Is God's Sovereign really absolute control of everything?

Refute testimony? It's worse than trying to teach my 12 year old quantum physics! You say that man can "understand" God enough to choose Him with the "light" God has given him... ohhh boy really deep theological thought gentlemen... I thought that way too until I started reading Greek and Hebrew and studied my torah seriously .... THEN I turned 18 and and translated John 3, 8, 10, 17 and without a doubt with the mishnah and septuagant and found out that people actually still believed the tripe that Erasmus spewed out and figured I have to let the truth ring! I've answered EVERY SINGLE Sunday school questions you boys have put out and you can't answer either my replies or my questions... it's pathetic. It's like all you've done is do a simple word search on seek and search and choose and you think those are proof texts.... it's horribly funny, and sad.
NO MAN SEEKS AFTER GOD NO NOT ONE... Yet you try to show that man does seek him. Funny, either your right and Romans 3 is wrong or the Romans 3 is correct and you are... guess what side I'm CHOOSING. You have such a childish understanding of the will. Try reading a book or two by some learned scholars before you show you ineptitude again please?

 

PROOF TEXTS? NO! Examples of? YES!

 

Your ignorance is beyond belief. So you know so many and I and my family on both sides are Jewish.. gone to temple learn from Rabbi's ... yeah.... foolish person.

 

rc,

If I have not crossed the line you may want to answer this question. Are you a Christian or a Jew by way of faith/belief, or a Christian who happens to be of Israelite descent?

 

I'm Jewish of descent, Moser bloodline... and Jewish by belief (circumcized of the heart). I believe in Joshua as messiah (In other words I'm a Christian) I don't like the term "messianic jew" but to save time, you get the idea. I Luv Light... Don't mock the natural branch, you REALLY need to read and understand Romans for MANY reasons...at least Ray has the kindness to ask me proper questions...

Ray also... actually I would say that TRUELY those who are in Christ, I would say ARE the JEWS.. for WE received the promises of the covenant BY FAITH...And if a Jew (Israelite) asks you about your faith tell them "you ARE a Jew, circumcized of the heart, under the tribe of the Lion." This will either tick them off or break their heart... both are good for 'em...and to cut things off before they start, NO ! I believe that there still are promises, GREAT promises for my people that God will be faithful to accomplish. Like saving all of them...

 

Also.. that shows God His "special" love... He doesn't love all the same and treat them the same. God promises the nation of Israel complete salvation, THE WHOLE NATION SHALL BE SAVED! but why not all the Germans, or French, or Americans... is this "fair" in the humanistic understanding of Justice... No... but it is if you look at True Justice .. Biblical Justice.

 

Well,
That shows how fragmented your thought process is ILL. Major in English? When did I say that? Try Masters in Theology, Greek, student in John Pipers Institute, and going for Doctorates eventually God willing..

What do I need to back up being Jewish? You sound jealous. What? My family tree I can't trace all the way back to Abraham? ... Oh yeah... you never know huh... maybe someoone in my family decided "Hey, look at how those Jews are getting slaughtered and mistreated, I'm going to say I'm Jewish so I can be like them!" ... idiot...

 

Can't stand it that I'm a Jew, a physical descendant of Abraham can you ILL? .... Just say your a bigot and all will be forgiven.

 

I'm sorry. Forgive me?

 

rc,

You said,

You will understand this, but a lot of Christian will not admit to what I am about to say. Every born of the Spirit Christ is ‘ . . . the Israel of God.’ I looked up the name Israel and if I remember correctly it means ‘prince with God.’ Even if this is not the correct derivation of the name, all Christians are either princes or princesses in the mind of the Lord.

You may not believe in my eschatology but I believe that beginning in the future Great Tribulation and on into the Kingdom Age, ‘the natural branches will be grafted into their own olive tree.’ [Romans 11:24d] Thank God you are not among ‘the part of the Israelites who are at the moment blinded.’ [vs.25] After the Lord comes for His church, God speaking through the Apostle Paul, assures us that ‘ . . . all Israel will become saved.’

As I become older I am humbled and grateful that He has included me among the people of God, and that we are all one in Christ, whether Israelite or Gentile.

Rc, I have known a Jewish man for a few years and I found out through him and other Jewish people who I witness to—that they stop you in your tracks and say they are not interested in hearing about the faith of Jesus. Why is this? Perhaps they are intimidated or . . . .

Berrian,Th.D.

 

Ray, it's tough.. you should see my family during Christmas AND all the feasts.. Why? Well... I know you might not like it but I've come to believe:

Romans 10:19 - 11:8 19 But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, "I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry." 20 Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, "I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me." 21 But of Israel he says, "All day long I have held out my hands to a disobedient and contrary people." ESV Romans 11:1 I ask, then, has God rejected his people? By no means! For I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel? 3 "Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life." 4 But what is God's reply to him? "I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal." 5 So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace. 6 But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace. 7 What then? Israel failed to obtain what it was seeking. The elect obtained it, but the rest were hardened, 8 as it is written, "God gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes that would not see and ears that would not hear, down to this very day."

RAY!! This part is for you... if you show this to a Jew it will most likely to REALLY tick them off..But I cry over it every time I read it..

Romans 11:25-31 25 Lest you be wise in your own conceits, I want you to understand this mystery, brothers1 )a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written, "The Deliverer will come from Zion, he will banish ungodliness from Jacob"; 27 "and this will be my covenant with them when I take away their sins." 28 As regards the gospel, they are enemies of God for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 Just as you were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience, 31 so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now(1 )receive mercy.

If you can ask them "Who WILL be the messiah?" What verses can you show me in the Tenakh (O.T.) And show a great interest in THEIR messiah, you may be able to bring out how Joshua fullfilled them... THEY are very prideful if they are religious or they won't care which means their just plain liberal/atheistic. I'll pray for your friends, and pray for my Dad's side of the family.

 

rc,

I tried to access you privately by Email or by PM, but believe this important so I will respond here, briefly.

You said, 'THEY are very prideful if they are religious or they won't care which means their just plain liberal/atheistic. I'll pray for your friends, and pray for my Dad's side of the family.' [/quote]

The man I know has a mezuzah at his front door. He is a secular Jewish man who married a Gentile wife. Your explanation explained to me why it is difficult to witness to Jewish people. Thanks!

I will join others in praying for your father and family who might not yet know Jesus our Lord. As the Spirit of God reminds me I will pray that other people will witness to him or that in God's wisdom--He will use some means to bring the Gospel to his attention.

At times, I have found those who seem the most difficult to reach who stonewall Christ the most firmly, soon break and come to new life in Christ; once the simple saving Gospel is before people the Holy Spirit attends the Word and makes it real to people. Sometimes when we are about to give up on someone, they surprise us and find the Lord or are found of Him.

 

Amen to that Ray...

Just sow that seed...and pray for that stoney hard heart be touched by God !!