Is a church by any other name still a church?

Johnv,

I was referring specifically to those who had said that the reason they took the Baptist off their church's name was in order to get people into their church who, according to them, would not otherwise attend a BAPTIST church.

It is the reasoning Im objecting to, not the absence of "baptist."

 

Didn't take it off ... it's never been there. And yes the reason is because in our culture the name Baptist can be an obstacle to get an unbeliever to church...with the ultimate goal of that person becoming a believer. Not difficult to understand.

 

Bapmom,

It's not really difficult to understand. A lot of unchurched people have a very distorted view of what it means to be a baptist. Their only exposure to baptist is what they've seen on t.v., and the baptist that usually make the news are not usually the best ambasadores for what we really believe. Take a guy like Jerry Falwell for example. He's pprobably the best known baptist to unchurched people. JF and I probably agree on 95% of what we believe. But he has a way of expressing his beliefs that comes across to unchurched people as mean, judgmental, arrogant and self-righteous. I'm not saying that he is, just that that's the perception.

Now, understand that when I say that we're after people who won't come to a baptist church, I'm not talking about people that don't want to come to a baptist church because they prefer a methodist church. I'm talking about people who don't know Jesus Christ and have a messed up idea about what a baptist church is all about. We can choose to spend the next few years trying to convince them that it is okay to come to a baptist church, or we can spend the next few years making baptist out of them. I choose to make baptist.

 

How would The Saddleback Church fit into our definition of carnal Christianity?

Selah,

Bro. James

 

Where I attend many of the unsaved we witness to come from the Catholic church. We have heard people say that they would never step foot in a "Baptist" church.

Here in the Philly area the Catholic Church has been rocked by a massive church-sanctioned coverup in sexual abuse cases by their priests; many former members are open to the message of the good news of Christ.

Some of those that have been saved from such a background have told us that they couldn't get family members to come because of the Baptist name.

We have seen that most of the 'new salvations' in the church are from the personal witness of our members with the people they meet daily.
Why make it harder for them?

We changed the name of the church and took off the name "Baptist" about a year ago.

We are considering further modifying the name and disposing of the "Church" some time in the future too.

Rob

 

In the phone book, it doesn't matter if it's a temple, assembly, fellowship, or tabernacle. In the yellow pages, it's listed under "church".

If I am visiting in another town and want to go to church, I look in the yellow pages. If it doesn't say 'Baptist', I don't go there...

 

Fortunately we are not evangelizing Baptists, only the lost.

Rob

 

Fortunately we are not evangelizing Baptists, only the lost.

Rob </font>[/QUOTE]See, Deacon! I'm with Sister Sue on this one!

Question: When will the time come when the Mississippi Gulf Coast casinos realize that its the name "casino" on their marque's that are keeping people from coming in---so they move to remove that name---because

#1--they're ashamed of it

&

#2--if the word is not there--it may draw in a few more folks!!

What 'cha gonna do when you evangelize those lost people??? What 'cha gonna do when they repent of their sins and receive the Lord Jesus Christ into their lives??? What's the next step you want them to do??

You're gonna want them to do what???

Make a Profession of Faith?? Is that right??

Isn't that what Baptists do??

Then what are you gonna want them to do??

Be baptized!!!

What is baptism?? Full immersion in water---isn't that correct???

If you're a Baptist and you lead a lost person to a saving knowledge of the Lord Jesus---you're gonna disciple them to follow their Lord in Believer's Baptism---isn't that right??

Then why would you not be ashamed to ask them to follow the Lord in Believer's Baptism---but yet be ashamed to have that "stigma" put on your church marque??? Having the name on my marque tells the outside world-when you come in here---you're gonna do what Baptists do---you're gonna believe what Baptists believe!!

 

It is not unusual for "lost Baptists" to get redeemed. We are at the end of the "easy believe, repeat after me, now you are saved" era. (More of the fruits of Jacob Arminius).

Churches are filled those unregenerated.

Now what?

Preach the Word.

Selah,

Bro. James

 

Blackbird,

Can you point to one single post where somebody said they were ashamed to be a baptist?

 

I spent a few years in the northern part of the USA, where many of my neighbors were of Lutheran background. They told me they would not enter a church if it was labeled as a Baptist church. (Something about it being a sin!! LOL)

I now live in one of the most unchurched states in the USA, and I still find people who refuse to go into a building if it says Baptist on it. So I invite them to go to a place called Valleypoint@Pines (not my congregation) instead. It is the largest Southern Baptist church in the association! I also try to turn the conversation back to the PERSONAL aspect of becoming a Christian.

Perhaps we should stop arguing about what our building name is, and instead work on what our Lord wants us to do.

Bill

 

I was raised Catholic (and attended a Catholic school) and it was a sin to go into ANY protestant church - not just Baptist.

I used to visit the Presbyterian church, with my mother on occasion, and I had to tell the priest that, in the confessional, and do penance...

 

No Blackbird, I'm not ashamed that I'm a Baptist but there are plenty of "Baptist" churches that I would be ashamed to enter.

It is not the Baptist name that saves, it's the name of Jesus Christ.

I want a new believer to believe and act like a follower of Christ
---it just so happens that Baptists believe that too.

Rob

 

oops

 

I think it's an unanswerable question, and every congregation has to make up its own mind about what's best for its ministry. And, after all, isn't that the (pardon me) Baptist thing to do?

 

Since the phrase "carnal Christianity" is highly subjective, one could easily find anything in any church that fits the label in one way or another. That is why I generally refrain from using phrases like "carnal christianity" and "postmodernist". They're so vague that they lack accuracy. Plus, their ambiguity makes them hard labels to refute one they're affixed.

 

There are some limits but certainly the name "church", that isn't even in the Bible, should not be a life-or-death doctrine for our churches.

As for what we wear: as it is now, a suit is becoming much too expensive for my budget anyway.

If anyone don't like me wearing a suit, I'll just wear my shirt.
In different countries and cultures there are other types of attire.

I once wore shorts to a Sunday morning Baptist church service , and boy it sure felt weird....
(Pastor Haskel's church in Bermuda)

Rob

 

The denomination's appearance or lack thereof on the marquee is not an issue of right vs wrong.