve always been interested in prophecy and began studying it off and on since 1992 along with studying freemasonry. I became even more interested in 2018 when Archbishop Vigano brought out Cardinal Theodore McCarrick’s scandalous past.
Here’s your answer: I love Archbishop Vigano!
If he was pope he would be like Pope St. Pius X who was the last pope to clean house! Vigano knows what he is talking about. Many of his criticisms are well founded. I think he sees us in the End Times. That changes everything! I have read that, at one time, he was considered as one of the top five in the Vatican during the pontificate of Pope Benedict. That’s hard to imagine since he was not a cardinal but he was very visible. That is just someone’s opinion inside the Vatican. Another good one to watch is Archbishop Athanasius Schneider. Notice that Vigano, Schneider, Michael Vohris, Dr. Taylor Marshall, etc are ALL IN THE CHURCH!!! They may criticize the church but they are in it. They love the church. Those in the SSPX love the church too. EWF, you should come back and stay too. I’m just fighting for you man! We would love to have you back on our team.
I apologize for being so blunt with you earlier. I don’t usually do that. Hopefully we can talk. When you started your thread I really wanted to answer but I waited because I wanted to see how many Catholics would answer you. You said kind words about Archbishop Vigano so I want to respond. This is a very controversial subject and very difficult for a Catholic to talk about on a Protestant forum. I will probably be criticized by everybody. This needs to be answered but the answer must be proportionate. I hope I’ve done that. It is in very strong language but I think it needs to be because of the subject matter. When I speak about the Catholic Church critically it is only in light of the possibility that we are in the end times and I will not criticize anyone by name. That’s above my pay grade. It wouldn’t be wise to do that. OK. Well, I’m going to answer but, because of the subject matter, I have to say a couple of things first.
Where I Stand
I believe the Catholic Church is the only church established by Jesus Christ and there is no other. There is no where else to go. I love the Catholic Church with my whole heart and that’s why I am on this forum. I believe every person on this forum and in the whole world should come into the Catholic Church. This is the way God intended it, for us to be in unity, and it is disobedient not to. I am in the Church and thriving in it. To the contrary of what others may say, the Catholic Church is Eucharistic-Centered and this means Christ-Centered. It is definitely biblically based but Eucharistic-Centered. God is present in His Written Word and He is present in us but there is a hierarchy of “Presences” and the Eucharistic Presence is the highest presence because Christ is “Substantially Present”. Both the Written Word and the Word made Flesh (John 6) are important and both comprise the Catholic Mass. It is only through the sacraments that you receive sanctifying grace and this grace is what you need to get to heaven. If you make it to heaven it is only through the graces that flow through the Catholic Church. All 40,000+ denominations are not slices of the one pie. The Catholic Church is the “One” pie by itself. There is only one bride, which is the Catholic Church, and one bridegroom, which is Jesus Christ. Scandal is no reason to leave. You don’t leave Peter because of Judas! As I like to say, Jesus picked 12 apostles and one betrayed Him. One out of twelve is 8.33%. Pretty high number. Jesus said the gates of hell would not prevail against the church (Matt 16:18). I agree with you on Biden and Pelosi. I’ve heard priests say, objectively speaking, that they are to be pitied because they will go to hell. We need to pray for them. The only way I would leave the Catholic Church is if, at every Catholic Church, the words of Consecration at the Catholic Mass were changed and it was doubtful that Christ was substantially present on the altar. That’s one example. Of course I would not be leaving the church but only waiting to find the real Mass. When I think of this I think of Dan 12:11. I think we would have to be in the end times for that to happen. Another example would be if, at every Catholic Mass, something sacriligious was done. Again, we would have to be in the end times for that to happen. If either one of these happened, I wouldn’t go anywhere else and I would stay home and probably say the Mass as a prayer from my 1828 altar missal (the Latin Mass). Also I would pray all my devotionals especially the rosary and wait for God to tell me what to do. The church would be somewhere and I would just need to find it. It could be a remnant (Matt 16:18) in the end times and I would hopefully find it, probably through the help of an angel. If many in the Catholic Church were heading into apostasy, which they will in the end times, you cannot leave it. Of course, it’s really not the church heading into apostasy but many of its members. The problem with Modernism is that many of these people stay in the church, including the upper clergy! Protestants physically left the Catholic Church 500 years ago but today, many Modernists stay! This is why I think there will be a major split if we are, in fact, in the end times. Fr Malachi Martin once said when you are an apostate and stay in the church you don’t know that you are one! This describes Modernists (ex: Pelosi and Biden). He said you can be an apostate without leaving. Fr. Malachi Martin is unusual because he saw the Third Secret of Fatima so he probably knew something that we don’t. The Catholic Church is the “New Israel” (Rom 11, John 15) and, just like the old Israel in the OT, if you wanted to go to heaven you had to stay in it. Israel violated God’s law and it caused them to go into bondage (ex: Babylonian Captivity) but the Israelites stayed in it. The prophets were examples of just men who stayed in Israel while in bondage. It’s the same with the Catholic Church. So I’m staying. That’s where I stand.
Personal Info
I have been called a “Traditionalist” but I see myself as just a Catholic who never changed. I love the SSPX and the way they do things but I won’t go there. In my 50’s I served the Latin Mass again, for a few years, as an altar boy for a priest who studied in the seminary in Encone under Archbishop Marcel Lefevbre (Founder and Superior General of the SSPX). In the mid-1970’s he left Encone, remained loyal to Rome, and was ordained in Rome by Cardinal Oddi. Brilliant and holy man! I’m 67 years old and those my age were probably the last ones to grow up in the old way. I started Catholic School in 1961 and became an altar boy in 1963. Back then it was the Latin Mass only and it was Mass first period every day! We learned from the Baltimore Catechism. Very strict!
Archbishop Vigano
He’s a big reason why I recently became more interested in prophecy. I’ve always been interested in prophecy and began studying it off and on since 1992 along with studying freemasonry. I became even more interested in 2018 when Archbishop Vigano brought out Cardinal Theodore McCarrick’s scandalous past.
Here’s your answer: I love Archbishop Vigano!
If he was pope he would be like Pope St. Pius X who was the last pope to clean house! Vigano knows what he is talking about. Many of his criticisms are well founded. I think he sees us in the End Times. That changes everything! I have read that, at one time, he was considered as one of the top five in the Vatican during the pontificate of Pope Benedict. That’s hard to imagine since he was not a cardinal but he was very visible. That is just someone’s opinion inside the Vatican. Another good one to watch is Archbishop Athanasius Schneider. Notice that Vigano, Schneider, Michael Vohris, Dr. Taylor Marshall, etc are ALL IN THE CHURCH!!! They may criticize the church but they are in it. They love the church. Those in the SSPX love the church too. EWF, you should come back and stay too. I’m just fighting for you man! We would love to have you back on our team.
Part 2
My Opinion and a Little on the End Times
Ok, this is my opinion: I believe the Catholic Church was infiltrated in the 1920’s-1950’s by communism (just like the effects of what is going on in our country right now. Sen. Joe McCarthy was right) and it’s main tool was Modernism. Communism is a branch of Freemasonry. In addition, through communism, the seminaries were infiltrated with homosexual seminarians. Probably McCarrick was one of them. All of this can be backed up.
Protestantism is not an alternative
Protestantism leads to apostasy and was really compromised when it was founded so it’s NOT an alternative. This is when the apostasy started. Heresy leads to apostasy. Ultimately, Protestantism leads to the Antichrist. You could say Protestantism, as a heretical movement, was divided again in the late 1800’s during the Third Great Awakening. This is when modernism rose up in the mainline protestant denominations. Besides all this there is absolutely NO unity of doctrine in protestantism. Using cause and effect I believe the Protestant Revolution of 1517 caused Communism in 1917.
Catholic Traditionalists like to say this about the present age in the church:
1517 Anticurch (Luther)
1717 Antistate (modern freemasonry founded)
1917 Antichrist (Communism)
The last step of this apostasy that started in 1517 (start of the 5th Age of the church - Fr. Holzhauser) is its entrance into the Catholic Church and it is called Modernism as I mentioned above. This is what I believe we are seeing in the Catholic Church now and it has reached the highest levels in the upper clergy. Modernism was condemned by Pope St. Pius X in 1907 but it went underground and resurfaced later. I don’t want to go too far into this and I may do a thread on it in the future. What does all this mean? It means we could be in the End Times. If I put a date on a major change in the Church in the near future, I would put it at 2029 and this date has to do with Fatima and ties into the Sacred Heart Devotion as well. There could be massive changes between now and then but by 2029 things will happen. Maybe a split? Fulfillment of Fatima? I may be very wrong on all this too! This is private prophecy and I may talk about it later. All the major private prophecies point to now as the end times. That’s what many think. I think so too but who knows? If enough people did more penance this timeline of the end times could be pushed back. As I said I think we are at the end of the Fifth Age of the church. The Era of Peace is the sixth Age and most think it’s very short (25-40 years). I think it could be short or long like around a thousand years but not an exact thousand years. Then comes the Final battle in the Seventh Age. Protestantism caused everything you are seeing right now in the country and the world and is filled with heresies so there should be no gloating over the Catholic Church having problems. You should be concerned. The Catholic Church is holding back the Antichrist (2 Thess 2:6). The heresies of Modernism entering the Catholic Church is simply just the last step towards the end.
Recommended Books
The Book of Destiny by Fr Herman Bernard Kramer (pub 1955)
The Apocalypse of St. John by Fr Sylvester Berry (pub 1921)
These two books have had the most influence on me concerning prophecy. Especially Fr Kramer’s book. Fr Kramer’s book was republished by Tan Books in recent years but it’s on the internet free. Both of them are. Generally I base some of this post on them. These books passed the censors of the Catholic Chuch including the 1944 censor concerning the thousand year reign. I may do a thread on them soon.
My Opinion and a Little on the End Times
Ok, this is my opinion: I believe the Catholic Church was infiltrated in the 1920’s-1950’s by communism (just like the effects of what is going on in our country right now. Sen. Joe McCarthy was right) and it’s main tool was Modernism. Communism is a branch of Freemasonry. In addition, through communism, the seminaries were infiltrated with homosexual seminarians. Probably McCarrick was one of them. All of this can be backed up.
Protestantism is not an alternative
Protestantism leads to apostasy and was really compromised when it was founded so it’s NOT an alternative. This is when the apostasy started. Heresy leads to apostasy. Ultimately, Protestantism leads to the Antichrist. You could say Protestantism, as a heretical movement, was divided again in the late 1800’s during the Third Great Awakening. This is when modernism rose up in the mainline protestant denominations. Besides all this there is absolutely NO unity of doctrine in protestantism. Using cause and effect I believe the Protestant Revolution of 1517 caused Communism in 1917.
Catholic Traditionalists like to say this about the present age in the church:
1517 Anticurch (Luther)
1717 Antistate (modern freemasonry founded)
1917 Antichrist (Communism)
The last step of this apostasy that started in 1517 (start of the 5th Age of the church - Fr. Holzhauser) is its entrance into the Catholic Church and it is called Modernism as I mentioned above. This is what I believe we are seeing in the Catholic Church now and it has reached the highest levels in the upper clergy. Modernism was condemned by Pope St. Pius X in 1907 but it went underground and resurfaced later. I don’t want to go too far into this and I may do a thread on it in the future. What does all this mean? It means we could be in the End Times. If I put a date on a major change in the Church in the near future, I would put it at 2029 and this date has to do with Fatima and ties into the Sacred Heart Devotion as well. There could be massive changes between now and then but by 2029 things will happen. Maybe a split? Fulfillment of Fatima? I may be very wrong on all this too! This is private prophecy and I may talk about it later. All the major private prophecies point to now as the end times. That’s what many think. I think so too but who knows? If enough people did more penance this timeline of the end times could be pushed back. As I said I think we are at the end of the Fifth Age of the church. The Era of Peace is the sixth Age and most think it’s very short (25-40 years). I think it could be short or long like around a thousand years but not an exact thousand years. Then comes the Final battle in the Seventh Age. Protestantism caused everything you are seeing right now in the country and the world and is filled with heresies so there should be no gloating over the Catholic Church having problems. You should be concerned. The Catholic Church is holding back the Antichrist (2 Thess 2:6). The heresies of Modernism entering the Catholic Church is simply just the last step towards the end.
Recommended Books
The Book of Destiny by Fr Herman Bernard Kramer (pub 1955)
The Apocalypse of St. John by Fr Sylvester Berry (pub 1921)
These two books have had the most influence on me concerning prophecy. Especially Fr Kramer’s book. Fr Kramer’s book was republished by Tan Books in recent years but it’s on the internet free. Both of them are. Generally I base some of this post on them. These books passed the censors of the Catholic Chuch including the 1944 censor concerning the thousand year reign. I may do a thread on them soon.
Baptists do not reject the ordinances, but we rightly divide them as not having salvation grace inherit within them!
Paul said in Romans 10:13, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord - everyone who appeals to the Lord - will be saved." Paul does not mean that faith alone fails to save. He means that faith calls on God. That's what faith does. Now Peter is saying, "Baptism is the God-ordained, symbolic expression of that call to God. It is an appeal to God - either in the form of repentance or in the form of commitment.