Is a church really a church?

[Centrist]

Is a church really a church?

In 1 Timothy 2:8-15 (I use New King James version here), it speaks of a woman essentially not being the preacher, as she was easy for Satan to deceive.

Then we have 1 Timothy 3:1-13 where it speaks of what is expected of both a bishop and a deacon.

Ok, so if a church allows female or gay clergy and follows practices that are not compliant with those expected of clergy as covered in 1 Timothy, are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, right?

And to me it goes much further than that.

Then there is homosexuality. Gayism. Queerdrum. Faggotry. Sick. Sick. Sick. (In my opinion, of course.)

But then that is covered in Genesis 19:1–11; Leviticus 18:22; Leviticus 20:13; 1 Corinthians 6:9–10; 1 Timothy 1:10; Paul's letter to the Romans Romans 1:26–27. Yes, those are quick cut & pastes as I cannot find my notes on homosexuality.

But to me this is still the same thing in the end. Are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, clearly.

But now another gate opens up and I'm left to ask if the Disciples of Christ (allowing gay clergy); Presbyterian Church (allowing gay marriage and then gay clergy); Evangelical Lutheran (allowing both female & gay clergy); United Church of Christ (allowing gay marriage); Episcapalian Church (allowing gay clergy); and the United Methodist Church (allowing both female & gay clergy) are now cults, as they are not truly keeping with God's Word? So if we were to draw a socio-theological themometer, where would they fit with Scientology, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and the US Marine Corp?


(yes, serious subject with a hint or two of humor...it's still serious though)

 

[Ziggy]

As for the marines....

 

[Walter]

Is a church really a church?

In 1 Timothy 2:8-15 (I use New King James version here), it speaks of a woman essentially not being the preacher, as she was easy for Satan to deceive.

Then we have 1 Timothy 3:1-13 where it speaks of what is expected of both a bishop and a deacon.

Ok, so if a church allows female or gay clergy and follows practices that are not compliant with those expected of clergy as covered in 1 Timothy, are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, right?

And to me it goes much further than that.

Then there is homosexuality. Gayism. Queerdrum. Faggotry. Sick. Sick. Sick. (In my opinion, of course.)

But then that is covered in Genesis 19:1–11; Leviticus 18:22; Leviticus 20:13; 1 Corinthians 6:9–10; 1 Timothy 1:10; Paul's letter to the Romans Romans 1:26–27. Yes, those are quick cut & pastes as I cannot find my notes on homosexuality.

But to me this is still the same thing in the end. Are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, clearly.

But now another gate opens up and I'm left to ask if the Disciples of Christ (allowing gay clergy); Presbyterian Church (allowing gay marriage and then gay clergy); Evangelical Lutheran (allowing both female & gay clergy); United Church of Christ (allowing gay marriage); Episcapalian Church (allowing gay clergy); and the United Methodist Church (allowing both female & gay clergy) are now cults, as they are not truly keeping with God's Word? So if we were to draw a socio-theological themometer, where would they fit with Scientology, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and the US Marine Corp?


(yes, serious subject with a hint or two of humor...it's still serious though)

There is no such thing as The Episcopalian Church. You are just showing your ignorance. The proper name of the church is The Episcopal Church. Individual church members are called Episcopalians. How about including the Mennonite churches and American Baptist churches, Dutch Reformed Church in South Africa, Alliance of Baptists, Reformed Church in America, Moravian Church in America Northern Province, Affirming Pentecostal Church International, ect,
The list goes on and on who embrace gay clergy, gay marriage. You seem to pick and choose who you label as apostates.

 

[Yeshua1]

Is a church really a church?

In 1 Timothy 2:8-15 (I use New King James version here), it speaks of a woman essentially not being the preacher, as she was easy for Satan to deceive.

Then we have 1 Timothy 3:1-13 where it speaks of what is expected of both a bishop and a deacon.

Ok, so if a church allows female or gay clergy and follows practices that are not compliant with those expected of clergy as covered in 1 Timothy, are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, right?

And to me it goes much further than that.

Then there is homosexuality. Gayism. Queerdrum. Faggotry. Sick. Sick. Sick. (In my opinion, of course.)

But then that is covered in Genesis 19:1–11; Leviticus 18:22; Leviticus 20:13; 1 Corinthians 6:9–10; 1 Timothy 1:10; Paul's letter to the Romans Romans 1:26–27. Yes, those are quick cut & pastes as I cannot find my notes on homosexuality.

But to me this is still the same thing in the end. Are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, clearly.

But now another gate opens up and I'm left to ask if the Disciples of Christ (allowing gay clergy); Presbyterian Church (allowing gay marriage and then gay clergy); Evangelical Lutheran (allowing both female & gay clergy); United Church of Christ (allowing gay marriage); Episcapalian Church (allowing gay clergy); and the United Methodist Church (allowing both female & gay clergy) are now cults, as they are not truly keeping with God's Word? So if we were to draw a socio-theological themometer, where would they fit with Scientology, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and the US Marine Corp?


(yes, serious subject with a hint or two of humor...it's still serious though)

They might gather in His name, but it is only Church in name and building only, as he is not there among them!

 

[Alex2165]

2Corinthians 11.4-15

4.And no wonder! Even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.

15.Therefore, it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their deeds. (KSB)

 

[Salty]

There is no such thing as The Episcopalian Church. You are just showing your ignorance. The proper name of the church is The Episcopal Church. Individual church members are called Episcopalians. How about including the Mennonite churches and American Baptist churches, Dutch Reformed Church in South Africa, Alliance of Baptists, Reformed Church in America, Moravian Church in America Northern Province, Affirming Pentecostal Church International, ect,
The list goes on and on who embrace hom0sexual clergy, (so-called) hom0sexual marriage. You seem to pick and choose who you label as apostates.

(bold = changes to make PC -PR)

You mentioned "American Baptist churches" Using that term - that would mean Baptist churches in America
What I think you meant was "American Baptist Churches, USA"
Now granted some of the ABC churches do allow hom0sexual pastors and so-called marriages - but many do not,
as the ABC is not a true denomination - but rather an affiliation of churches which have no "headquarters" which require certain actions.

 

[Ziggy]

Yet unlike the SBC, the ABC owns the local church buildings and property, and too bad if the congregation should vote to leave the denomination (this was the case in one ABC church where I had preached in New England: they could call who they wanted as pastor, but could not leave the ABC and retain the property + building; they even lost a lawsuit on that point).

 

[Salty]

Yet unlike the SBC, the ABC owns the local church buildings and property, and too bad if the congregation should vote to leave the denomination (this was the case in one ABC church where I had preached in New England: they could call who they wanted as pastor, but could not leave the ABC and retain the property + building; they even lost a lawsuit on that point).

That does not apply to all ABC churches - now - could be that the Assoc, state or national may have a lien of the building. and the same goes for the SBC.

 

[OneIsTheWord]

Is a church really a church?

In 1 Timothy 2:8-15 (I use New King James version here), it speaks of a woman essentially not being the preacher, as she was easy for Satan to deceive.

Then we have 1 Timothy 3:1-13 where it speaks of what is expected of both a bishop and a deacon.

Ok, so if a church allows female or gay clergy and follows practices that are not compliant with those expected of clergy as covered in 1 Timothy, are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, right?

And to me it goes much further than that.

Then there is homosexuality. Gayism. Queerdrum. Faggotry. Sick. Sick. Sick. (In my opinion, of course.)

But then that is covered in Genesis 19:1–11; Leviticus 18:22; Leviticus 20:13; 1 Corinthians 6:9–10; 1 Timothy 1:10; Paul's letter to the Romans Romans 1:26–27. Yes, those are quick cut & pastes as I cannot find my notes on homosexuality.

But to me this is still the same thing in the end. Are they really a church or are they a cult? They are not holding true to His Word, clearly.

But now another gate opens up and I'm left to ask if the Disciples of Christ (allowing gay clergy); Presbyterian Church (allowing gay marriage and then gay clergy); Evangelical Lutheran (allowing both female & gay clergy); United Church of Christ (allowing gay marriage); Episcapalian Church (allowing gay clergy); and the United Methodist Church (allowing both female & gay clergy) are now cults, as they are not truly keeping with God's Word? So if we were to draw a socio-theological themometer, where would they fit with Scientology, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, and the US Marine Corp?


(yes, serious subject with a hint or two of humor...it's still serious though)

The Principle of Marriage
The Child is born in water and blood, and when you separate the family Covenant between man and woman, this call shedding the blood of your family name or breaking the covenant with the firstborn of God, and you kill your family heritage! It is a detestable sin.

We read in Psalms 127:3 Behold, children are a heritage from the Lord, The fruit of the womb is a reward.

Lev 18:22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination.

Lev 18:22 (NLT) “Do not practice homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin.

We read in Matt 19:4-6 And He answered and said to them, "Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning 'made them male and female,' and said, 'For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh?
So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate."

1 Peter 3:18-20 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,
by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison,
who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.

Heb 13:7-9 Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct.
Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
Do not be carried about with various and strange doctrines. For it is good that the heart be established by grace, not with foods which have not profited those who have been occupied with them.

Mal 3:5-7 And I will come near you for judgment; I will be a swift witness Against sorcerers, Against adulterers, Against perjurers, Against those who exploit wage earners and widows and orphans, And against those who turn away an alien-- Because they do not fear Me," Says the Lord of hosts. "For I am the Lord, I do not change; Therefore you are not consumed, O sons of Jacob.
Yet from the days of your fathers, You have gone away from My ordinances And have not kept them. Return to Me, and I will return to you," Says the Lord of hosts. "But you said, 'In what way shall we return?