Is it a sin to be a denomination?

[rodneyo777]

Is it not a division among those of us who claim to be Christians, if we also claim to be Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, Pentecostal, or Baptist etc.

Is it not similar as saying "I am of Paul, I am of Cephas"?

Can we divide the body of Christ?

Do we even know who is truly a member of the body of Christ...Is this not something that only Christ knows. For many claim "Lord, Lord, we did such and such in your name"...And Christ says "I do not know you"...Yet they believed that they knew Christ.

I submit that the members of the spiritual body of Christ are hidden, and have been hidden since the death of the last apostle. This expression of the "LIFE" of Christ in a group of people, seen in the local, and universal church was last seen in the book of acts.

I mean is it possible, that even Billy Graham is not truly born again, or maybe you and I are not born again. Who is it that Paul admonishes to inspect themselves.

What sin then, is this "OF MEN" to proclaim "I am of this denomination, or doctrine". Can the hand separate from the foot, or the head?

What will be the consequences of this sin. How does Jesus feel about this, since we are His body, plural on this earth.

For He came the first time in a singular human body of flesh, and died. Then He sent back His selfsame Spirit to His body, this time plural, who is also called to die, not on a cross, but to self rule.

Have I missed something here. What say you?

 

[rodneyo777]

Oh and what do you think our response should be, if this is indeed a problem?

 

[Tom Bryant]

I think you've missed something. There are different viewpoints about important Biblical beliefs such as church gov't, mode of baptism, speaking in tongues, KJVO etc. Churches gather together based on a commonality of beliefs.

I don't think denominationalism is necessarily sin. It can become sin. but so can most other things.

 

[Revmitchell]

If the majority of people do not believe it is a sin but you do and are working to convince others then you have just created a division.

 

[rodneyo777]

Tom I see your point, but it's like looking behind a veil, to see what is behind something.

IF the scriptures are our guide, then I think denominations divide us and is something that Paul condemned.

The following statement could not be written by Paul today: "To THE church (singular) in Corinth"...

We have churches on every corner, who refuse to even be in one another's presence, I would say this is flesh at best, and possibly evil.

I think you've missed something. There are different viewpoints about important Biblical beliefs such as church gov't, mode of baptism, speaking in tongues, KJVO etc. Churches gather together based on a commonality of beliefs.

I don't think denominationalism is necessarily sin. It can become sin. but so can most other things.

 

[rodneyo777]

cop out...REV....

We could never be one, if God allows this to continue, so me raising the issue is not divisive...The prayer of Jesus will be answered, and this separation, which in reality never has, and never will occur between the bride, has occurred among some in the modern church groups.

If the majority of people do not believe it is a sin but you do and are working to convince others then you have just created a division.

 

[Revmitchell]

cop out...REV....

We could never be one, if God allows this to continue, so me raising the issue is not divisive...The prayer of Jesus will be answered, and this separation, which in reality never has, and never will occur between the bride, has occurred among some in the modern church groups.

Actually bringing it up is as silly as what I said. Usually folks from the "Church of Christ" denomination bring this question up. Is that you?

 

[Tom Bryant]

Tom I see your point, but it's like looking behind a veil, to see what is behind something.

IF the scriptures are our guide, then I think denominations divide us and is something that Paul condemned.

The following statement could not be written by Paul today: "To THE church (singular) in Corinth"...

We have churches on every corner, who refuse to even be in one another's presence, I would say this is flesh at best, and possibly evil.

From reading some of your posts - for example, on tongues - I think you're wrong scripturally. But then again you think I am wrong scripturally, The division is there because I believe the Bible teaches something different than you do. We would not be able to belong to the same church because of those differences. I wouldn't be a part of a church that is KJVO. You seem to believe in that. Denominations are simply a realization that people differ about certain issues.

 

[rodneyo777]

Tom thanks for the nice reply.

I really am not sure how to put this into words. We are really speaking about 2 groups.

You are speaking of the visible body, and I am speaking of the invisible body, that only Christ is able to identify. Some of us who are in that visible group are also in the invisible group.

Those in the visible group are exactly as you describe, some think tongues is for today, others do not. Some eat pork others do not.'

BUT I believe there is an invisible group within that visible group.

All within that invisible group, hear the same Lord, she knows that same voice, she has that same communion, she knows that same presence, and direction, from her beloved.

Since Jesus is not schizophrenic, he does not say something is true, and this is what it means, and then turn to another member of His body and say the total opposite.

SO I believe this invisible group is in every church across the world, some don't even go to church, some don't have a bible.

For example:
From approximately 100 ad to 1400 ad, are we to suspect that God left his church without the "Word of God" for 1300 years?

No absolutely not, unless your only definition of the word was and is "The scriptures"...

She was sustained, grew, and have abundant life, because she heard His voice. That still small voice, or audible voice, kept her communing with Him.

From reading some of your posts - for example, on tongues - I think you're wrong scripturally. But then again you think I am wrong scripturally, The division is there because I believe the Bible teaches something different than you do. We would not be able to belong to the same church because of those differences. I wouldn't be a part of a church that is KJVO. You seem to believe in that. Denominations are simply a realization that people differ about certain issues.

 

[BobRyan]

There was great error and apostasy that came in during the dark Ages. The Protestant reformation sought to correct those errors first from within and finally by separation.

Gal 1:6-9 "if we (Apostles) or an angel from heaven should come to you and preach a different Gospel let him be accursed".

Matt 10 "think not that I have come to bring peace... not peace but a sword"
34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.




Acts 20 "from among your own selves men will arise..."


27 For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God.
28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.
31 Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.


3 John 1
7 Because that for his name's sake they went forth, taking nothing of the Gentiles.
8 We therefore ought to receive such, that we might be fellowhelpers to the truth.
9 I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not.
10 Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds which he doeth, prating against us with malicious words: and not content therewith, neither doth he himself receive the brethren, and forbiddeth them that would, and casteth them out of the church.
11 Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.
12 Demetrius hath good report of all men, and of the truth itself: yea, and we also bear record; and ye know that our record is true.


Titus 1
9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.
10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:
11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.
12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, the Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.
13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Jude 1
3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.

 

[DHK]

Is it not a division among those of us who claim to be Christians, if we also claim to be Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, Pentecostal, or Baptist etc.

Is it not similar as saying "I am of Paul, I am of Cephas"?

Can we divide the body of Christ?

"The body of Christ" that Paul spoke to when he wrote that letter was the church at Corinth. Some of them followed the teachings of Paul, others of Peter, others of Apollos, and others said proudly that they would be mere followers of Christ. That was their church, their local assembly in that day and age. It was marked by carnality and divisiveness.
This was unlike the church at Philippi, who were not divisive at all, but even gave to Paul's needs--in fact they were the only church to do so.

Php 4:14 Yet it was kind of you to share my trouble.
Php 4:15 And you Philippians yourselves know that in the beginning of the gospel, when I left Macedonia, no church entered into partnership with me in giving and receiving, except you only.
Php 4:16 Even in Thessalonica you sent me help for my needs once and again. (ESV)

"This body of Christ," that is to say, this ekkesia or local church, was not divided as the ekkesia or church as Corinth was. Not every "church" or "assembly" is. Don't assume that all are.

But if you want to join a "denomination" that has problems with divisiveness, then that is up to you.

 

[Jordan Kurecki]

http://www.wayoflife.org/index_files/bible_vs_ecumenical_movement.html

“Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them” (Romans 16:17).

"Not only are we to hold to sound doctrine and contend for it and be on the outlook for false teaching, but we are also to separate from those who teach false doctrine. And what is the standard for judging what is true and what is false? The Bible is, and according to the Bible we can know truth from error in a dogmatic sense, and we are responsible to God for doing so."

 

[Revmitchell]

Tom thanks for the nice reply.

I really am not sure how to put this into words. We are really speaking about 2 groups.

You are speaking of the visible body, and I am speaking of the invisible body, that only Christ is able to identify. Some of us who are in that visible group are also in the invisible group.

Those in the visible group are exactly as you describe, some think tongues is for today, others do not. Some eat pork others do not.'

BUT I believe there is an invisible group within that visible group.

All within that invisible group, hear the same Lord, she knows that same voice, she has that same communion, she knows that same presence, and direction, from her beloved.

Since Jesus is not schizophrenic, he does not say something is true, and this is what it means, and then turn to another member of His body and say the total opposite.

SO I believe this invisible group is in every church across the world, some don't even go to church, some don't have a bible.

For example:
From approximately 100 ad to 1400 ad, are we to suspect that God left his church without the "Word of God" for 1300 years?

No absolutely not, unless your only definition of the word was and is "The scriptures"...

She was sustained, grew, and have abundant life, because she heard His voice. That still small voice, or audible voice, kept her communing with Him.

I will ask again are you part of the Church of Christ?

 

[plain_n_simple]

Is it not a division among those of us who claim to be Christians, if we also claim to be Presbyterian, Methodist, Lutheran, Pentecostal, or Baptist etc.

Is it not similar as saying "I am of Paul, I am of Cephas"?

Can we divide the body of Christ?

Do we even know who is truly a member of the body of Christ...Is this not something that only Christ knows. For many claim "Lord, Lord, we did such and such in your name"...And Christ says "I do not know you"...Yet they believed that they knew Christ.

I submit that the members of the spiritual body of Christ are hidden, and have been hidden since the death of the last apostle. This expression of the "LIFE" of Christ in a group of people, seen in the local, and universal church was last seen in the book of acts.

I mean is it possible, that even Billy Graham is not truly born again, or maybe you and I are not born again. Who is it that Paul admonishes to inspect themselves.

What sin then, is this "OF MEN" to proclaim "I am of this denomination, or doctrine". Can the hand separate from the foot, or the head?

What will be the consequences of this sin. How does Jesus feel about this, since we are His body, plural on this earth.

For He came the first time in a singular human body of flesh, and died. Then He sent back His selfsame Spirit to His body, this time plural, who is also called to die, not on a cross, but to self rule.

Have I missed something here. What say you?

I don't think it's a sin. But it can quench the Spirit easily.

Every denomination's original intent was to proclaim the true Gospel of Jesus Christ. Some still do, but are hampered by the denominational box.

Every denomination started by putting their methods and viewpoints on paper, and then made it legal.

That very action opens the way to comparing yourselves with others, and disqualifying each other.

Not every person becomes this way, but every denomination does it at some point and it is unavoidable.

This is why Paul taught against becoming divided in doctrine pride. The focus is taken off Jesus.

 

[rodneyo777]

as in the denomination NOOO.

as in the definition given in the NT yes.

 

[plain_n_simple]

as in the denomination NOOO.

as in the definition given in the NT yes.

I understand how you could see that

 

[Salty]

I will ask again are you part of the Church of Christ?

Sounds like a reasonable request as inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Salty]

Every denomination started by putting their methods and viewpoints on paper, and then made it legal.

Not necessiarly

That very action opens the way to comparing yourselves with others, and disqualifying each other.

Bottom line is interperation.
For example, if you were Church of Christ, and wanted to join our church, more than likely, I would baptise you - as you previous baptism was not scripitual.