Is Eternal Sonship of Jesus Biblical?

[Ekklesian]

I agree, 37818.

Christ became His Son in humanity on that day.

I believe as you, He has always existed as the Son, and as the Word from infinity past.

Christ became the Child that was born on 'that day.' He was always 'the Son' that was given.

 

[Ekklesian]

Heb. 2:16 is not referring to Christ taking on a seed as in birth, He was conceived of the Spirit, not of man.

"He took on Him not the nature of angels" meaning He didn't come to be the Savior of angels , by taking on their nature.

" He took on Him the the seed of Abraham" referring to His humanity, taking on the body of man to redeem us.

Meaning He was born of a woman...unlike Adam, who was made of the dust of the earth.

 

[Ekklesian]

Did The Son take on the seed of Adam, or the seed of Abraham?
Heb.16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

The seed of Abraham. The elect. Born of a woman.

 

[Ekklesian]

The Gentile Church is God's second choice to evangelize the world, Israel is His original choice.

Paul said God is not finished with Israel, and "all of Israel will be saved."

They will fulfill their original calling to evangelize the world in the Millennial reign of Christ.

Plan B.

 

[Ekklesian]

Of course God has always had a small remnant of Jews, and has one now, but very few.

99% of the saved since Acts 2 at Pentecost have been Gentiles.

Grafted into what Tree?

 

[Ekklesian]

Oh boy, you are getting it all wrong. Jumping to conclusions.

God is working differently with the Church than He is with Israel, but in the end the Jew and Gentile will worship God together in perfect harmony.

That's going on now.

 

[Ekklesian]

Israel has been partially blinded,

"Partially." Not entirely.

as Paul

One of the elect.

Rom 11:7 - What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

 

[Zaatar71]

The seed of Abraham. The elect. Born of a woman.

Yes, I think you are saying this correctly!

 

[David Lamb]

The Gentile Church is God's second choice to evangelize the world, Israel is His original choice.

Paul said God is not finished with Israel, and "all of Israel will be saved."

They will fulfill their original calling to evangelize the world in the Millennial reign of Christ.

That cannot be so, because Christians (whether Israelites or Gentiles) were "chosen in Him before the foundation of the world." Saying that the Gentile church is God's second choice seems to imply that He tried Israel first, and when that didn't work, He brought in plan B.

 

[Charlie24]

That cannot be so, because Christians (whether Israelites or Gentiles) were "chosen in Him before the foundation of the world." Saying that the Gentile church is God's second choice seems to imply that He tried Israel first, and when that didn't work, He brought in plan B.

Yes, I'm afraid it is true! Israel is God's elect and were chosen to take the gospel to the world, until they failed and killed their own Messiah.

But they will still fulfill this calling in the future. Christ is the salvation to the end of the world.

Isaiah 49:6

“And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.”

 

[Charlie24]

Yes, I'm afraid it is true! Israel is God's elect and were chosen to take the gospel to the world, until they failed and killed their own Messiah.

But they will still fulfill this calling in the future. Christ is the salvation to the end of the world.

Isaiah 49:6

“And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.”

Isaiah 45:4

"“For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.”"

But His Elect will know Him in the future and evangelize the world.

 

[Charlie24]

Isaiah 45:4

"“For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.”"

But His Elect will know Him in the future and evangelize the world.

David, God never made a covenant with the Gentiles, they were all made with Israel.

We, the Church are grafted into Israel's covenant.

 

[David Lamb]

Yes, I'm afraid it is true! Israel is God's elect and were chosen to take the gospel to the world, until they failed and killed their own Messiah.

But they will still fulfill this calling in the future. Christ is the salvation to the end of the world.

Isaiah 49:6

“And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.”

But the Person Isaiah 49:6 is talking about will "raise up the tribes of Jacob, and restore the preserved of Israel," so He cannot be Israel. Indeed, Simeon uses words from that verse to refer to Jesus, Whom he is holding in his arms:

“A light to bring revelation to the Gentiles, And the glory of Your people Israel."” (Lu 2:32 NKJV)

 

[Charlie24]

But the Person Isaiah 49:6 is talking about will "raise up the tribes of Jacob, and restore the preserved of Israel," so He cannot be Israel. Indeed, Simeon uses words from that verse to refer to Jesus, Whom he is holding in his arms:

“A light to bring revelation to the Gentiles, And the glory of Your people Israel."” (Lu 2:32 NKJV)

The verse is speaking of the Messiah being the light to the Gentiles through the tribes of Jacob.

 

[David Lamb]

David, God never made a covenant with the Gentiles, they were all made with Israel.

We, the Church are grafted into Israel's covenant.

Well, the New Testament makes very clear that there is no difference between Jew and Gentile in the church:


“There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Ga 3:28 NKJV)

Hebrews talks about the better covenant Christ has brought in:

“But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.” (Heb 8:6 NKJV)

This covenant is not only for national Israel.

 

[Charlie24]

Well, the New Testament makes very clear that there is no difference between Jew and Gentile in the church:


“There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” (Ga 3:28 NKJV)

Hebrews talks about the better covenant Christ has brought in:

“But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, inasmuch as He is also Mediator of a better covenant, which was established on better promises.” (Heb 8:6 NKJV)

This covenant is not only for national Israel.

Of course the covenant is not for Israel only! But the covenant wasn't made with the Church, it was made with Israel.

The Church was grafted in! We are the wild branches grafted into the olive tree, Israel is the natural branches of the olive tree (covenant).

 

[Charlie24]

Of course the covenant is not for Israel only! But the covenant wasn't made with the Church, it was made with Israel.

The Church was grafted in! We are the wild branches grafted into the olive tree, Israel is the natural branches of the olive tree (covenant).

The natural olive tree, Israel is suffering now while the Gentiles rule the world.

At the Second Coming that flips, Israel will be the greatest nation on earth for 1000 years.

Israel will have their days of glory in thsi world, they are the chosen of God and that hasn't changed!

 

[37818]

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, . . .

It goes to how one understands the Word to be with God.

 

[JesusFan]

The Son proceeds from the Father. That is true yesterday, today, and tomorrow. Heb 13:8 - Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

What do you mean by "eternity past?"

Jesus always has existed as God, but was He the Son or the Word before He was physically born?

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

Jesus always has existed as God, but was He the Son or the Word before He was physically born?

"Then I was by Him, as One Brought Up with Him:
and I was Daily His Delight, Rejoicing Always before Him;"

PROVERBS 8:30 says that Jesus was Rejoicing "ALWAYS" before the Father,
"Always" "Daily" = from Eternity Past, with there never being any time possible
when Jesus was not The Eternal Logo's, as God's Spokesman Son,
Eternally Generated from God the Father, as the Very Express Image of Very God,
Who from the Beginning was God, The Word, Who was with God and Who was God.

Jesus Christ is The Lord God of The Universe and every page of Existence
throughout all of Eternity and all of History is Written on His Letterhead.