Is it necessary to preach on sin & Repentance in church?

[padredurand]

I'm certain there may be some validity somewhere out there for this. But I find it interesting that when evangelist6589 broad brushes as you are doing here (what pastors do wrong/don't do right) he is wrong for it and receives your ire and you then paint christendom in an exaggerated good light.

Broad brush? I was specifically speaking of one pastor, in one church over a period of six years. That is more like a pinstripe brush but thanks for the rebuke. How, exactly, do you think I painted christendom in an exaggerated good light? It is already steeped in the Light of the world.

I'd remind you that Paul also wrote to Timothy to preach all Scripture, and that it is all profitable. Looks to me the preaching you received that rebuked had some benefit. Correct? Made you think, right? Or are you telling us it wasn't profitable? Notice also Timothy was told to reprove, rebuke, exhort. This to the church. Looks 2/3 polemic in nature to me.

Made me think? Yep. It made me think that Grace was withheld, God was persistently angry, the Holy Spirit was impotent and the message of the Cross was weaker than the Temple sacrifice. If you think that is profitable then maybe it was.

 

[prophet]

There is an ulterior motive to hanging people over Hell every week.
They can earn your favor, when they 'repent'.
Eventually, they learn the same game that the inner city bastards that I used to work with learn, to 'repent with tears' to get mamá's attention.
In between necessary displays of emotion, one just pretends to be ' sticking with' the last 'decisión'.
And soon, a total fake is in place.

 

[preacher4truth]

Broad brush? I was specifically speaking of one pastor, in one church over a period of six years. That is more like a pinstripe brush but thanks for the rebuke. How, exactly, do you think I painted christendom in an exaggerated good light? It is already steeped in the Light of the world.

Rebuke? Just noting your double standard of allowance for self, not for others bro. Now you know I don't share your all who preach do good or can't do harm philosophy.

Made me think? Yep. It made me think that Grace was withheld, God was persistently angry, the Holy Spirit was impotent and the message of the Cross was weaker than the Temple sacrifice. If you think that is profitable then maybe it was.

The Holy Spirit was impotent? But you've in the past broad brushed all preaching because Christ was preached as being wonderful, now this?

I see it as profitable. I grew up in a fire and brimstone UMC church myself. If grace was withheld it's because I didn't deserve it and needed to know this, and it caused me to beg for the mercy of God on this sinner later in life.

 

[preacher4truth]

There is an ulterior motive to hanging people over Hell every week.
They can earn your favor, when they 'repent'.
Eventually, they learn the same game that the inner city bastards that I used to work with learn, to 'repent with tears' to get mamá's attention.
In between necessary displays of emotion, one just pretends to be ' sticking with' the last 'decisión'.
And soon, a total fake is in place.

Yes, and they're is something wrong when this is all people want to hear, and they'll church hop and then blast preachers because they didn't preach on hell, repentance or whatever sugar stick they like.

 

[JamesL]

Wow..... you understand! :thumbs:

SO Few do these days :BangHead:

I've wondered, many times, if I'm the ONLY one. I am glad to know there are others

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

I'm certain there may be some validity somewhere out there for this. But I find it interesting that when evangelist6589 broad brushes as you are doing here (what pastors do wrong/don't do right) he is wrong for it and receives your ire and you then paint christendom in an exaggerated good light.

I'd remind you that Paul also wrote to Timothy to preach all Scripture, and that it is all profitable. Looks to me the preaching you received that rebuked had some benefit. Correct? Made you think, right? Or are you telling us it wasn't profitable? Notice also Timothy was told to reprove, rebuke, exhort. This to the church. Looks 2/3 polemic in nature to me.

What's a quarter worth to a rich man?

By the same token, it might mean a homeless, destitute man can afford some poor scrap of nourishment today.

It is the same with Scripture. Those who got the message of salvation and answered God's call to respond are beyond the need for hearing the message again.

What did the writer of Hebrews say?

Hebrews 5, (NASB)
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is not accustomed to the word of righteousness, for he is an infant.
14 But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.​

 

[preacher4truth]

What's a quarter worth to a rich man?

By the same token, it might mean a homeless, destitute man can afford some poor scrap of nourishment today.

It is the same with Scripture. Those who got the message of salvation and answered God's call to respond are beyond the need for hearing the message again.

Not even close. We are always preaching the Gospel. Repentance is preached to the churches as well. You need to spend more time in the Bible my friend. I've not witnessed one person walking with the Lord who held a disdain to hearing the old message again and again or likening it to the value of a quarter to a rich man. Utterly ridiculous and shameful.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Or, how about;

C. You're such a wonderful person and so utterly valuable Jesus wants to save you.

'Oh, I am so wonderful! I've always known how valuable I am! I am glad He noticed. How could He not love me when I love me so much too!'

Or..... Im giving myself to you Dear Jausus as a gift.....LOL!

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Not even close. We are always preaching the Gospel. Repentance is preached to the churches as well. You need to spend more time in the Bible my friend. I've not witnessed one person walking with the Lord who held a disdain to hearing the old message again and again or likening it to the value of a quarter to a rich man. Utterly ridiculous and shameful.

See? All you can do is make a personal attack. You can't reason out a response that would explain why you believe this to be true. I provided you with the reasoning, but it doesn't fit into that tight little box into which you've put God, faith, and ministry. Isn't it crowded in there?

Repentance is one of the most important things you’ll ever do but it’s not worth an entire sermon. Repentance means to turn from sin. Repentance means to change your mind. You can change your mind about anything, but Jesus called us to change our mind and believe the good news.

Mark 1, (NASB)
14 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God,
15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."​

Your definition of repentance will reveal whether you are living under grace or works. In the Old Testament, sinners repented by bringing a sacrifice of penance and confessing their sins (Num 5:7). But in the new we bring a sacrifice of praise and confess His name (Heb 13:15). We don’t do anything to deal with our sins for Jesus has done it all. Our part is to change our mind, believe the good news, and say, "Thank you Jesus!" If that’s not practical enough for you, then start praising Jesus who died to free us from sin and whose grace empowers us to sin no more, and not only that, but to do the works prepared beforehand for us that we, within ourselves, cannot do by ourselves. See yourself as dead to sin and alive to Christ.

Some people can't see the cross for their sin. When they say, "We preach repentance," they're really saying, "We tell people to turn from their sin." It’s sold as a "message of repentance" and it appeals to our sense of right and wrong but it’s utterly false. It’s a lie from the pit of hell designed to promote the flesh and keep you from coming to Jesus. The truth is God is holy and He won’t accept you no matter what you do. His acceptance and favor come by grace alone. Got a sin-problem? Then come boldly to the throne of grace to receive mercy and find grace. His grace is your only hope.

Now, does that mean, "Don't confront people about their sin"? Absolutely not! But the message of discipleship, sanctification as not only positional ("set apart for God") but progressive ("be holy for I am holy"), and grace is how people turn from sin.

Here's another shocker for you: Holiness is not complicated. Holiness does not require "work" to achieve. Why? Because holiness is love. Purely, simply, holiness is love. This is what was said of Zacharias and Elizabeth, the parents of John the Baptist.

Luke 2
6 They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.​

Now, what are the commandments of the Lord? As Jesus states in all three Synoptics, "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind," and "love your neighbor as yourself." And what are the requirements of the Lord?

Micah 6
8 He has told you, O man, what is good;
And what does the LORD require of you
But to do justice, to love kindness,
And to walk humbly with your God?​

This is how Zacharias and Elizabeth were righteous, how they were holy. That is how we are holy, how we live "turned away from our sins," through love. Love is not just liking other people. Love is hearing the voice of the Lord, through Scripture, through prayer, through fellowship with other believers, through sitting under a pastor who won't beat you over the head with your sin, but tell you how, through Scripture, prayer and fellowship, you will learn to love and live in holiness. It isn't just loving on people, it is loving God, and when we love God, we love His ways, His desires for us, His direction which He has revealed through Christ, through the Law which Christ delivered us from -- and the sin it describes.

If you can't deal with that, then you will never truly know freedom.

 

[preacher4truth]

See? All you can do is make a personal attack.

:laugh:

Here's my alleged 'personal attack' :

Not even close. We are always preaching the Gospel. Repentance is preached to the churches as well. You need to spend more time in the Bible my friend. I've not witnessed one person walking with the Lord who held a disdain to hearing the old message again and again or likening it to the value of a quarter to a rich man. Utterly ridiculous and shameful.

My post was reasoned and there was no personal attack, that is unless showing you your cockamamy error is a personal attack, then yes, call it that. You devalued the Gospel in an attempt to be 'right' on BB. It's THAT important to you to be right, even at its expense.

My post stands, the Gospel becomes more valuable to His sheep in time, not less as you've proposed. You should really consider stopping talking and think about what you say, and then reflect on your error of trampling the value of the Gospel to older sheep in order to serve yourself an 'attaboy' on a forum.

 

[Winman]

See? All you can do is make a personal attack. You can't reason out a response that would explain why you believe this to be true. I provided you with the reasoning, but it doesn't fit into that tight little box into which you've put God, faith, and ministry. Isn't it crowded in there?

Repentance is one of the most important things you’ll ever do but it’s not worth an entire sermon. Repentance means to turn from sin. Repentance means to change your mind. You can change your mind about anything, but Jesus called us to change our mind and believe the good news.

Mark 1, (NASB)
14 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God,
15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."​

Your definition of repentance will reveal whether you are living under grace or works. In the Old Testament, sinners repented by bringing a sacrifice of penance and confessing their sins (Num 5:7). But in the new we bring a sacrifice of praise and confess His name (Heb 13:15). We don’t do anything to deal with our sins for Jesus has done it all. Our part is to change our mind, believe the good news, and say, "Thank you Jesus!" If that’s not practical enough for you, then start praising Jesus who died to free us from sin and whose grace empowers us to sin no more, and not only that, but to do the works prepared beforehand for us that we, within ourselves, cannot do by ourselves. See yourself as dead to sin and alive to Christ.

Some people can't see the cross for their sin. When they say, "We preach repentance," they're really saying, "We tell people to turn from their sin." It’s sold as a "message of repentance" and it appeals to our sense of right and wrong but it’s utterly false. It’s a lie from the pit of hell designed to promote the flesh and keep you from coming to Jesus. The truth is God is holy and He won’t accept you no matter what you do. His acceptance and favor come by grace alone. Got a sin-problem? Then come boldly to the throne of grace to receive mercy and find grace. His grace is your only hope.

Now, does that mean, "Don't confront people about their sin"? Absolutely not! But the message of discipleship, sanctification as not only positional ("set apart for God") but progressive ("be holy for I am holy"), and grace is how people turn from sin.

Here's another shocker for you: Holiness is not complicated. Holiness does not require "work" to achieve. Why? Because holiness is love. Purely, simply, holiness is love. This is what was said of Zacharias and Elizabeth, the parents of John the Baptist.

Luke 2
6 They were both righteous in the sight of God, walking blamelessly in all the commandments and requirements of the Lord.​

Now, what are the commandments of the Lord? As Jesus states in all three Synoptics, "Love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and all your mind," and "love your neighbor as yourself." And what are the requirements of the Lord?

Micah 6
8 He has told you, O man, what is good;
And what does the LORD require of you
But to do justice, to love kindness,
And to walk humbly with your God?​

This is how Zacharias and Elizabeth were righteous, how they were holy. That is how we are holy, how we live "turned away from our sins," through love. Love is not just liking other people. Love is hearing the voice of the Lord, through Scripture, through prayer, through fellowship with other believers, through sitting under a pastor who won't beat you over the head with your sin, but tell you how, through Scripture, prayer and fellowship, you will learn to love and live in holiness. It isn't just loving on people, it is loving God, and when we love God, we love His ways, His desires for us, His direction which He has revealed through Christ, through the Law which Christ delivered us from -- and the sin it describes.

If you can't deal with that, then you will never truly know freedom.

Amen Brother!!

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

My post was reasoned and there was no personal attack, that is unless showing you your cockamamy error is a personal attack, then yes, call it that. You devalued the Gospel in an attempt to be 'right' on BB. It's THAT important to you to be right, even at its expense.

My post stands, the Gospel becomes more valuable to His sheep in time, not less as you've proposed. You should really consider stopping talking and think about what you say, and then reflect on your error of trampling the value of the Gospel to older sheep in order to serve yourself an 'attaboy' on a forum.

There's a great difference in calling a viewpoint "cockamamy error" and actually showing it to be so. Care to take a crack at that? Take my post point by point and show me how I am wrong? Go ahead, I truly can't wait to see it, because you who constantly harp on the Doctrine of Grace would have to attack that very doctrine in order to refute my post.

Or are you just going to call my view "cockamamy error" and wait for your "attaboys" from the others on here who cling to legalistic doctrines and preach sin instead of grace?

 

[Revmitchell]

There's a great difference in calling a viewpoint "cockamamy error" and actually showing it to be so. Care to take a crack at that? Take my post point by point and show me how I am wrong? Or are you just going to call my view "cockamamy error" and wait for your "attaboys" from the others on here who cling to legalistic doctrines and preach sin instead of grace?

If you keep responding to that thing that is the only type of response you will get.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

If you keep responding to that thing that is the only type of response you will get.

Very true. But I wanted to take one last shot at it, in order to show that many of those on here who constantly harp on the Doctrine of Grace don't even understand grace on its whole, because once they get past the salvation piece, they abandon grace for legalism.

I'll stop now. Thanks for the slap upside the head. :laugh: :thumbsup:

 

[preacher4truth]

If you keep responding to that thing that is the only type of response you will get.

Still sowing discord and name calling. No wonder someone else said 'don't hold your breath' in one of your threads. He's correct. :thumbs:

 

[InTheLight]

If you keep responding to that thing that is the only type of response you will get.

Killfile him.