Is God the First Cause of Evil?

[Reformed]

God uses all things for His purpose, even evil:

Genesis 50:20 "As for you, you meant evil against , but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive."

James writes (Jas. 1:13), "Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God'; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone."

The purpose of this thread is discuss God's relationship to first causes when it comes to evil. Put another way, to discuss whether God is personally responsible for evil. Let me compare two passages to spur discussion.

1 Samuel 19:9 Now there was an evil spirit from the LORD on Saul as he was sitting in his house with his spear in his hand, and David was playing the harp with his hand.

Job 1:6-12 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them. The Lord said to Satan, “From where do you come?” Then Satan answered the Lord and said, “From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it.” The Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job? For there is no one like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, fearing God and turning away from evil.” Then Satan answered the Lord, “Does Job fear God for nothing? “Have You not made a hedge about him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. “But put forth Your hand now and touch all that he has; he will surely curse You to Your face.” Then the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him.” So Satan departed from the presence of the Lord. The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.” Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.

In 1 Samuel 19 we read that there was an evil spirit from the Lord on Saul. On first read it looks as though God sent an evil spirit (a demon) to torment Saul. But in Job 1 (and then again in Job 2) there is more nuance to God's relationship with evil. In Job, God allows Satan to exercise evil on Job and his family through calamity and illness. We know how both stories end. Saul's reign came to an end and David ascended to the throne. Job eventually was restored to health and his possessions restored and multiplied. The psalmist writes:

Psalm 92:15 To declare that the Lord is upright; He is my rock, and there is no unrighteousness in Him.

It is my contention that if there is no unrighteousness in God, then God cannot be the first cause of evil. He allows evil for purposes that may allude our understanding, but God does not create evil. He is not culpable for evil.

 

[SolaSaint]

I think you answered well grasshopper!:wavey::thumbsup:

 

[Revmitchell]

It is my contention that if there is no unrighteousness in God, then God cannot be the first cause of evil. He allows evil for purposes that may allude our understanding, but God does not create evil. He is not culpable for evil.

This is my position.

 

[jbh28]

It is my contention that if there is no unrighteousness in God, then God cannot be the first cause of evil. He allows evil for purposes that may allude our understanding, but God does not create evil. He is not culpable for evil.

Well said :thumbsup:

 

[convicted1]

:applause::applause::applause::applause:

 

[kyredneck]

Wow, 100% agreement, this could get boring without some debate happening.

Gen 50:20 is the type, Acts 5:26-28 is the antitype. Keeping true to form, even these passages reinforce the concept of 'predestination' only as it applies to God calling out a people for His own possession:

Genesis 50:20 "As for you, you meant evil against , but God meant it for good in order to bring about this present result, to preserve many people alive."

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

It is my contention that if there is no unrighteousness in God, then God cannot be the first cause of evil. He allows evil for purposes that may allude our understanding, but God does not create evil. He is not culpable for evil.

:thumbsup: Only those who do not know God could make the grave error of blaming Him for the evil man himself, in his rebellion against and rejection of God, has brought into the world.

 

[Iconoclast]

5 And this is the message that we have heard from Him, and announce to you, that God is light, and darkness in Him is not at all;


13 Purer of eyes than to behold evil, To look on perverseness Thou art not able, Why dost Thou behold the treacherous? Thou keepest silent when the wicked Doth swallow the more righteous than he,

 

[kyredneck]

Let's just all sing the Doxology.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Let's just all sing the Doxology.

[URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbjpG0SeXYU]You start[/URL], brother. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Yeshua1]

God uses all things for His purpose, even evil:





The purpose of this thread is discuss God's relationship to first causes when it comes to evil. Put another way, to discuss whether God is personally responsible for evil. Let me compare two passages to spur discussion.





In 1 Samuel 19 we read that there was an evil spirit from the Lord on Saul. On first read it looks as though God sent an evil spirit (a demon) to torment Saul. But in Job 1 (and then again in Job 2) there is more nuance to God's relationship with evil. In Job, God allows Satan to exercise evil on Job and his family through calamity and illness. We know how both stories end. Saul's reign came to an end and David ascended to the throne. Job eventually was restored to health and his possessions restored and multiplied. The psalmist writes:



It is my contention that if there is no unrighteousness in God, then God cannot be the first cause of evil. He allows evil for purposes that may allude our understanding, but God does not create evil. He is not culpable for evil.

God did not decree that both satan and Adam would sin against Him, but he did ordain what the results and His action would be based upon those falls, correct?

 

[Reformed]

God did not decree that both satan and Adam would sin against Him, but he did ordain what the results and His action would be based upon those falls, correct?

That is correct.

 

[kyredneck]

http://cyberhymnal.org/htm/p/r/praisegf.htm